The 10 Commandments and the Law of Moses

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,660
308
83
#61
“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead. For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me. Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful. For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:7-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

thats bondage not liberty liberty means freedom the gospel sets people free the law cannot and doesn’t

The idea brother is if you teach people how to properly love and treat other people the right way , you don’t have to teach them not to kill each other and lie to each other and steal from one another

“ Don’t kill “ “ don’t lie “ “ dont steal “ don’t commit adultery “ that’s what you tell bound sinners who have no Holy Spirit or remission of sin it’s what you tell these folks

“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers ( thou shalt not kill ) of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, ( shalt not covet commit adultery ) for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, ( do not lie ) for perjured persons, ( do not bear false witness ) and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭1:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law isn’t made for a born again person the gospel is the law of liberty not the law of Moses it’s bondage

Thou shalt not kill shouldn’t be what we need to hear the things Jesus taught will set us free and give us life though

“For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:22, 24-25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If we follow Jesus we won’t lie cheat and steal and kill and worship false gods ect he teaches us the right things to do not the wrong things not to do like Paul’s explaining didn’t work becaue of the sin within mans mind and heart

“Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence.”

Because man is sinful inside the law that’s telling us good “ not killing is good “ but because we aren’t good it provokes us at some point covetousness lust deception deceit violence idols ect

the law is good we aren’t and it doesn’t compensate for that we have to let go of the old doctrine and embrace the new

“For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held;

that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We need the law of the spirit of life not the ministration of death if one follows Jesus words they do t even need to hear about not killing and worshipping other gods ect ….
A couple things . . .

Scripture says the Ten Commandments is the law of liberty

James 2:10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. 11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder. Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty. You find the “rest of the He who said” and His commandments breaking one we break them all in Exo 20

Sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4 Romans 7:7 and why the Ten Commandments is called the law of liberty because through Jesus we can overcome the bondage of sin and be free in Him to keep His commandments John 14:15-18 which leads to peace and righteousness Isa 48:18 and reconciliation Rev 14:12

The law is for the sinner and unrighteous and all of us are unrighteous Romans 3:9 and all sinned Romans 3:23 so how does someone who is unrighteousness become righteous? Only through Jesus. If we say we are righteous, then we have no need for Jesus and have a heart that can’t be changed by Him, if we know we are unrighteous and know we need Jesus He can work on our heart and change us so we can be freed of the bondage of sin and can stand in His Glory when He comes
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#62
I think this sums up the law By God

Proverbs 10:14-24



14 The wise don't tell everything they know, but the foolish talk too much and are ruined.
15 Having lots of money protects the rich, but having no money destroys the poor.
16 Good people are rewarded with life, but evil people are paid with punishment.
17 Whoever accepts correction is on the way to life, but whoever ignores correction will lead others away from life.
18 Whoever hides hate is a liar. Whoever tells lies is a fool.
19 If you talk a lot, you are sure to sin; if you are wise, you will keep quiet.
20 The words of a good person are like pure silver, but an evil person's thoughts are worth very little.
21 Good people's words will help many others, but fools will die because they don't have wisdom.
22 The Lord's blessing brings wealth, and no sorrow comes with it.
23 A foolish person enjoys doing wrong, but a person with understanding enjoys doing what is wise.
24 Evil people will get what they fear most, but good people will get what they want most.


You could say this is also about obeying Gods commandments 😊

But what I would say is, there will be those who use love to get what they want
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
#63
I think this sums up the law By God

Proverbs 10:14-24



14 The wise don't tell everything they know, but the foolish talk too much and are ruined.
15 Having lots of money protects the rich, but having no money destroys the poor.
16 Good people are rewarded with life, but evil people are paid with punishment.
17 Whoever accepts correction is on the way to life, but whoever ignores correction will lead others away from life.
18 Whoever hides hate is a liar. Whoever tells lies is a fool.
19 If you talk a lot, you are sure to sin; if you are wise, you will keep quiet.
20 The words of a good person are like pure silver, but an evil person's thoughts are worth very little.
21 Good people's words will help many others, but fools will die because they don't have wisdom.
22 The Lord's blessing brings wealth, and no sorrow comes with it.
23 A foolish person enjoys doing wrong, but a person with understanding enjoys doing what is wise.
24 Evil people will get what they fear most, but good people will get what they want most.


You could say this is also about obeying Gods commandments 😊

But what I would say is, there will be those who use love to get what they want
How is it love then? Love seeks not its own...1 Corinthians 13:5.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#64
How is it love then? Love seeks not its own...1 Corinthians 13:5.
well if you use love to get what you want, it would be called hiding hate.

Gods word clearly says people hide hate.

Theres even those people who say they love but drive people to suicide.

Then there's those people who twist scripture with there love for themselves.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
#65
well if you use love to get what you want, it would be called hiding hate.

Gods word clearly says people hide hate.

Theres even those people who say they love but drive people to suicide.

Then there's those people who twist scripture with there love for themselves.
I agree all those things happen. But none of those things fit the definition of biblical love.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#66
I agree all those things happen. But none of those things fit the definition of biblical love.
Yes it's nice to be lovey dovey.

But true love follows the lord and encourages His commandments.

True love accepts correctness.

John 14:15-31 GNT“If you love me, you will obey my commandments.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#67
This is a real big commandment

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
#68
Yes it's nice to be lovey dovey.

But true love follows the lord and encourages His commandments.

True love accepts correctness.

John 14:15-31 GNT“If you love me, you will obey my commandments.
Sure. But if it's a commandment, it cannot be of grace. By works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#69
Sure. But if it's a commandment, it cannot be of grace. By works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
repenting and being baptised in the name of Jesus christ, and receiving a gift of the holy spirit, in my opinion could not get any more justified.

Romans 3:28 For we hold that one is justified by faith
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
#70
This is a real big commandment

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost
There's alot of confusion because most don't understand there is a difference between being baptized by the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit. One is experiential, and the other is not. One places the believer into Christ. The other is a seal and sign of God to the believer that he or she indeed belongs to Christ. The first is mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12:13. The latter is mentioned in Ephesians 1:13.
What is spoken of in Ephesians 1:13 is what is witnessed throughout the book of Acts.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#71
There's alot of confusion because most don't understand there is a difference between being baptized by the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit. One is experiential, and the other is not. One places the believer into Christ. The other is a seal and sign of God to the believer that he or she indeed belongs to Christ. The first is mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12:13. The latter is mentioned in Ephesians 1:13.
What is spoken of in Ephesians 1:13 is what is witnessed throughout the book of Acts.
There's only confusion because people want to believe all they have to do is believe.

Jesus says practice what you preach, another great commandment.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#72
There's alot of confusion because most don't understand there is a difference between being baptized by the Spirit and being baptized with the Spirit. One is experiential, and the other is not. One places the believer into Christ. The other is a seal and sign of God to the believer that he or she indeed belongs to Christ. The first is mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12:13. The latter is mentioned in Ephesians 1:13.
What is spoken of in Ephesians 1:13 is what is witnessed throughout the book of Acts.
Scripture about baptism are set in different times by different people for different reasons,

And baptism given to different people in different points of there walks.

The confussion stops when you listen to Jesus

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost

You can't say this unless you have confessed Jesus Christ is lord first, and believed he died for your sins and rose from the grave.

so the fact you have to believe that first means you have to be baptised next.

that's the confusion sorted out
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
#73
Scripture about baptism are set in different times by different people for different reasons,

And baptism given to different people in different points of there walks.

The confussion stops when you listen to Jesus

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost

You can't say this unless you have confessed Jesus Christ is lord first, and believed he died for your sins and rose from the grave.

so the fact you have to believe that first means you have to be baptised next.

that's the confusion sorted out
Do you know what the verse before Acts 2:38 says?
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#74
Do you know what the verse before Acts 2:38 says?
I've been through every verse under the sun with many people, and reasonably knowledgeable people, and they all point to The main verse about being baptised and why you should.

Even well educated pastors in the UK,

True Welsh Giants for the lord.

Just Christian people, who have devoted there whole lifes to the lord.

They Point to the scripture that is as clear as interpretation can be above all interpretations.

Which is repent and be baptised in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. And receive a Gift of the holy spirit.

Theres no need to go back and forth, my good friend.

I do care about you and I'm not preaching.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,661
5,908
113
#75
A couple things . . .

Scripture says the Ten Commandments is the law of liberty

James 2:10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. 11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder. Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty. You find the “rest of the He who said” and His commandments breaking one we break them all in Exo 20

Sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4 Romans 7:7 and why the Ten Commandments is called the law of liberty because through Jesus we can overcome the bondage of sin and be free in Him to keep His commandments John 14:15-18 which leads to peace and righteousness Isa 48:18 and reconciliation Rev 14:12

The law is for the sinner and unrighteous and all of us are unrighteous Romans 3:9 and all sinned Romans 3:23 so how does someone who is unrighteousness become righteous? Only through Jesus. If we say we are righteous, then we have no need for Jesus and have a heart that can’t be changed by Him, if we know we are unrighteous and know we need Jesus He can work on our heart and change us so we can be freed of the bondage of sin and can stand in His Glory when He comes
Scripture says the Ten Commandments is the law of liberty

it actually doesn’t say that at all it’s showing a contrast between the law and gospel he specifically identifies the law of liberty

“So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty. For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
‭‭James‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

What he’s talking about is what Jesus taught believers

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged:

condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned:

forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Teach a person to love right like Jesus taught us and then no one will be killing , commiting adultery , lying and veering false witness or worshipping false gods

if you take a chicks and teach them , it sounds different than if your teaching an inmate in a prison

Those tablets of stone were made because thier hearts were hard the gospel is meant to be written on the heart

Telling people ten rules of what not to do is t freedom or liberty it is a restraint upon sinful people under threat of death

“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20:10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If you teach a person to honor thier matriage that part can be totally avoided it’s meant for adulterous folk

“Teach me what to do , and I won’t be doing what I’m not supposed to do because it’s contrary to what you taught me “

if you teach me “ speak the truth in love “ and I accept that as your word “ dont lie “ becomes irrelevant it’s for a liar

“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭1:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the secret is we don’t worship God by ten Thou shalt nots we can know Christ now and follow him by the law he promised to give himself when he came

Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people. My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭51:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law was always temporary until the law giver of Judah came see genesis 49

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till the seed should come ( jesus ) to whom the promise was made;

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20, 23-25‬ ‭

The law wasn’t from the beginning it was added because men became sinners we started killing so the law came and said thou shalt not kill it’s sin.

the law? It was added because of transgressions,

It came after men became sinful and was meant to last until Jesus came with salvation

“The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


it was ordained of angels and mediated by Moses not jesus it was purchasers with the blood of bulls and goats not Christs blood it was given inder levites not melchezidek ect ect ect it’s a copy and pattern

awe don’t worship God by stone tablets that no longer exist on earth we worship him by faith in Christ it has nothing to do with the tables Moses was given that was how they worshipped without having Christs atonement , his spirit , forgivness of sin ect

itnis an entirely different system of worship different law given under a different preisthood different people different sacrifice different mediator different temple different promised land ect

If we just hear what Jesus was saying lol killing each other won’t be an issue anymore hahaha
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#76
Scripture says the Ten Commandments is the law of liberty

it actually doesn’t say that at all it’s showing a contrast between the law and gospel he specifically identifies the law of liberty

“So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty. For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
‭‭James‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

What he’s talking about is what Jesus taught believers

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged:

condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned:

forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Teach a person to love right like Jesus taught us and then no one will be killing , commiting adultery , lying and veering false witness or worshipping false gods

if you take a chicks and teach them , it sounds different than if your teaching an inmate in a prison

Those tablets of stone were made because thier hearts were hard the gospel is meant to be written on the heart

Telling people ten rules of what not to do is t freedom or liberty it is a restraint upon sinful people under threat of death

“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20:10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If you teach a person to honor thier matriage that part can be totally avoided it’s meant for adulterous folk

“Teach me what to do , and I won’t be doing what I’m not supposed to do because it’s contrary to what you taught me “

if you teach me “ speak the truth in love “ and I accept that as your word “ dont lie “ becomes irrelevant it’s for a liar

“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭1:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the secret is we don’t worship God by ten Thou shalt nots we can know Christ now and follow him by the law he promised to give himself when he came

Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people. My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭51:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law was always temporary until the law giver of Judah came see genesis 49

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till the seed should come ( jesus ) to whom the promise was made;

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20, 23-25‬ ‭

The law wasn’t from the beginning it was added because men became sinners we started killing so the law came and said thou shalt not kill it’s sin.

the law? It was added because of transgressions,

It came after men became sinful and was meant to last until Jesus came with salvation

“The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


it was ordained of angels and mediated by Moses not jesus it was purchasers with the blood of bulls and goats not Christs blood it was given inder levites not melchezidek ect ect ect it’s a copy and pattern

awe don’t worship God by stone tablets that no longer exist on earth we worship him by faith in Christ it has nothing to do with the tables Moses was given that was how they worshipped without having Christs atonement , his spirit , forgivness of sin ect

itnis an entirely different system of worship different law given under a different preisthood different people different sacrifice different mediator different temple different promised land ect

If we just hear what Jesus was saying lol killing each other won’t be an issue anymore hahaha
you can't mix different Judgements made a different times for different reasons to suit a narrative for one opinion, sorry but that is a wrong judgement call.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
#77
The word of God is not some joke and needs to be taken seriously

The whole of James 2 should be read when it comes to Judgements
James 2

Favoritism Forbidden
2 My brothers and sisters, believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ must not show favoritism. 2 Suppose a man comes into your meeting wearing a gold ring and fine clothes, and a poor man in filthy old clothes also comes in. 3 If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, “Here’s a good seat for you,” but say to the poor man, “You stand there” or “Sit on the floor by my feet,” 4 have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts?
5 Listen, my dear brothers and sisters: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him? 6 But you have dishonored the poor. Is it not the rich who are exploiting you? Are they not the ones who are dragging you into court? 7 Are they not the ones who are blaspheming the noble name of him to whom you belong?
8 If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,”[a] you are doing right. 9 But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11 For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,”[b] also said, “You shall not murder.”[c] If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.
12 Speak and act as those who are going to be judged by the law that gives freedom, 13 because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment.
Faith and Deeds
14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? 15 Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? 17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. 19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[d]? 21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23 And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,”[e] and he was called God’s friend. 24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26 As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,660
308
83
#78
The Gospel of Grace

Its a popular teaching that God's grace is not related to our obedience to God's commandments, but its the very heart of the matter!

We are separated by God from sin Isa 59:2 Sin is the transgression (breaking) God's law 1 John 3:4 Romans 7:7. The penalty for breaking God's law is death Romans 6:23. Jesus took that death penalty for us because all has sinned and come short of His Glory Romans 3:23 so we are living in Grace because we deserve death for sinning and breaking God's law. God's grace is a free gift that He gives (or not) but how we receive it is not to be separated from God. Sin separates us so those who live in sin which is breaking God's law are not living in Christ. Rom 8:4-8 Those living in Christ understand how much sin hurts Him so if we stumble and fall, we should immediately get on our knees and repentant of our sins and He is faithful to forgive and cleanse us of all unrighteousness and once He heals us- He says go and sin no more. John 8:11 This is living in grace. Not being separated by God and having Him live in us. If we are hostile to God's law its really not a good sign Rom 8:7-8 not all is lost yet, but that path is not the direction we want to go. Romans 6:16

Paul goes into detail about this very thing...


Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, 6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be [a]done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been [b]freed from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, 9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. 10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. 11 Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. 13 And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! 16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? 17 But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were [e]delivered. 18 And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. 19 I speak in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh. For just as you presented your members as slaves of uncleanness, and of lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves of righteousness [f]for holiness.

20 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. 21 What fruit did you have then in the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. 22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit [g]to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.


How do we receive righteousness? Only though Jesus. Jesus is the only righteous one which is why our relationship with Him is so important. He not only died for our sins, He lived to be our example to follow. 1 John 2:6 Jesus showed us the righteous way of living. John 15:10 Jesus was never disobedient to God's law-there was no sin found in Him 1 Peter 21;22 Heb 4:15 He lived it out and showed us how to keep it so we are not depending on our righteousness, but His Psa 119:172. If we are in Him, we are keeping His commandments through faith and love and His Spirit John 14:15-18. It really is the heart of the matter.
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,660
308
83
#79
What will you do on the day of judgment will you say you were not aware you have to follow the commandments given by GOD?

I Never Knew You
mat 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

I hope one day, the lord will open your heart, As of now I have you on ignore since you are hostile towards me and the words of the lord.
Yes, there are many scriptures that correlate with Jesus knowing us and our obedience to Him. Jesus knows everyone, but it speaks of the relationship we are to have with Him. If Jesus lives in us, we would be keeping His commandments and therefore He knows us because He lives in us. John 14:15-18 Paul speaks of the lost who are hostile to God's law and therefore cannot subject themselves to keeping it. Rom 8:7-8

Jesus taught about this very thing quoting directly from the Ten Commandments. He relates when one follows their own rules/traditions over obeying the commandment of God is the blind leading the blind and both teacher and student both fall in a ditch (off the narrow path). He also says when we do this our hearts are far from Him, which is the opposite of the New Covenant- God's law in our hearts. Heb 8:10

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father or mother.’ Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”

10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

God's law is perfect for converting the soul. We need to come to the Truth about His holy law as all of His commandments are Truth Psa 119:151 and it would be impossible for God to make a mistake on something He personally wrote and personally spoke. We make mistakes, not God.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,747
609
113
#80
Then there is this idea of what Lows are written on our hearts --- --which which are not the 10 Commandments ---



Which Law did God write on our hearts?
https://itisfinished.blog/2017/07/05/which-law-did-god-write​-on-our-hearts/


I do know quite a few people who believe that the law God has written on our new hearts as believers is the Old Covenant Law, making it easier to walk out. Why would God write the Mosaic Law on our hearts? All that the Law did was arouse sinful passions (Romans 7:5). Also, Romans 7:4 says that we died to the Law through Christ and we are now married to Him. So, if it’s not the Mosaic Law on our hearts. Which law did He write? According to Hebrews 10:16 He wrote laws (plural) on our hearts and our minds. I’ve found 4 different laws mentioned in the New Testament.

The Law of Love
Under the Mosaic Law, love was commanded in order to receive the blessings of long life, many children and for life to go well for you. Failure to obey this command of love would obviously result in not attaining those things. Deuteronomy 6:5 “Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength.” This is impossible to fulfill in ourselves! No one can love God with ALL of our heart, soul, mind, and strength. We try… we give it our best shot… but that is an impossibility in and of ourselves. But of course that was the purpose of the Old Covenant laws… they were meant to point us to Christ. To awaken in us the revelation that we in our selves… in our flesh… we cannot walk out or obey these laws… we need a Savior.
Under the new covenant of grace, Love is given to you. Out of Christ’s measureless love, we are now able to love others. It’s out of the overflow of His Love in us. It’s not something we have to work up in ourselves towards others or even towards God. Romans 5:5 tells us God’s love has been poured out into our hearts through the Holy Spirit, who has been given to us. God abundantly poured His love into our hearts by giving us the Holy Spirit, … the Spirit of Grace. Jesus said, “As I have loved you” – it’s out of His love that is in us that we are able to love. Do you see the difference between the old and new? Under the old, you loved others because you feared punishment…. you feared not receiving His blessings, His promises. But under the new, you love because the Lover lives in you and His nature is Love. He can’t be anything else. It’s not just an adjective that describes Him, it is who He is (1 Jn 4:8)

The law of the Spirit of life
The Old Covenant was a written code no one could keep (except Jesus) and the New Covenant is Christ Himself living in you. Paul told us in Romans 7:24 that trying to keep the Old Law makes you frustrated and miserable… “O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?” Notice he didn’t say what will rescue me but rather Who… Who will rescue me? And the answer was….Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Rom 7:24-25a). The old law is a what but the new law is a Who. The old law ministers condemnation and death (2 Cor 3:7-9), but the new law of the Spirit gives life (Rom 8:2). The letter kills, but the Spirit gives life (2 Cor 3:6) So Who gives life… Who rescued from the frustration of trying to keep the Law? The Spirit of Christ within you.

The perfect law of liberty
James wrote that “the perfect law gives freedom” (James 1:25). In contrast, Romans 7:6 tells us that the law of Moses binds. What is the perfect law that gives freedom?
It’s Jesus, the living Word who set us free. The perfect law of liberty describes what Jesus has done (perfectly fulfilled or completed the law) and the fruit He will bear in our lives (liberty) if we trust him.
But whoever looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues in it – not forgetting what they have heard, but doing it – they will be blessed in what they do. (James 1:25)
Look into the mirror of Moses’ law and you will be miserable, for it exposes all your faults… your weaknesses in serving God in the flesh. It is like putting a veil over your eyes and you are unable to see that Jesus fulfilled it all not just for you… but as you! Looking into the perfect law, which is Jesus, blesses you because it reveals his righteousness.
But it also says “Don’t just listen but do what it (the perfect law of liberty) says” (James 1:22). In other words, allow the Spirit of Christ to convince you that in Him you are righteous and holy. Don’t walk away from the perfect law and forget who you are in Christ. Fix your eyes on Jesus. Look intently with an unveiled face and be transformed into his likeness.

Law of faith
Romans 3:27 says Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith. God is a faith God. Without faith, it’s impossible to please God (Heb. 11:6), so our relationship with the Lord is dependent on it. Faith is what brings the things God has provided for us from the spiritual realm into the physical realm (Heb. 11:1). Our faith is the victory that enables us to overcome the world (1 John 5:4). Everything the Lord does for us is accessed through faith.
And He has given to us His faith…. Galatians 2:20 says “I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.” We live our lives by His faith. Paul did not say that he lived by faith IN the Son of God but by the faith OF the Son of God. The measure of faith that Paul had was the same measure that Jesus had. It was Jesus’ faith. If there is only one measure of faith (Rom. 12:3), then we also have the faith of Jesus.
We don’t have to wonder if we have enough faith for something… or try to work up our faith. He gives us His faith to live by. How do we access this faith? Romans 10:17 says, “So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.” We access God’s faith through His Word. When we hear God’s Word, the Holy Spirit empowers it, and if we receive the truth, God’s supernatural faith enters us.
Galatians 5:22-23 tells us that faith is a fruit of the Spirit. Faith becomes a permanent part of our born-again spirits. There is no lack of faith within any true Christian. There is just a lack of knowing and using what God has already given us. Philemon 1:6 says, “hat the communication of thy faith may become effectual by the acknowledging of every good thing which is in you in Christ Jesus.” Notice that Paul isn’t praying that Philemon will get something more from the Lord. He was praying that his faith would begin to work as he acknowledged what he already had. The word “acknowledge” means, “to admit, recognize, or report the receipt of.” You can only acknowledge something that you already have. We already have the faith of God, and it will begin to work when we acknowledge this.
Why would we want the Old Covenant Law written on our hearts? It is a ministry of death and condemnation.

The New Covenant of grace and it’s laws that are written on our hearts is a ministry of life. The Spirit of Life abides in us and teaches us all things. He transforms us into the image of the Son. The Old Mosaic Law was made obsolete…. Hebrews 8:13 When God speaks of a “new” covenant, it means he has made the first one obsolete. Colossians 2:14 tells us that it was nailed to the Cross. Ephesians 2:15 tells us that in His incarnation, He rendered the entire Jewish system of laws and regulations useless as a measure to justify human life and conduct. Hebrews 8:7 says that if there had been nothing wrong with the first covenant there would’ve been no need for a second covenant to replace it.
We don’t need the Old Covenant Law to show us how to live holy lives. First of all, we have already been made holy — 1 Corinthians 1:30 God has united you with Christ Jesus. For our benefit God made him to be wisdom itself. Christ made us right with God; he made us pure and holy, and he freed us from sin. In Christ, we are righteous, holy and free from sin! That’s good news! Second of all, Titus 2:11-12 says that grace, not Law is what we need to teach us how to live holy — For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age. Now that Jesus has come, we no longer need the supervision of the law. So begin today to live a grace-filled life… standing fast in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, not becoming entangled again with a yoke of bondage to the Law and it’s commandments. (Galatians 5:1).
Robin