Water Baptism-What is in a Name?

[CS1]

And?

Jesus goes on to say: "And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, KEEP THROUGH THINE OWN NAME those whom thou hast given me, THAT THEY MAY BE ONE, AS WE ARE." John 17:11

That doesn't mean removing it. The Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God, and Jesus our Lord is God. You do not fully comprehend the full Nature of God; NO one can. It is pride that tries to think otherwise. Jesus never said He was the only one in context to the Eternal Godhead.

In relationship to water baptism, Jesus said Beilef, in HIM save you. Jesus never said water baptism saves. If one teaches that Baptism in the Name of The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is not valid or Baptism in Jesus' name is the only right way have a serious error.

And are causing people to stumble.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

That doesn't mean removing it. The Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God, and Jesus our Lord is God. You do not fully comprehend the full Nature of God; NO one can. It is pride that tries to think otherwise. Jesus never said He was the only one in context to the Eternal Godhead.

In relationship to water baptism, Jesus said Beilef, in HIM save you. Jesus never said water baptism saves. If one teaches that Baptism in the Name of The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is not valid or Baptism in Jesus' name is the only right way have a serious error.

And are causing people to stumble.

nope the stumbling block is not accepting water baptism as part of the full submission of Christ.

But that would be not causing you to stumble. That would be asking you not to stumble. 😊

 

[CS1]

nope the stumbling block is not accepting water baptism as part of the full submission of Christ.

But that would be not causing you to stumble. That would be asking you not to stumble. 😊

LOL


That is a narrative is untruth.

1. No one has said not to be water-baptized in obedience to Christ. And it was stated many posts ago.
2. I very clearly said what is stumbling to people
"If one teaches that Baptism in the Name of The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is not valid or Baptism in Jesus' name is the only right way have a serious error."

"And are causing people to stumble."

You are very dishonest or have a memory issue. Either way you continue to use false narrative of what other have said

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

LOL


That is a narrative is untruth.

1. No one has said not to be water-baptized in obedience to Christ. And it was stated many posts ago.
2. I very clearly said what is stumbling to people
"If one teaches that Baptism in the Name of The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is not valid or Baptism in Jesus' name is the only right way have a serious error."

"And are causing people to stumble."

You are very dishonest or have a memory issue. Either way you continue to use false narrative of what other have said

here we go again, you already said water baptism does not save you, when clearly it is a part of being saved.

When you suggest things like this, it takes away from scripture,

Further more i have illustrated that being baptised in Jesus Christ name is sufficient,

And that even Just being baptised into water by the holy spirit is authority enough.

Further more wasnic has already stated this to

So to answer your other question, being dishonest has nothing to do with it.

 

[CS1]

here we go again, you already said water baptism does not save you, when clearly it is a part of being saved.

When you suggest things like this, it takes away from scripture,

Further more i have illustrated that being baptised in Jesus Christ name is sufficient,

And that even Just being baptised into water by the holy spirit is authority enough.

Further more wasnic has already stated this to

So to answer your other question, being dishonest has nothing to do with it.

That is right, Water baptism doesn't save you, Nor does the Bible teach that.

Yes, being baptized in Jesus' name is a valid baptism, as is in The name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

And yes, my answer has as much to do with it as your does,

 

[Wansvic]

That doesn't mean removing it. The Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God, and Jesus our Lord is God. You do not fully comprehend the full Nature of God; NO one can. It is pride that tries to think otherwise. Jesus never said He was the only one in context to the Eternal Godhead.

In relationship to water baptism, Jesus said Beilef, in HIM save you. Jesus never said water baptism saves. If one teaches that Baptism in the Name of The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is not valid or Baptism in Jesus' name is the only right way have a serious error.

And are causing people to stumble.

Sadly, many refuse to accept scripture as written. And many fail to dig into the historical records such as church encyclopedias, etc. that reveal that a change did indeed take place around 325 A.D. I for one want to inform people of these truths so they can make an informed decision on how they want to be baptized. Otherwise, I am guilty and carry some responsibility for keeping those people in the dark.

What is recorded in the word is there to lead us to the truth. There is significance in using the name of Jesus in water baptism as confirmed by Jesus' own apostles. They never baptized anyone using the phrase, "in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost."

As I am sure you know, the word of God says that every word will be established by 2-3 witnesses. (Matt. 18:16, 2 Cor. 13:1) There are more than 2-3 accounts of the apostles water baptizing people in the name of the Lord Jesus. They never wavered. (Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

That is right, Water baptism doesn't save you, Nor does the Bible teach that.

Yes, being baptized in Jesus' name is a valid baptism, as is in The name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

And yes, my answer has as much to do with it as your does,

scripture does not save you, would be more fitting I believe.

As someone elses walk is not your walk.

And scripture is mainly about how you can become saved, but still you have to be saved.

I just want to ask you one simple question


Do you believe water baptism is a a part of becoming saved, this is all I want to know.

 

[CS1]

Sadly, many refuse to accept scripture as written. And many fail to dig into the historical records such as church encyclopedias, etc. that reveal that a change did indeed take place around 325 A.D. I for one want to inform people of these truths so they can make an informed decision on how they want to be baptized. Otherwise, I am guilty and carry some responsibility for keeping those people in the dark.

What is recorded in the word is there to lead us to the truth. There is significance in using the name of Jesus in water baptism as confirmed by Jesus' own apostles. They never baptized anyone using the phrase, "in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost."

As I am sure you know, the word of God says that every word will be established by 2-3 witnesses. (Matt. 18:16, 2 Cor. 13:1) There are more than 2-3 accounts of the apostles water baptizing people in the name of the Lord Jesus. They never wavered. (Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)

Sadly, many have issues with the Writers of the bible who have recorded what Jesus said:

"Go and make disciples, Baptizing them in the name of The Father , the Son, and the Holy Spirit." And try to use a narrative to discredit the word of God. And when Jesus is speaking, HIS word is established when HE said it. Therefore, when it says

that every word will be established by 2-3 witnesses. (Matt. 18:16, 2 Cor. 13:1)

That contextually is man, Not the Lord Jesus, who is the Supreme AUTHORITY because he is GOD.

 

[CS1]

scripture does not save you, would be more fitting I believe.

As someone elses walk is not your walk.

And scripture is mainly about how you can become saved, but still you have to be saved.

I just want to ask you one simple question


Do you believe water baptism is a part of becoming saved? This is all I want to know.

The word of God is said in Rom chapter 6, and in the all gospel. Water baptism is known as the baptism of John, Not of Jesus.

In addition, no one in the Book of Acts was baptized who was not saved before in water. No one was baptized in the Holy Spirit, also known as Empowering of the Holy Spirit seen in the Book of Acts, as Jesus said in chapter one, verse eight.


To answer your question without a weak attempt to trap a person. The answer is no. Water Baptism is not a part of salvation. It is an act done by those who are saved in Obedience to Christ, whom they have confessed to be Lord and Savior.

You would never or should never baptize one in water until they have been saved.

Or one whom the Holy Spirit has not yet REPROVED of sin. John 16:8

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

The word of God is said in Rom chapter 6, and in the all gospel. Water baptism is known as the baptism of John, Not of Jesus.

In addition, no one in the Book of Acts was baptized who was not saved before in water. No one was baptized in the Holy Spirit, also known as Empowering of the Holy Spirit seen in the Book of Acts, as Jesus said in chapter one, verse eight.


To answer your question without a weak attempt to trap a person. The answer is no. Water Baptism is not a part of salvation. It is an act done by those who are saved in Obedience to Christ, whom they have confessed to be Lord and Savior.

You would never or should never baptize one in water until they have been saved.

Or one whom the Holy Spirit has not yet REPROVED of sin. John 16:8

Well you must be saying those who where baptised in water in acts 19 and then spoke in tongues, means very little then.

 

[CS1]

Well you must be saying those who where baptised in water in acts 19 and then spoke in tongues, means very little then.

They were saved before the Holy Spirit came upon them. FYI, The Holy Spirit comes to live in you and comes upon you.

We see that throughout the Old Testament. Jesus, in John chapters 14 - 16, teaches this too.

John 14:15-17

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.


Jesus said that

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

They were saved before the Holy Spirit came upon them. FYI, The Holy Spirit comes to live in you and comes upon you.

We see that throughout the Old Testament. Jesus, in John chapters 14 - 16, teaches this too.

John 14:15-17

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.


Jesus said that

Acts 19

It says they had not heard of the Holy Spirit

Then Paul baptised them and then they spoke in tongues.

Are you sayin this should not have been allowed, and neither did anything happen after baptism.


Paul in Ephesus
19 While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2 and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when[a] you believed?”

They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”

3 So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?”

“John’s baptism,” they replied.

4 Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

 

[CS1]

Acts 19

It says they had not heard of the Holy Spirit

Then Paul baptised them and then they spoke in tongues.

Are you sayin this should not have been allowed, and neither did anything happen after baptism.


Paul in Ephesus
19 While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2 and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when[a] you believed?”

They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”

3 So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?”

“John’s baptism,” they replied.

4 Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

Did I say that>?

No.

Let's see what Paul actually said in Acts 19 that you may have overlooked.

1 And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples 2, he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”


"Believed" in Greek is pisteuō, Meaning to Paul's qestion: to trust in Jesus or God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: saving faith.


So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.”
3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”
So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”
4 Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied.



This has nothing to do with water Baptism. To trying to say Baptism in the name of Jesus was done in water, that is assumed.

It says they received the Holy Spirit Upon them. As Jesus said would happen in Acts 1:8

 

[CS1]

Acts 19

It says they had not heard of the Holy Spirit

Then Paul baptised them and then they spoke in tongues.

Are you sayin this should not have been allowed, and neither did anything happen after baptism.


Paul in Ephesus
19 While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2 and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when[a] you believed?”

They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”

3 So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?”

“John’s baptism,” they replied.

4 Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

In addition to this

In the "Spiritual Baptism Thread you said :

My biggest concern is people fully leaning on the idea the day of Pentecost has been fulfilled, I feal the day of Pentecost is for every new believer also.

I'm also believing water baptism came before the day of Pentecost, and water baptism had to be changed in line with the day of Pentecost, because after the day of Pentecost, if my memory serves me correctly,.some people where not performing water baptism in line with the day of Pentecost, or people had to be re baptised because some sort of a mistake was made.

I probably need this explaining to me again, as my thoughts are unsure at the moment


There is no biblical text even provided for this understanding yet you said it.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Did I say that>?

No.

Let's see what Paul actually said in Acts 19 that you may have overlooked.

1 And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples 2, he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”


"Believed" in Greek is pisteuō, Meaning to Paul's qestion: to trust in Jesus or God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: saving faith.


So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.”
3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”
So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”
4 Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.”
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied.



This has nothing to do with water Baptism. To trying to say Baptism in the name of Jesus was done in water, that is assumed.

It says they received the Holy Spirit Upon them. As Jesus said would happen in Acts 1:8

In addition to this

In the "Spiritual Baptism Thread you said :

My biggest concern is people fully leaning on the idea the day of Pentecost has been fulfilled, I feal the day of Pentecost is for every new believer also.

I'm also believing water baptism came before the day of Pentecost, and water baptism had to be changed in line with the day of Pentecost, because after the day of Pentecost, if my memory serves me correctly,.some people where not performing water baptism in line with the day of Pentecost, or people had to be re baptised because some sort of a mistake was made.

I probably need this explaining to me again, as my thoughts are unsure at the moment


There is no biblical text even provided for this understanding yet you said it.

This event has everything to do with water baptism, and acts 19 is very much the reverse of the day of pentacost, in acts 10.



Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

You know fine well there is only one way to baptize someone in the name of the lord, and that is through water baptism.


You claimed nobody should be baptised into water unless there saved.

This clearly paints a different picture.

That in order to be saved, you need to be baptised in the name of the lord.

Your only partially saved untill this happens.

 

[CS1]

This event has everything to do with water baptism, and acts 19 is very much the reverse of the day of pentacost, in acts 10.



Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

You know fine well there is only one way to baptize someone in the name of the lord, and that is through water baptism.


You claimed nobody should be baptised into water unless there saved.

This clearly paints a different picture.

That in order to be saved, you need to be baptised in the name of the lord.

Your only partially saved untill this happens.

FYI

Those of the 120 were already water-baptized. They were also Eyewitnesses of the Resurrected Lord.


Jesus' last instructions before he was taken up were


"you shall receive Power after the Holy Spirit comes upon you". Acts 1:8

 

[CS1]

This event has everything to do with water baptism, and acts 19 is very much the reverse of the day of pentacost, in acts 10.



Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues[b] and prophesied. 7 There were about twelve men in all.

You know fine well there is only one way to baptize someone in the name of the lord, and that is through water baptism.


You claimed nobody should be baptised into water unless there saved.

This clearly paints a different picture.

That in order to be saved, you need to be baptised in the name of the lord.

Your only partially saved untill this happens.

Did I say that?

No.

I said :

"In addition, no one in the Book of Acts was baptized who was not saved before they were baptized in water. "

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

FYI

Those of the 120 were already water-baptized. They were also Eyewitnesses of the Resurrected Lord.


Jesus' last instructions before he was taken up were


"you shall receive Power after the Holy Spirit comes upon you". Acts 1:8

acts 10 is reversed from acts 19.

The power of the holy spirit had already come upon them. And they spoke in tongues in acts 10.

Peter then ordered that they be baptized in water in the name of the lord.

What is so difficult to understand that is acts 19 they spoke in tongues after water baptism and not before


Why won't you acknowledge this.

 

[CS1]

acts 10 is reversed from acts 19.

The power of the holy spirit had already come upon them. And they spoke in tongues in acts 10.

Peter then ordered that they be baptized in water in the name of the lord.

What is so difficult to understand that is acts 19 they spoke in tongues after water baptism and not before


Why won't you acknowledge this.

Please look up the term context.

And what happened in all cases of Empowerment of the Holy Spirt was different, after salvation or water baptism

1. The Apostles in the upper room were not water-baptized again in Jesus' name. They were filled with the Holy Spirit after receiving the Holy Spirit, as we see in John chapter 20 :21-22. The only water baptism they had was that of John. Before Jesus died and rose again, The gospel tells us they ( disciples) were water baptizing and did not mention it was in Jesus' name. OOPS. Nor did Jesus even say that when questioned about Baptism

2. Cornleious house Received the Holy Spirit Before Peter even laid hands on them and

Acts 10:34-43

34 Then Peter opened his mouth and said: “In truth I perceive that God shows no partiality. 35 But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. 36 The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ—He is Lord of all— 37 that word you know, which was proclaimed throughout all Judea, and began from Galilee after the baptism which John preached: 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him. 39 And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. 40 Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, 41 not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. 42 And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead.


43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”


OOPS! Peter did not say Baptized in Jesus' name as he did in Acts 2:38



44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word.

It was after they were saved, Filled with the Holy Spirit, that they were instructed to be water-baptized in the name of Jesus.


Water Baptism did not save them here, nor did it happen before they were filled with The Holy Spirit.

But you know better than the very text shows us.


Acts 19, the disciples from Ephesus were saved, filled with the Holy Spirit, and then water baptized just as those who received the Holy Spirit in Acts chapter 2, 10. All had to believe in Jesus Christ first, as the text says they all did.

Saving faith In the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Please look up the term context.

And what happened in all cases of Empowerment of the Holy Spirt was different, after salvation or water baptism

1. The Apostles in the upper room were not water-baptized again in Jesus' name. They were filled with the Holy Spirit after receiving the Holy Spirit, as we see in John chapter 20 :21-22. The only water baptism they had was that of John. Before Jesus died and rose again, The gospel tells us they ( disciples) were water baptizing and did not mention it was in Jesus' name. OOPS. Nor did Jesus even say that when questioned about Baptism

2. Cornleious house Received the Holy Spirit Before Peter even laid hands on them and

Acts 10:34-43

34 Then Peter opened his mouth and said: “In truth I perceive that God shows no partiality. 35 But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. 36 The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ—He is Lord of all— 37 that word you know, which was proclaimed throughout all Judea, and began from Galilee after the baptism which John preached: 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him. 39 And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. 40 Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, 41 not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. 42 And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead.


43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”


OOPS! Peter did not say Baptized in Jesus' name as he did in Acts 2:38



44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word.

It was after they were saved, Filled with the Holy Spirit, that they were instructed to be water-baptized in the name of Jesus.


Water Baptism did not save them here, nor did it happen before they were filled with The Holy Spirit.

But you know better than the very text shows us.


Acts 19, the disciples from Ephesus were saved, filled with the Holy Spirit, and then water baptized just as those who received the Holy Spirit in Acts chapter 2, 10. All had to believe in Jesus Christ first, as the text says they all did.

Saving faith In the Lord Jesus Christ.

you keep quoting water baptism did not save them.

Which is very miss leading for people.

Because what you should be saying is water baptism is a part of being saved.

And you keep dropping the feelings bombs by being to authoritative. Which is only going to promote jumped up nerves