TEMPLE......TO BE OR NOT TO BE....THAT IS MY QUESTION!!!!!

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TMS said:
The New Testament is replete with the idea that the temple is the body of Jesus. Ephesians 2:19–22 says, “Ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God: And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.” (1 Peter 2:5.)
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Notice how Peter here ^ does not use the definite article ('the') when referring to us as "temple"... he says instead, "an holy temple" ( or just 'holy temple' with no definite article 'the')-- https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/2/21/p0/t_concif_1099021 ; and neither does Paul, when speaking about us as "temple".





Also, in Rev11:1,2, where it speaks of "the temple of God" (with definite article, 'the'), the passage clearly distinguishes "the temple of God" to that of "and THEM that worship THEREIN"--same "the temple of God" that 2Th2:4b speaks to; and which is connected back to that of Dan12:11 "abomination [singular] of desolation [singular] SET UP [H5414]" and there supplying a specific number of "days"...

...which passage Jesus Himself referred back to, in His words of Matt24:15(,21) ("STANDING in the holy place");

notice the connection also between the description of the man of sin in 2Th2:4a[,9.10a] to that found in Dan11:36-37's wilfull king "and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods [same as "mouth" in both Dan7:8,11,20-22 and Rev13:5-7!]... for he shall magnify himself above all" in/during a time-period that ENDS with Daniel being bodily resurrected ('to stand again'--on the earth: "[thou shalt...]...STAND IN THY LOT at the END of the days"... the days referred to in that context--which has NOT YET taken place).




Point being, neither Peter nor Paul use the definite article ('the') when speaking of US (the Church which is His body here on the earth) as "temple". Consider this.
 
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Everlasting-Grace said:
There was a legion in the fortress. This was not a small army.. the thought that it was a small fort is not substantiated.
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Your reply hinges on the idea that there were 6000 roman soldiers in Jerusalem.

That's 6000 soldiers in a heavily built fort. Highly unlikely that the Jews could assail that many roman soldiers.

Probably, way less than 3000 in 66 AD.

We cannot assume this or that.
 
TMS said:
But are they correct?
To begin, let’s go to 1 Chronicles 17:11, 12: “It shall come to pass ... that I will raise up thy seed after thee, which shall be of thy sons; and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build me an house, and I will stablish his throne for ever.” This prophecy given to King David says his offspring will build the temple. Later, in 1 Chronicles 28:6, God reaffirms, “Solomon thy son, he shall build my house and my courts.”

But this text is also one of the clearest examples of a dual prophecy found in Scripture. Dual prophecies have both a physical and spiritual fulfillment. Indeed, Solomon, the son of David, built the physical temple. But this prophecy also applies spiritually to Jesus, the true “Son of David,” who is to build a temple and kingdom that will last forever.

Jesus’ prophecy that the pride of the Jewish nation, the temple, would be destroyed inspired the most intense rejection of His teachings. (See Matthew 24:1, 2.) In John 2:19, Jesus says, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.” Of course, Jesus is speaking of rebuilding a temple—not of stone and nails, but of living stones (1 Peter 2:5). Yet many refused to grasp this teaching (John 2:20, 21). They even mocked Jesus on the cross regarding His prophecy (Matthew 27:40).

Yet when Jesus died, the veil in the earthly temple ripped in two from the top to bottom, signifying that the temple no longer held meaning. A temple for sacrifice today would be as useless as it was then, and it would not be the house of God.

The New Testament is replete with the idea that the temple is the body of Jesus. Ephesians 2:19–22 says, “Ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God: And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.” (1 Peter 2:5.)

Even after God provides all this clear evidence that His temple is a spiritual one, many Christians are waiting for the Jews to receive a construction permit to rebuild a physical temple on the site where a Muslim mosque now sits. However, there is no prophecy, promise, or commandment in the Bible that says the physical temple would ever be rebuilt after the Romans razed it nearly 2,000 years ago.
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This article left out a key component of the unconditional physical aspect of this prophecy........the land deal for Israel. I wonder why they would leave this out of their article?:cool:

2 Sam 7
10 Moreover I will appoint a place for my people Israel, and will plant them, that they may dwell in a place of their own, and move no more; neither shall the children of wickedness afflict them any more, as beforetime,
11 And as since the time that I commanded judges to be over my people Israel, and have caused thee to rest from all thine enemies. Also the LORD telleth thee that he will make thee an house.

Ezekiel 37:25–27
25 “They will live on the land that I gave to Jacob My servant, in which your fathers lived; and they will live on it, they, and their sons and their sons’ sons, forever; and David My servant will be their prince forever.
 
Inquisitor said:
Your reply hinges on the idea that there were 6000 roman soldiers in Jerusalem.

That's 6000 soldiers in a heavily built fort. Highly unlikely that the Jews could assail that many roman soldiers.

Probably, way less than 3000 in 66 AD.

We cannot assume this or that.
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I just go off what History suggests

Even if you claim 3000, plus their families and the civilian workers horses etc etc.. The idea that the fort was small is nonensical.
 
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douggg said:
The temple here on earth is patterned after the real in heaven.

In Revelation 15:6
6 And the seven angels came out of the temple, having the seven plagues, clothed in pure and white linen, and having their breasts girded with golden girdles.

In Revelation 11:19
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.
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and so the battle rages on.

Well this is one temple I will acknowledgement this one.

But will you acknowledge another lords temple.

This was a simple question I asked to @cv5
That you answered.

So far in this discussion we have had no acknowledgement to another type of the lords temple from other posters

So at this moment in time here on plannet earth which lords temple is here 🤔
 
Kroogz said:
This article left out a key component of the unconditional physical aspect of this prophecy........the land deal for Israel. I wonder why they would leave this out of their article?:cool:

2 Sam 7
10 Moreover I will appoint a place for my people Israel, and will plant them, that they may dwell in a place of their own, and move no more; neither shall the children of wickedness afflict them any more, as beforetime,
11 And as since the time that I commanded judges to be over my people Israel, and have caused thee to rest from all thine enemies. Also the LORD telleth thee that he will make thee an house.

Ezekiel 37:25–27
25 “They will live on the land that I gave to Jacob My servant, in which your fathers lived; and they will live on it, they, and their sons and their sons’ sons, forever; and David My servant will be their prince forever.
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there's hardly any Palestine Christians left in this place right now 👍
So which lambs are being sacrificed
 
Thunderrr-mental said:
and so the battle rages on.
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That being the one betwixt abysmal and willful ignorance and studious careful vigilant scholarship?

The one between a prophecy jettisoning post-modernist low view of Scripture and a serious solemn exalting view of Scripture?

Totally agree.

Not much of a battle really. As if God-honoring truth will not prevail.
 
cv5 said:
That being the one betwixt abysmal and willful ignorance and studious careful vigilant scholarship?

The one between a prophecy jettisoning post-modernist low view of Scripture and a serious solemn exalting view of Scripture?

Totally agree.

Not much of a battle really. As if God-honoring truth will not prevail.
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I would call it confusion in some parts I don't understand

I view revelation as a story that goes back and forth through history, between past present and future.

I don't view revelation as one continuous story
I view it as future events being existent in the past present and future.
 
2ndTimeIsTheCharm said:
Really? You think Jesus returned and has become King over all the nations with an iron rod???

Where are all His people who have put on immortality and reigning with Him over the nations? I don't know anybody like that. Do you???


🐹
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Well Jesus said that ALL authority in Heaven and ON EARTH has been granted to Him, and for us to go and make disciples of ALL nations because of this, right before ascending to sit on His throne at the right hand of the Father. As far as I know He MUST reign until every enemy is put under His feet. How does He tell us the kingdom comes? In a fiery war as He's slaying foes left and right with His mouth sword from His white hoarse, bringing a kingdom we can point to and say "there it is"? Or is it more like a seed growing into a tree? I think it's kind of cheap when people jump to these verses and use them as a "I win automatically" card.

Does Gods law bend? Or is it ALWAYS like an iron rod that leaves men only 1 way to reconciliation? You say these thing in a mocking way yet nothing you believe about a "pre-trib rapture" isn't brought to the text. This is hard to understand when you've been told your whole life by the faithful men and women you trust that "this verse means this, and that verse means that", when that's what they were taught in Bible collage and there's not reason for you to doubt them, but if you take a step back with the text and read these verses in there context you'll see there is no way to pull from the text what this view teaches about them without HAVING to add a whole bunch that is not there.

I understand what you believe and why you believe it, I really do, I was taught the same things, but these very weak arguments are just trying to avoid diving deeper into the issues. Like this one I've heard 1,000 times, "Oh what, the stars are still there and the moon still gives light so...everything you say is invalid."

That's not honestly dealing with anything and avoiding actual thought and conversation. When you read the text EVERYTHING is pointing to a coming judgement coming SOON, happening to THEM.

AHHH, I could go on and on about this, but I'm sure you care very little about my opinion, but we all owe it to ourselves to try to seek truth and share it where we can, that includes listening to the others arguments honestly, because it's not always them that's in the wrong. I've found myself on the wrong side way more than I'd like to admit. So I hope you have a good day and pray we are both drawn closer to truth daily.
 
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