Ephesians 6:12 A biblical perspective.
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It sounds like you've read The Screwtape Letters. 
Actually no I never have. In fact, I have never read anything by C S Lewis except for the Chronicles of Narnia when I was very young.
I did have a good friend who pressed me to read 'Mere Christianity' but for whatever reason...nope...didn't read that either
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First off satan is as real as the Lord Jesus himself. FYI, Jesus can save that which is lost, excluding Satan. You don't believe the devil is actively involved in the world system? So, The Lord Jesus lied when he said the following:
1. The devil is real.
The Bible tells us that “Jesus was led up by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil” Matthew 4:1 People should not doubt the existence of Satan. He is indeed real and tried to destroy Jesus in the wilderness to thwart his redemptive work.
Jesus said a good deal about Satan.
He called him:
"the enemy", Matthew 13:39.
"The evil one", Matthew 13:38
"The prince of this world", John 12:31; 14:30
"A liar", and "the father of lies", John 8:44.
"A murderer", John 8:44.
But you know better. LOL.
I Disagree with your innuendo that I don't believe Satan is real, it doesn't even make sense that you believe that.
For example
You may not have read my posts or misunderstood, but I've been quite clear that I think Satan literally ruled the world, and at the cross the prince of the world was cast out, I mean how can I believe he was literally cast out and into the pit, if I don't believe he is a real being?
Same as I think he is the destroyer, the king of the pit, who comes up out of it(I believe soon) therefore I must believe he is a real being.
I'll try and explain what I think you are doing in a simplistic way just for example.
Jesus was on earth and He entered the temple when he was 12 years old.
Things are changed now and he grew up into maturity, and He has ascended into heaven which is where he is currently.
And if you (I know you wouldn't} then told me I didn't think Jesus was real because the Word says not only is He on earth but He is only 12 years old. and quote me.
Luke 12:42 The Boy Jesus at the Temple - Every year Jesus' parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. When he was twelve years old, they went.
I'm not trying to facetious I'm just saying just because Satan was the ruler of the world, it does not mean he still is, as things change.
For example
You may not have read my posts or misunderstood, but I've been quite clear that I think Satan literally ruled the world, and at the cross the prince of the world was cast out, I mean how can I believe he was literally cast out and into the pit, if I don't believe he is a real being?
Same as I think he is the destroyer, the king of the pit, who comes up out of it(I believe soon) therefore I must believe he is a real being.
I'll try and explain what I think you are doing in a simplistic way just for example.
Jesus was on earth and He entered the temple when he was 12 years old.
Things are changed now and he grew up into maturity, and He has ascended into heaven which is where he is currently.
And if you (I know you wouldn't} then told me I didn't think Jesus was real because the Word says not only is He on earth but He is only 12 years old. and quote me.
Luke 12:42 The Boy Jesus at the Temple - Every year Jesus' parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. When he was twelve years old, they went.
I'm not trying to facetious I'm just saying just because Satan was the ruler of the world, it does not mean he still is, as things change.
Yes, you have pointed that out before, read ya loud and clear
Ill try and defend myself for the way I think or explain the why I think what I think a bit more I suppose.
When the angels were cast out of heaven they left their habitation, or the word could also be house.
Jude 6 and the angels who did not keep their proper abode, but left their own abode.
The activity of demons in the gospel accounts shows that they desire a dwelling place or abode, and that abode is human bodies, the interaction of dealing with demons is casting them out of people.
This also works the other way for us.
2Co 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
2Co 5:2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
2Co 5:3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
2Co 5:4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
Anyway if I could travel through a time machine back into the gospel times, I would see lots of demon possession, I would walk around, and see that these spirit beings are dwelling in people, they sometimes pick weaker people or people with physical infirmities like epileptics or dumb people.
Or they possess people in great number and they become super strong men that cannot be contained, or they possess people and tell people things that the person possessed would not know or have information about. And if I saw any I would cast them out, for Jesus has complete authority over them.
Also I would not cast them out of a person into the air so that when I walk around the corner they will turn around and re enter the person or into another person, to repeat the whole process again, that seems pointless to me.
Anyway this is how I see how demonic activity according to the bible, demons are entering into people.
Step back into the time machine and come back to the present, I do not see any sign what so ever of demonic possession, and Christians now tell me that they attack the mind and try and tempt people to sin, which seems totally different to the accounts in the bible to me.
Do they whisper into my ear, do they possess psionic abilities and the why of it makes no sense to me.
So when I read bible verses like 2Pet 2:4 For God did not spare the angels who sinned but cast them down into hell and delivered them into chains of darkness.
I go yes that makes reasonable sense to me.
Should I believe people are telling me or what the Word says? I mean even if every person in the whole wide world tells me I'm wrong including my close family, How can I in good conscience discount what the bible plainly tells me.(not that there's no people out there that think like I do on this topic)
Ill try and defend myself for the way I think or explain the why I think what I think a bit more I suppose.
When the angels were cast out of heaven they left their habitation, or the word could also be house.
Jude 6 and the angels who did not keep their proper abode, but left their own abode.
The activity of demons in the gospel accounts shows that they desire a dwelling place or abode, and that abode is human bodies, the interaction of dealing with demons is casting them out of people.
This also works the other way for us.
2Co 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
2Co 5:2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
2Co 5:3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
2Co 5:4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
Anyway if I could travel through a time machine back into the gospel times, I would see lots of demon possession, I would walk around, and see that these spirit beings are dwelling in people, they sometimes pick weaker people or people with physical infirmities like epileptics or dumb people.
Or they possess people in great number and they become super strong men that cannot be contained, or they possess people and tell people things that the person possessed would not know or have information about. And if I saw any I would cast them out, for Jesus has complete authority over them.
Also I would not cast them out of a person into the air so that when I walk around the corner they will turn around and re enter the person or into another person, to repeat the whole process again, that seems pointless to me.
Anyway this is how I see how demonic activity according to the bible, demons are entering into people.
Step back into the time machine and come back to the present, I do not see any sign what so ever of demonic possession, and Christians now tell me that they attack the mind and try and tempt people to sin, which seems totally different to the accounts in the bible to me.
Do they whisper into my ear, do they possess psionic abilities and the why of it makes no sense to me.
So when I read bible verses like 2Pet 2:4 For God did not spare the angels who sinned but cast them down into hell and delivered them into chains of darkness.
I go yes that makes reasonable sense to me.
Should I believe people are telling me or what the Word says? I mean even if every person in the whole wide world tells me I'm wrong including my close family, How can I in good conscience discount what the bible plainly tells me.(not that there's no people out there that think like I do on this topic)
Actually it's partly why I think Paul was partly blind, I think the scales were from a very bright light, like welder's flash where the eyes weep and form scales and shows blindness.
When Paul's eyesight was healed I don't think he was completely healed, I mean the thorn in the flesh to me is a physical ailment, and blindness is already there.
The main reason I think Paul was still partially blind and therefore the thorn in the flesh is because of the verses that indicate that he he still had eye problems.
Paul wrote with large letters as blind people do
Gal 6:11 See with what large letters I have written to you with my own hand!
The Galatians seemed to know he was blind and felt compassion with the sentiment if possible would have given him their own eyes.
Gal 4:15 Where then is that sense of blessing you had? For I testify about you that, if possible, you would have torn out your eyes and given them to me.
Then Paul looking at the council did not recognise the Ananias the high priest who would have been garbed.
Acts 23:1 Then Paul, looking earnestly at the council, said, “Men and brethren, I have lived in all good conscience before God until this day.” And the high priest Ananias commanded those who stood by him to strike him on the mouth. Then Paul said to him, “God will strike you, you whitewashed wall! For you sit to judge me according to the law, and do you command me to be struck contrary to the law?” And those who stood by said, “Do you revile God’s high priest?”
The reason he did not know he was the high priest was because he could not see him
Acts 23:5 Then Paul said, “I did not know, brethren, that he was the high priest; for it is written, ‘You shall not speak evil of a ruler of your people.’ ”
Anyway I wont repeat what I said before but it makes sense to me that Paul's blindness was a result of walking in darkness following Satan in his reviling of Christians, till he met the Lord.
When Paul's eyesight was healed I don't think he was completely healed, I mean the thorn in the flesh to me is a physical ailment, and blindness is already there.
The main reason I think Paul was still partially blind and therefore the thorn in the flesh is because of the verses that indicate that he he still had eye problems.
Paul wrote with large letters as blind people do
Gal 6:11 See with what large letters I have written to you with my own hand!
The Galatians seemed to know he was blind and felt compassion with the sentiment if possible would have given him their own eyes.
Gal 4:15 Where then is that sense of blessing you had? For I testify about you that, if possible, you would have torn out your eyes and given them to me.
Then Paul looking at the council did not recognise the Ananias the high priest who would have been garbed.
Acts 23:1 Then Paul, looking earnestly at the council, said, “Men and brethren, I have lived in all good conscience before God until this day.” And the high priest Ananias commanded those who stood by him to strike him on the mouth. Then Paul said to him, “God will strike you, you whitewashed wall! For you sit to judge me according to the law, and do you command me to be struck contrary to the law?” And those who stood by said, “Do you revile God’s high priest?”
The reason he did not know he was the high priest was because he could not see him
Acts 23:5 Then Paul said, “I did not know, brethren, that he was the high priest; for it is written, ‘You shall not speak evil of a ruler of your people.’ ”
Anyway I wont repeat what I said before but it makes sense to me that Paul's blindness was a result of walking in darkness following Satan in his reviling of Christians, till he met the Lord.
There is a lot of reason's why I don't think the star fallen here is Satan, I'll give a couple, First of all I think the angels that sinned are already all bound according to 2Pet 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment.
Also once the pit is opened, the demons come out and so does the king of the bottomless pit whom I think is Satan aka the destroyer.
If it's not, then and I presume you believe the war in heaven has just happened, which to me is not going to happen with the Lord there on the throne, but anyway Jesus has the keys Rev 1:18 and therefore would have to hand them to Satan at this time?
Then and I presume there would then be Satan and his fallen angels running around on earth separate to the demons and their king running around on earth, I mean having the two groups does not make sense to me, with two evil entities in control.
I don't think the word fallen necessarily has a bad context, so does not have to mean an evil angel but can be a good angel, for example the same Word could be used in context of I fall to my knees in worship or prayer etc etc.
Just my 2c worth
Also once the pit is opened, the demons come out and so does the king of the bottomless pit whom I think is Satan aka the destroyer.
If it's not, then and I presume you believe the war in heaven has just happened, which to me is not going to happen with the Lord there on the throne, but anyway Jesus has the keys Rev 1:18 and therefore would have to hand them to Satan at this time?
Then and I presume there would then be Satan and his fallen angels running around on earth separate to the demons and their king running around on earth, I mean having the two groups does not make sense to me, with two evil entities in control.
I don't think the word fallen necessarily has a bad context, so does not have to mean an evil angel but can be a good angel, for example the same Word could be used in context of I fall to my knees in worship or prayer etc etc.
Just my 2c worth
If I may, the 'abode', 'habitation', 'house' that the angels left...... Were their created bodies. They appeared human or possessed humans and Jude directly relates SG and these angels that sinned going after strange flesh. Remember how the people in SG wanted to lay with the angels that came?
Gen 6 and the sons of God who took human wives? Here is something you may have missed,so hear me out please. This sin was so egregious and went beyond the 'rules' God had set that they were sent to the deepest, darkest place of the pit.
Jude: 6-7~~~And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation,(bodies) he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
These specific angels are eternally bound for the day of judgement...........they won't be released.
Gen 6 and the sons of God who took human wives? Here is something you may have missed,so hear me out please. This sin was so egregious and went beyond the 'rules' God had set that they were sent to the deepest, darkest place of the pit.
Jude: 6-7~~~And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation,(bodies) he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
These specific angels are eternally bound for the day of judgement...........they won't be released.
That is your opinion. You don't believe the devil is real ok. With that statement does one really need to read what you have said?
No. Your Understanding of Christ is unbiblical. your last comment is an oxymoron, You say "You don't believe satan is real, then you
say " I'm just saying just because Satan was the ruler of the world, it does not mean he still is, as things change."
smh.
No. Your Understanding of Christ is unbiblical. your last comment is an oxymoron, You say "You don't believe satan is real, then you
say " I'm just saying just because Satan was the ruler of the world, it does not mean he still is, as things change."
smh.
I see in Jude and in 2 Pet three separate judgments, let me try and explain
Three examples of divine judgment in 2Pet
1. The angels that sinned v4
2. The the pre-flood era v5
3. Sodom and Gomorrah v6
1. For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment
2. And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
3. And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
I see three separate judgments with three separate timings.
I don't see why if those who say that that No 1 and No 2 happened at the same time, why not No 3 as well, well I do know why, they obviously have different timings, and while its not so obvious the difference in timings between No 1 and No 2 It still does not tie in with when the 1/3 angels sinned following the dragon, So it then means another group of angels that we know nothing of have to come into existence to be used by those who tie No 1 No 2 together.
As for the Gen 6 theory you no doubt have already assumed I believe the sons of God are faithful men. So it's is a rather large topic for us to get into, lol
My first point and best point would be it was man that sinned not angels, God repented that He had made man and not angels, God said He would judge man and not angels
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Gen 6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
To summarise, God looked down at man upon the earth saw the inclination of his heart was continually evil and then sent the flood to wipe them out, If it was angels it would contradict the need for a flood and the idea God would judge man for sins that He would have to allowed angels to commit seems way to far fetched for me.
Three examples of divine judgment in 2Pet
1. The angels that sinned v4
2. The the pre-flood era v5
3. Sodom and Gomorrah v6
1. For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment
2. And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
3. And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
I see three separate judgments with three separate timings.
I don't see why if those who say that that No 1 and No 2 happened at the same time, why not No 3 as well, well I do know why, they obviously have different timings, and while its not so obvious the difference in timings between No 1 and No 2 It still does not tie in with when the 1/3 angels sinned following the dragon, So it then means another group of angels that we know nothing of have to come into existence to be used by those who tie No 1 No 2 together.
As for the Gen 6 theory you no doubt have already assumed I believe the sons of God are faithful men. So it's is a rather large topic for us to get into, lol
My first point and best point would be it was man that sinned not angels, God repented that He had made man and not angels, God said He would judge man and not angels
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Gen 6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
To summarise, God looked down at man upon the earth saw the inclination of his heart was continually evil and then sent the flood to wipe them out, If it was angels it would contradict the need for a flood and the idea God would judge man for sins that He would have to allowed angels to commit seems way to far fetched for me.
…but in that heavenly war, Michael does cast out Satan onto the earth. That is my view.
And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
- Revelation 12:7-9 (KJV)
And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
- Revelation 12:7-9 (KJV)