TEMPLE......TO BE OR NOT TO BE....THAT IS MY QUESTION!!!!!

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
23,801
8,618
113
revelation 12 to 14 is a long lasting battles between a new kingdom on earth which is the Spirit of Jesus living in people and growing, verses a a kingdom of the spirit of Satan living in people.

This kingdom of satan has been losing ground since The victorious day of Jesus.

This is the long lasting kingdom interlude, where Christ's kingdom becomes the kingdoms of the world which includes the the shrinking of Satan's kingdoms.

Revelation 12 to 14 confirms all that, and is a long battle that has been happening since Jesus was victorious.

This is also when Satan started to defile the new temple. Which is confirmed by the fact he is accusing Gods children day and night and defiling there temple day and night.

This is the longest and most difficult kingdoms interlude to understand.

But John hears in rev 12 to 14 that the kingdoms of the world is to become the kingdoms of Christ.

This is the great tribulation. It's been happening since the victorious day of Jesus.

The reason why it's been happening is because Jesus gave people direct acces to his kingdom from the Satan kingdom.

Both kingdoms are now all over the world and as you see there is world wide conflict.

It's not rocket science friend 😊
Utterly baseless unbiblical hogwash.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
Blinded or not there is only one way in. They may well believe en masses. But it will be done individually through Christ. This is how the ones who weren't blinded entered into grace. In Christ there is no Jew or Greek. Why do you cling to a distinction God no longer recognizes?
 

douggg

Active member
Oct 2, 2021
468
82
28
This is the great tribulation. It's been happening since the victorious day of Jesus.
The great tribulation begins when the abomination of desolation is set up on the temple mount. Matthew 24:15-21.

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand : )


21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Daniel 12:

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

The great tribulation is still future. And it will last 1335 days. To end when Jesus returns.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
Except that (as @TheDivineWatermark has pointed out), the Church is NEVER, EVER referred to as the peculiar sons of Jacob. Ever.

And the Church is NEVER seen from Rev 6 thru Rev 18. Gap filled by Israelite preachers. Then it shows up in Rev 19.
The distinction could not be more stark.

And how in the world could you think that the Church is Israel given these passages? Since when was the Church around to partake of the FIRST COVENANT, were children of Israelite patriarchs, and came out of Egypt?

Heb 8:7
For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

Heb 8:8
For finding fault with THEM (NOT US!), he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Heb 8:9
Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Why would they be called that? They are called the sons of God. Same thing, different natural lineage . And yet the same father...Abraham...and same Father...God.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
Jesus was speaking to his disciples in Mathew and that generation 😊
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
23,801
8,618
113
Blinded or not there is only one way in. They may well believe en masses. But it will be done individually through Christ. This is how the ones who weren't blinded entered into grace. In Christ there is no Jew or Greek. Why do you cling to a distinction God no longer recognizes?
The whole dynamic of Josephs interaction with HIS BRETHREN positively screams about the TEMPORARY blindness and subsequent REVEALING of Christ to the Jews. Which of course ties into all end-time prophecy. Obviously.

The clueless heretics remain blind to this obviously intentional OT reveal in type. Obviously.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
23,801
8,618
113
Why would they be called that? They are called the sons of God. Same thing, different natural lineage . And yet the same father...Abraham...and same Father...God.
Is that supposed to make any sense at all? Because it does not.

Which of course is to be expected of false doctrine.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,080
6,883
113
62
Is that supposed to make any sense at all? Because it does not.

Which of course is to be expected of false doctrine.
Read it a few times. Your comprehension is a little slow.
 

douggg

Active member
Oct 2, 2021
468
82
28
Blinded or not there is only one way in. They may well believe en masses. But it will be done individually through Christ. This is how the ones who weren't blinded entered into grace. In Christ there is no Jew or Greek. Why do you cling to a distinction God no longer recognizes?
In Christ, we are a new creation.

God does recognize the nation of Israel. Ezekiel 38-39, Gog/Magog is an attack on Israel the nation.
 

douggg

Active member
Oct 2, 2021
468
82
28
Jesus was speaking to his disciples in Mathew and that generation 😊
Jesus was speaking to the disciples about the subject of His return.

3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?


The sign of his coming is in Matthew 24:30a....

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

The tribulation of those days is the 1290 days of Daniel 12:11 from when the abomination of desolation is setup.

At the end of the 1290 days, the heavens will be shaken (the sixth seal event of Revelation 6 ) and the world will see the sign of the Son of man in heaven.

It will look like this.... (an illustration I made).... The wicked men of the earth will be terrified. And will gather their armies at Armageddon to prepare to make war on Jesus.

The sign of the son of man in heaven.jpg
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,923
2,118
113
In Ezekiel 39 is the framework for end time events to take place during the 7 year 70th week.

Gog/Magog - then the 7 years verses 9-10 - then Armageddon verses 17-20 - Jesus Himself speaking in the text verses 21-29, having returned to this earth.
This is fairly how I see it, as well.





--Romans 9:26, speaking of Israel, says, "And it SHALL COME TO PASS, that in the place where it was SAID UNTO THEM, Ye are not my people [lo ammi]; there shall they be called the children of the living God." [Hos1:10-11];


--Romans 9:25, speaking of Gentiles, says, "As he saith also in Osee [Hosea 2:23b,c], I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved."










But, as we know, Rom11:25 says, "blindness [/a hardening] in part is happened to Israel, UNTIL the fulness of the Gentiles BE COME IN [G1525]" (not "blindness/ a hardening... to THE CHURCH"... because "Israel" does not equal "the Church" ;) ).
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
Satan hasn't. And neither have you.
The joy of who are to be saved can be found in rev 7 9-17 it's a powerful reminder that not all on earth are wicked but will suffer Gods Judgements

In rev 10:1-11 the battle of Armageddon it about sealing things which the seven thunders utter 😊

Hopefully my silent thunders will do to

Of cause it's about opening that little book to.

Have a great day I hope you calm down soon.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,923
2,118
113
^ Those "on the earth" in Rev7:9-17 (as well as vv.3-8) are not "the Church which is His body" however. ;)
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
23,801
8,618
113
But, as we know, Rom11:25 says, "blindness [/a hardening] in part is happened to Israel, UNTIL the fulness of the Gentiles BE COME IN [G1525]" (not "blindness/ a hardening... to THE CHURCH"... because "Israel" does not equal "the Church" ;) ).
Correct.

Which of course leaves the continuation theologians up the creek without a paddle.

I am wondering how they are going to twist this passage by inserting "Church" or "its spiritual" into it hither and thither according to their whim and whimsy.

Furthermore, somebody had better inform them:
no time of Jacobs trouble - great tribulation - redemption for ISRAEL, no Second Coming.

I am quite certain that SATAN desires that NEITHER of these things happen.
So they are in good company.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
^ Those "on the earth" in Rev7:9-17 (as well as vv.3-8) are not "the Church which is His body" however. ;)
verse 14 explains it better

Which says these are they who came out of great tribulation who have washed there robes with the blood of the lamb 😊
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
23,801
8,618
113
verse 14 explains it better

Which says these are they who came out of great tribulation who have washed there robes with the blood of the lamb 😊
So then YOU may enjoy the horrors of the tribulation buddy. Tormented by literal demonic entities from the pit and all.

A tragedy for those who dwell upon the earth no doubt.

Fortunately, WE, the Church, are raptured beforehand.