He who letteth will let.

[Thunderrr-mental]

Your revenge will come when I’m voted off the forum.

is this another dreaded scourge post.

You know it's best not to let them vester, 😀

 

[10-22-27]

I got your point the first time but you obviously don't get mine.

As stated very succinctly, in my previous post, which you responded to, your error here is not in Eschatology, (The study of end times) but in your understanding of Theology, (The study of God). You don't seem to understand that God is Omnipresent. He is in all things and all things receive their being and move within God. Nothing is separate from God nor can it be. If it were then it would cease to exist.

Act 17:28a for in him we live, and move, and have our being;...
Col 1:16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
Col 1:17 and he is before all things, and in him all things consist.

At this very moment - The Holy Spirit is in all creation but not in the same way. He, as God, sustains the lost but He is not in them in the same way as He is in the saved. He is in the heavens as He is on the earth and in the earth. He is the "Seal" of the saved but does not seal the lost. He is ministering to the saved but confounds the lost.

When the church is taken up, He will be with them but He will still be with the 144,000 that are sealed on earth and all of those Regenerated in the Tribulation Days.

Quit trying to put the Holy Spirit in a "box" or speak for Him as to where He should be.

You wrote, "I got your point the first time but you obviously don't get mine."

Obviously, I don't! You have a nasty habit putting people down before you know anything about them. If you want to know what I know about the LORD, go to my website, seekfirstwisdom.com then come back and apologize. As far as the 144,000, new subject.

Read the following carefully, don't brush over it.

Jesus is speaking to his disciples, when he said to them, John 14:26, "The Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach YOU (and the followers of Jesus Christ) all things, and being all things to YOUR remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."

John 15:26, When the Comforter comes, whom I (Jesus) will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceeds from the Father, he shall testify of me."

John 16:13, "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth is come, he will guide YOU (and believers) into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself;"

To unbelievers, 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11, "And with all deceivableness and unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be save. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie."

1 Timothy 4:1, "Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter time some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to SEDUCING SPIRITS, AND DOCTRINES OF DEVILS."

You use this term "In them," what are you talking about? Now if you mean he is working with our spirit, I agree. If that's not what you mean, then I disagree. Nice talking to you!

 

[PaulThomson]

2 Thessalonians 2:7, “For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth (restrains) will let, until he be taken out of the way.” My question is, who is the ‘He’?

He is God. "Until He be taken out of the way" is passive voice, but the same form as the passive is used for middle voice, where the action is done by the subject on themselves. So, it could also be "until he takes Himself out of the way."

God is always withholding Satan from doing his worst. When societies or individuals persist in pushing God out or their lives and refuse to be thankful and morally responsive for the many blessings He pours out on all indiscriminately, and His grace is not drawing them, but is enabling them to continue practise even worse sin, then He gives them the desires of their own hearts, and gets out of their way. only that means He also gets out of the way of the dark forces who want to steal, kill and destroy us, and tribulation comes.

 

[awelight]

You wrote, "I got your point the first time but you obviously don't get mine."

Obviously, I don't! You have a nasty habit putting people down before you know anything about them. If you want to know what I know about the LORD, go to my website, seekfirstwisdom.com then come back and apologize. As far as the 144,000, new subject.

Read the following carefully, don't brush over it.

Jesus is speaking to his disciples, when he said to them, John 14:26, "The Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach YOU (and the followers of Jesus Christ) all things, and being all things to YOUR remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."

John 15:26, When the Comforter comes, whom I (Jesus) will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceeds from the Father, he shall testify of me."

John 16:13, "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth is come, he will guide YOU (and believers) into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself;"

To unbelievers, 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11, "And with all deceivableness and unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be save. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie."

1 Timothy 4:1, "Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter time some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to SEDUCING SPIRITS, AND DOCTRINES OF DEVILS."

You use this term "In them," what are you talking about? Now if you mean he is working with our spirit, I agree. If that's not what you mean, then I disagree. Nice talking to you!

I appreciate your reply but it had nothing to do with what I was questioning. I was questioning your understanding of the Holy Spirit as God. If you believe the Holy Spirit will "leave earth", then you misunderstand Omnipresence. This was the gist of my two previous posts.

 

[glf]

2 Thessalonians 2:7, “For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth (restrains) will let, until he be taken out of the way.” My question is, who is the ‘He’?

In another post, I asked, “Can the church survive without the Holy Spirit.” Everyone who responded agreed that the church cannot survive without the Holy Spirit. I also agree.

So, who is the, he? And what happens when he is taken away? And will answering the above questions provide us with more information concerning the time of the rapture?

Our first hurdle will be who the “he” that’s to be taken away before “That Wicked (Lawless One) is revealed” 2 Thessalonians 2:8.

Scriptures tell us someone has to be taken away before the antichrist is revealed. Now, who can that be?

Here’s what we know: the mystery of iniquity: the devil’s disciples were already at work in Paul’s day. The future antichrist will be called the ‘Wicked One.’ Verse 8 also tells us the antichrist and his kingdom will be destroyed by Jesus Christ at his coming.

So, who’s the ‘he that is now restraining the devil’s empowered forces?’

There are several lines of thought. Many thought it was the Roman empire in Paul’s day the Holy Spirit was holding back, but they’re long gone, and the Spirit is still with us. Could it be the devil himself? but why would he hold back the Wicked one? He wouldn’t, we can scratch him off. Could it be human government holding back evil? No, because governments will continue after the antichrist has been revealed.

That leaves us with the Holy Spirit working in the Christian community that is restraining evil and the revealing of the ‘Wicked One.’ The Holy Spirit dwells in every Christian with power; he comes, convinces, guides, speaks, and hears our prayers and prophecies.

Verse 7 says, “He will be taken out of the way.” Question: Where’s he going? I would say, back to heaven.

Now, if the church cannot survive without the Holy Spirit, as we discussed earlier, it will be taken with him, then the ‘Wicked One’ is revealed.

And when the antichrist is made known, he will cause havoc on Earth for seven years. Now if the above is correct, the Holy Spirit and church go into heaven, the antichrist is then revealed and rules for seven-years, It would appear to add evidence to the teaching of a pre-tribulation rapture.

Your response to the above. Stay on the subject, please.

Jesus gave the church, the body of Christ authority over all the power of the enemy. He is referring to the members of the church, who have to be raptured before the evil one can reveal himself to the world, which I suspect occurs at the abomination of desolation when the anti-christ reveals himself and the trib swings into full gear with the trumpet judgements. This is the main reason I suspect that the rapture will be a mid-trib event. Add to this thought that judgement will start with the house of God which goes against a pre-trib occurrence. BTW "except those days be shortened, there shall no flesh survive," all by itself makes all end times calculations to be unable to know the day or hour of Jesus return.