What Does It Mean That God Desires All People To Be Saved?
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Exactly! That is why Acts 16:31 is Pauls answer to the Jailer. Faith has no merit in and of itself. The merit is in the OBJECT of ones faith......the Lord Jesus Christ.
John3~~ 14And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15so that everyone who believes will have eternal life in Him.
Num 21:8~~Then the LORD said to Moses, “Make a fiery serpent, and put it on a flag pole; and it shall come about, that everyone who is bitten, and looks at it, will live.”
John12:32~~And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to Myself.”
1 Tim 4:10~~For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have set our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all mankind, especially of believers.
God did something about mans inability. He sent His Son, lifted Him up for ALL to see. All have been bitten, all can look up and believe.
There is no merit in the faith of man(who can boast?) the merit lies in the OBJECT of their faith.......The Lord Jesus Christ ( we boast about Him.)
John3~~ 14And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15so that everyone who believes will have eternal life in Him.
Num 21:8~~Then the LORD said to Moses, “Make a fiery serpent, and put it on a flag pole; and it shall come about, that everyone who is bitten, and looks at it, will live.”
John12:32~~And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to Myself.”
1 Tim 4:10~~For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have set our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all mankind, especially of believers.
God did something about mans inability. He sent His Son, lifted Him up for ALL to see. All have been bitten, all can look up and believe.
There is no merit in the faith of man(who can boast?) the merit lies in the OBJECT of their faith.......The Lord Jesus Christ ( we boast about Him.)
Hey hey, fellow sibs…. I believe election and free will both are true. Why? ….because both are taught in the Bible. Here are two examples out of many:
Free Will:
Revelation 22:16-17
"I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star." And the Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let him who hears say, "Come!" And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
Chosen (Election):
Ephesians 1:3-4
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,
Free Will:
Revelation 22:16-17
"I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star." And the Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let him who hears say, "Come!" And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
Chosen (Election):
Ephesians 1:3-4
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,
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I was reformed so I ALWAYS looked at election in this sense, as individuals elected to salvation. But the scales fell off and now with the unbiased eyes........election and predestination are for believers only. They come AFTER salvation. Elected to His Highest and best for service to Him. Predestined to be conformed to His image.....There is a lot more to it! But it is not God electing to save us or not.
All men were condemned. He offers all men His salvation.
All men were condemned. He offers all men His salvation.
More thoughts on the matter of Election and Free Will:
Christ did not die for a select few, but "because God so loved the world that He gave..." Nevertheless, some were chosen before the world was even created to do something especially meaningful for God (think prophets of old, apostles, those even in this generation who will be used by God when the Holy Spirit speaks through them in the latter days —Matthew 10:19-20: "But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; "for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.
Christ did not die for a select few, but "because God so loved the world that He gave..." Nevertheless, some were chosen before the world was even created to do something especially meaningful for God (think prophets of old, apostles, those even in this generation who will be used by God when the Holy Spirit speaks through them in the latter days —Matthew 10:19-20: "But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; "for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.
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You left out the "no" as in "no faith" from my reply.
Anyway, that everyone saved must have belief, there is no doubt, but a true belief comes only through and by Christ's faith which is imputed to the true believer: it is not of oneself but of God. The question is not of whether one who is saved believes, but HOW do they come to that belief.
If someone believes they have given to themselves faith, then they aren't looking to the Son of Man, they are looking to themselves, so those verses do not apply to them.
These verses inform us as to who God was referring to with the "all". They are only those whom the Father gave to Christ. It is an impossibility for the "all" to include anyone other than those. We know this because Christ will lose nothing on the last day and will raise up that, and only that, "all". So, those not raised up, they weren't drawn.
[Jhn 6:37-39 KJV]
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
[Jhn 6:44 KJV]
44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
No, not all can spiritually "see". Only those given spiritual sight by God can see and the rest remain blinded.
[2Co 4:3-4 KJV]
3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
[Mat 13:16 KJV]
16 But blessed [are] your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
[Mat 16:17 KJV]
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed [it] unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
If a man believes that he has given faith to himself instead of receiving it from God as a gift, then
the object of his faith is in himself since it is he who gave it to himself.
Anyway, that everyone saved must have belief, there is no doubt, but a true belief comes only through and by Christ's faith which is imputed to the true believer: it is not of oneself but of God. The question is not of whether one who is saved believes, but HOW do they come to that belief.
If someone believes they have given to themselves faith, then they aren't looking to the Son of Man, they are looking to themselves, so those verses do not apply to them.
These verses inform us as to who God was referring to with the "all". They are only those whom the Father gave to Christ. It is an impossibility for the "all" to include anyone other than those. We know this because Christ will lose nothing on the last day and will raise up that, and only that, "all". So, those not raised up, they weren't drawn.
[Jhn 6:37-39 KJV]
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
[Jhn 6:44 KJV]
44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
No, not all can spiritually "see". Only those given spiritual sight by God can see and the rest remain blinded.
[2Co 4:3-4 KJV]
3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
[Mat 13:16 KJV]
16 But blessed [are] your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
[Mat 16:17 KJV]
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed [it] unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
If a man believes that he has given faith to himself instead of receiving it from God as a gift, then
the object of his faith is in himself since it is he who gave it to himself.
Nope. Only the elect will be/have been given spiritual hearing; only the elect will truly thirst. These are things only given by God not man.
Both freewill and election cannot coexist because one invalidates the other - it must only be one OR the other, and it can't be free will
because a spiritually dead person does not have freewill nor are they able to choose because they are spiritually dead.
(to "quicken" is to make someone alive - spiritually alive.)
[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Both freewill and election cannot coexist because one invalidates the other - it must only be one OR the other, and it can't be free will
because a spiritually dead person does not have freewill nor are they able to choose because they are spiritually dead.
(to "quicken" is to make someone alive - spiritually alive.)
[Eph 2:1 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Nope. Christ did die only for a few, otherwise, everyone would become saved, but everyone will not be saved. The world that God so loved is the world to come, not this current world. He so loved it that He sent Christ so that those whom He chose for salvation, could inhabit the new heavens, new earth, and new Holy City. Were it to be this world that God so loved, then He wouldn't destroy it but because it is sin filled, destroy it He will. The world to come on the other hand, will be sinless.
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Just to clarify my previous post, when I said that Christ died only for a few, I meant that few relative to the total
number of people born throughout the history of the world, but a large real number of people. I believe
there will be a great many people under election who become saved by God. However, even if one believes in freewill rather than election, I think using that standard, there will also be a great many who will never become saved.
number of people born throughout the history of the world, but a large real number of people. I believe
there will be a great many people under election who become saved by God. However, even if one believes in freewill rather than election, I think using that standard, there will also be a great many who will never become saved.
If Jacob, whose name God changed to be called Israel, represents spiritual Israel, Then, according to Jeremiah 2:4, would not spiritual Israel be the ones that were backsliding?
Would you agree that Jacob is one of the elect? Rom 8:33-39, nothing will separate his elect from the love of God.
When the born again elect of God commits a sin we separate ourselves from fellowship with God until we repent. Does God divorce us each time we commit adultery with the world?
Would you agree that Jacob is one of the elect? Rom 8:33-39, nothing will separate his elect from the love of God.
When the born again elect of God commits a sin we separate ourselves from fellowship with God until we repent. Does God divorce us each time we commit adultery with the world?