Orthodox Jew answers a few questions

[Kroogz]

The New Testament is a covenant. A covenant is a legally binding agreement on both parties. For example, if you buy a house you have to have a legally binding agreement that sells that house. That covenant is on both parties. If for example the person selling the house lies on that contract it can later be disputed in court, likewise if the person buying the house does not fulfill their end of the contract it also can be nullified.

The covenant includes a promise of salvation for eternity. That is true, but it is also true that there are commandments from Jesus to us, there are warnings that He might say "depart from me workers of iniquity I never knew you".

We are witnesses. That is our assigned job. How is that going for you? Don't tell me, that is between you and Jesus. We are supposed to be building the church with gold, silver and precious stones. How is that going? We are the bride of Christ, one would assume that if you love the Lord and are looking forward to spending eternity with Him you are spending time everyday with Him.

Now if someone claims they are a Christian because 20 years ago they prayed at the altar, and since then they spend their time at the country club and the shopping mall and everywhere but with Jesus, is that the kind of bride that the Lord of Lords deserves?

I believe we have invisible hero's among us. And MANY of them. Fruits and works we will never see. Just looked like a normal person to us.

A husband and wife living as unto the Lord. Raising their kids as unto the Lord. Doing their jobs as unto the Lord. Giving as unto the Lord. friendships as unto the Lord. Soft spoken, unassuming. Never IMPACTED the world......they will have amassed treasures in heaven of untold wealth. On the level of Paul, because they rightly lived their small part in Gods plan for them.

 

[Magenta]

Peter is saying what I am saying it was the Act of God. I definitely agree. Wonder how
since both Peter and Paul mention the Act of God how it became a license to sin?

How did God's grace become perverted into a license to sin? I don't know. I do know many are accused
of this wrongly. And those who do such accusing, when pressed, admit that they too still sin. So they
themselves are guilty of what they accuse others of. The solution is in coming to understand what it
means to be saved, the purpose of the law, and how to walk in God's grace, doing the works which
God prepared in advance for us to do, that we accomplish through God's will working in us.

Which is why we have teachers and why discussion boards like this are often hot-beds of such discussions.
There is a thread here that was very active for many years that is the longest thread on this site.
Not By Works. It helped many newer believers understand the difference between the law and grace.

Also, much of what is written in the Bible is misunderstood in one way or another, and not
understood at all by some... or even read. So it is not just grace that gets misunderstood.

John 6:37

 

[uncle_mike]

How did God's grace become perverted into a license to sin? I don't know. I do know many are accused
of this wrongly. And those who do such accusing, when pressed, admit that they too still sin. So they
themselves are guilty of what they accuse others of. The solution is in coming to understand what it
means to be saved, the purpose of the law, and how to walk in God's grace, doing the works which
God prepared in advance for us to do, that we accomplish through God's will working in us.

Which is why we have teachers and why discussion boards like this are often hot-beds of such discussions.
There is a thread here that was very active for many years that is the longest thread on this site.
Not By Works. It helped many understand the difference between the law and grace.

Also, much of what is written in the Bible is misunderstood in one way or another, and not
understood at all by some... or even read. So it is not just grace that gets misunderstood.

John 6:37

Wonder what kinds of works? When I sin I either feel it that I did or I know I am sinning as I do the sin. To which in both scenarios, I go to God, even if praying in my mind seeking forgiveness of them. To me, confessing sins to be forgiven is not even close to being a work. It's a response to the Holy Spirit telling me I sinned. So it is a communication process, not a work process.

If I have a true relationship with God, it's always a communication process, never a works process.

 

[Kroogz]

Peter is saying what I am saying it was the Act of God. I definitely agree. Wonder how since both Peter and Paul mention the Act of God how it became a license to sin?

Where is the license to sin in Paul's doctrine? I contend, that comes from the loss of salvation crowd.

The prodigal son account shows us this. The account is not detailed on how the son was living. We see lewd living. No specifics.

It was the self righteous, older brother that accused the younger of the specifics. He didn't know what the younger was doing. He was telling on himself. That's what HE would have done if he was out running around.

And we see the younger son restored to his father. But not the older son.

 

[uncle_mike]

Where is the license to sin in Paul's doctrine? I contend, that comes from the loss of salvation crowd.

The prodigal son account shows us this. The account is not detailed on how the son was living. We see lewd living. No specifics.

It was the self righteous, older brother that accused the younger of the specifics. He didn't know what the younger was doing. He was telling on himself. That's what HE would have done if he was out running around.

And we see the younger son restored to his father. But not the older son.

Do You think before the younger son left, he was living righteously? But after he left, he lived sinfully until he returned? Or was the younger son like his older brother and when he left his true colors showed?

 

[Magenta]

Wonder what kinds of works? When I sin I either feel it that I did or I know I am sinning as I do the sin. To which in both scenarios, I go to God, even if praying in my mind seeking forgiveness of them. To me, confessing sins to be forgiven is not even close to being a work. It's a response to the Holy Spirit telling me I sinned. So it is a communication process, not a work process.

Scripture says the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin: of sin, because they do not believe in Me; of
righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; of judgment, because the ruler of
this world is judged. <= John 16:9 We are not of this world. The Holy Spirit convicts the believer of
righteousness. And God chastises those who are His own, sons who are children by grace through
faith. First, He draws us with loving kindness; it is the goodness of God leads a person to repentance.
I don't know why you are talking about confession not being a work. Did someone say it was?

 

[uncle_mike]

Scripture says the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin: of sin, because they do not believe in Me; of
righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; of judgment, because the ruler of
this world is judged. John 16:9 We are not of this world. The Holy Spirit convicts the believer of
righteousness. And God chastises those who are His own, sons those who are children by grace
through faith. First, He draws us with loving kindness; it is the goodness of God leads a person to
repentance. I don't know why you are talking about confession not being a work. Did someone say it was?

Exactly, it's a communication process with us in Christ. If someone sins and they don't hear or feel God chastising them, they better re-examine their walk in God.

 

[Kroogz]

Do You think before the younger son left, he was living righteously? But after he left, he lived sinfully until he returned? Or was the younger son like his older brother and when he left his true colors showed?

That's a hard one to explain in a brief manner. But I will try. By "righteous" my definition would be back in fellowship with his father. Not living a perfect life. By that definition, I would say, yes he was living righteously.

I believe they are both saved.(sons) And fellowship is the whole point of the story. 1 John1:9. When we are out of fellowship with him, every single one of us shows our true colors. I believe the story shows the 2 Negative things we can do as son's.

Grieve the Spirit~~the prodigal. Overt sin, living in the flesh.

Quench the Spirit~~the older son. Self righteousness, living in the flesh.

As long as we are walking in the Spirit and filled with the Spirit, we are in fellowship. as soon as we grieve or quench the Spirit.....All of us let our true colors shine. 1 John 1:9. Name it and site it to God.

And one other observation: The younger son had this sobby,sorrowful,gushy story to tell his father. And the father stopped him as soon as he acknowledged his sin. Name it and site it and carry on.

My brain is tired now!

 

[uncle_mike]

That's a hard one to explain in a brief manner. But I will try. By "righteous" my definition would be back in fellowship with his father. Not living a perfect life. By that definition, I would say, yes he was living righteously.

I believe they are both saved.(sons) And fellowship is the whole point of the story. 1 John1:9. When we are out of fellowship with him, every single one of us shows our true colors. I believe the story shows the 2 Negative things we can do as son's.

Grieve the Spirit~~the prodigal. Overt sin, living in the flesh.

Quench the Spirit~~the older son. Self righteousness, living in the flesh.

As long as we are walking in the Spirit and filled with the Spirit, we are in fellowship. as soon as we grieve or quench the Spirit.....All of us let our true colors shine. 1 John 1:9. Name it and site it to God.

And one other observation: The younger son had this sobby,sorrowful,gushy story to tell his father. And the father stopped him as soon as he acknowledged his sin. Name it and site it and carry on.

My brain is tired now!

I love the explanation. But the thing that stood out the most is the communication here. Older brother and the father, younger brother confessing and the father forgiving. I bet the younger brother went back home out of desperation and having nothing left but the moment he saw his father felt the guilt riddle him. The father knew this and immediately forgave him. I see no evidence of works but communication. You painted a beautiful picture. Go rest Your brain

 

[Kroogz]

I love the explanation. But the thing that stood out the most is the communication here. Older brother and the father, younger brother confessing and the father forgiving. I bet the younger brother went back home out of desperation and having nothing left but the moment he saw his father felt the guilt riddle him. The father knew this and immediately forgave him. I see no evidence of works but communication. You painted a beautiful picture. Go rest Your brain

And I have by no means reached this level yet. But guilt is a sin. There is absolutely no guilt in the Christian way of life. That has not truly sank into this puny brain yet.

 

[uncle_mike]

And I have by no means reached this level yet. But guilt is a sin. There is absolutely no guilt in the Christian way of life. That has not truly sank into this puny brain yet.

I believe, if a person can sin and not feel that sinning is wrong while claiming they're in Christ. They cannot be in Christ.

 

[ZNP]

I believe, if a person can sin and not feel that sinning is wrong while claiming they're in Christ. They cannot be in Christ.

I also believe that people who have a tacit approval of those living in sin are also not in Christ. We are told in Ezekiel, if you see someone sin and say nothing then God will hold you accountable.

 

[uncle_mike]

I also believe that people who have a tacit approval of those living in sin are also not in Christ. We are told in Ezekiel, if you see someone sin and say nothing then God will hold you accountable.

Nice addition. Very good addition actually

 

[Kroogz]

I believe, if a person can sin and not feel that sinning is wrong while claiming they're in Christ. They cannot be in Christ.

The Holy Spirit is in the business of correcting and restoring. We are a new creation. Justified. Righteous in Christ. There is no guilt.

satan is in the business of accusing and condemning and guilt us into separating us from God. Gods Justice and righteousness has been completely satisfied for every believer. Grace draws us near to that fact, guilt drives us away from that fact.

 

[uncle_mike]

The Holy Spirit is in the business of correcting and restoring. We are a new creation. Justified. Righteous in Christ. There is no guilt.

satan is in the business of accusing and condemning and guilt us into separating us from God. Gods Justice and righteousness has been completely satisfied for every believer. Grace draws us near to that fact, guilt drives us away from that fact.

I see what You mean and do agree on the basis of Your post.

 

[ZNP]

The Serpent said "You shall not surely die"

HOW TO SPOT SATAN'S DEADLY DOCTRINES--THE SERPENT'S ANCIENT PLAYBOOK EXPOSED

 

[ZNP]

I believe, if a person can sin and not feel that sinning is wrong while claiming they're in Christ. They cannot be in Christ.

Your life should be aligned with your doctrine.

 

[Moses_Young]

You just stated that G-d's covenant ended when we "murdered" Jesus. That isba direct contradiction of the Torah and Hashem's express words on the subject. Try and be consistent.

Denial of history is another trait of subversives.

Matthew 27:25 25 "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children."

If you truly believed a marriage covenant continues after the death of a spouse, why then did you ask in this very thread:

I know this is completely unrelated, but why under marital status is there no "widow" option?

Obviously, you consider the category "married" to be unsuitable to describe the status of "widow", which is reasonable, as the marriage covenant is ended upon the death of a spouse. Rules for thee but not for me again, and so soon?

 

[Aviva]

Denial of history is another trait of subversives.

Matthew 27:25 25 "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children."

If you truly believed a marriage covenant continues after the death of a spouse, why then did you ask in this very thread:

Obviously, you consider the category "married" to be unsuitable to describe the status of "widow", which is reasonable, as the marriage covenant is ended upon the death of a spouse. Rules for thee but not for me again, and so soon?

Welcome to blocksville

 

[Aviva]

Always nice to see spirt filled Christians trying to troll and taunt a widow. Truly Christ's love and the spirit of G-d is flowing through the evangelical community.