Has anyone found secret messages in the bible?

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NTNT58 said:
You are misinterpreting the candlestick analogy - once the candlesticks got removed, the 7 churches were no more. The Catholic church obviously still has it's candlestick.
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No, the candlesticks represent God's Light... His presence.
We know this because the Lord said He would remove this from them due to their false doctrine

The catholics have been ichabod since their inception as it was thru the catholic so called "church" that satan brought forth false doctrines to water down the True Gospel of Jesus Christ.
 
NTNT58 said:
You have no proof of how much or how little of ancient Hebrew those people know, but either way, post a video of an ancient Hebrew scholar of your choice, and then you'll at least have a valid argument.
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Your still not getting it. You have been hoodwinked by Modern Scholarship if you believe that going to a Bible college automatically means you know that Bible language. But if you cannot speak, read, and write Hebrew fluently like Hebrew people, the college failed to actually teach properly. They scammed a person out of their money. Again, this person is not qualified if they do not know how to even communicate with others in Hebrew fluently in all aspects. They should be able to teach other people who are Hebrew. For example: Take Greek. One of the top Greek grammarians in the world who is fluent in Greek says there is a solecism in the text if 1 John 5:7 is removed. Meaning, he knows the language well enough because he is a local and an expert in that field to say that there is a grammar error if 1 John 5:7 is not there. This is a person who is not KJV Only, either. They just know the language. So when I hear Textual Critics talk about Greek or Hebrew, they are simply not qualified in 90% of the cases. They think going to some school where you came out not really knowing the language qualifies them as being an expert. Such nonsense.
 
Cameron143 said:
My argument isn't that they are corrupt. I'm arguing that they are apostate. Further, I'm arguing that unlike the old covenant which was made to a nation, the new covenant is made with individual believers. Thus, Jews were subject to those in Moses' seat, but Christians are only subject to those who the Holy Spirit subjects us.
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We are not just individual believers, we are all part of the same body - 1 Corinthians 12:13. It doesn't matter how corrupt or apostate the pope is, he still has physical authority according to the Bible. Just like Romans 13:1 tells us to obey all government authority no matter how corrupt.

Cameron143 said:
There is nowhere in scripture that Peter was to begin a line of church leadership. It's all assumed. In fact, there is no mention of the offices of pope, cardinal, etc. The NT church has elders and deacons. We find qualifications and examples of both. I have yet to find the qualifications for any other office. Perhaps it slipped the Apostle's minds to instruct on the subject
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Mathew 16:19 in light of Isiah 22 shows that a king (Jesus) gives a key to heaven (kingdom) to his servant (Peter) with the power to open and shut (bind and loose), and that power is then passed down to his posterity (line of bishops) from Peter all the way to the current pope.
 
JimmyTheLock said:
No, the candlesticks represent God's Light... His presence.
We know this because the Lord said He would remove this from them due to their false doctrine

The catholics have been ichabod since their inception as it was thru the catholic so called "church" that satan brought forth false doctrines to water down the True Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Click to expand...
Pharisees also brought forth false doctrines and Jesus still told everyone to obey their authority (Mathew 23:3)
 
Bible_Highlighter said:
Your still not getting it. You have been hoodwinked by Modern Scholarship if you believe that going to a Bible college automatically means you know that Bible language. But if you cannot speak, read, and write Hebrew fluently like Hebrew people, the college failed to actually teach properly. They scammed a person out of their money. Again, this person is not qualified if they do not know how to even communicate with others in Hebrew fluently in all aspects. They should be able to teach other people who are Hebrew. For example: Take Greek. One of the top Greek grammarians in the world who is fluent in Greek says there is a solecism in the text if 1 John 5:7 is removed. Meaning, he knows the language well enough because he is a local and an expert in that field to say that there is a grammar error if 1 John 5:7 is not there. This is a person who is not KJV Only, either. They just know the language. So when I hear Textual Critics talk about Greek or Hebrew, they are simply not qualified in 90% of the cases. They think going to some school where you came out not really knowing the language qualifies them as being an expert. Such nonsense.
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Do you know the people in the videos? Do you know their education or background? There are countless videos on YouTube all refuting the point you are making, so unless you can prove that ALL those people have no knowledge of ancient Hewbrew, you have no argument. Like I said, post a video from a Hebrew scholar of your choice defending your position, then you'll have a valid argument.
 
NTNT58 said:
Do you know the people in the videos? Do you know their education or background? There are countless videos on YouTube all refuting the point you are making, so unless you can prove that ALL those people have no knowledge of ancient Hewbrew, you have no argument. Like I said, post a video from a Hebrew scholar of your choice defending your position, then you'll have a valid argument.
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This is not my first rodeo or discussion on such matters. Many years I have been debating such things. In my experience and from reading articles and looking at the knowledge of even scholars, they generally do not know the original language intimately like they own native tongue. But like I said, even if they did know, they would be correcting the Word of God and saying His Word is in error. Sorry, I believe God and not men.
 
NTNT58 said:
Pharisees also brought forth false doctrines and Jesus still told everyone to obey their authority (Mathew 23:3)
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Jesus told them they were of their father the devil... so you are confused to think Jesus wants us to follow those that... follow the devil.

That would be claiming Jesus is telling us to turn away from Him...

This must be why the false teachers today tell everyone to follow the false doctrines of martin luther and john calvin and to... ignore what God's Word actually teaches laughing.gif
 
JimmyTheLock said:
No, the candlesticks represent God's Light... His presence.
We know this because the Lord said He would remove this from them due to their false doctrine

The catholics have been ichabod since their inception as it was thru the catholic so called "church" that satan brought forth false doctrines to water down the True Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Click to expand...

I agree with you. The Catholic Church is really bad and has no authority. Anyway, Greetings you in Jesus name. On a side note: We share a common belief in that OSAS is false (or a sin and still be saved type belief). Believers truly need to repent as a part of salvation. No sin can be justified. Granted, this is not the topic of the thread but I wanted to share that with you, seeing you are here. Fornication is removed in certain Modern Bibles and watered down in others. Is it a coincidence that the modern day Christian today thinks sex before marriage (fornication) is not a sin? Back in the past, on a larger scale, Christian grandparents were more traditional on this matter. I have even talked with Christians on another forum who said porn is not a sin. The deception we are faced with in these last days is great. So this means we need to speak the truth in love and shine the light of Christ by our holy conduct all the more (living a resurrected life in Him). The only thing the Catholic Church gets right is the Trinity. The Lord our God is one God and yet He exists as three distinct persons (Father, Word, and Holy Ghost - 1 John 5:7).

In any event, may God bless you this fine day He has made.
 
JimmyTheLock said:
Jesus told them they were of their father the devil... so you are confused to think Jesus wants us to follow those that... follow the devil.

That would be claiming Jesus is telling us to turn away from Him...

This must be why the false teachers today tell everyone to follow the false doctrines of martin luther and john calvin and to... ignore what God's Word actually teaches View attachment 258460
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That's not what Mathew 23:3 says. Jesus told everyone to be subject to their authority, but not their works. Governments are even more corrupt than the Pharasees, and yet Romans 13:1 still tells us to obey all authority, because all authority is ultimately sanctioned by God and anyone who rebells against authority rebells against God. Obviously we must obey them within the context of God's authority, and we must do everything they say as long as it doesn't go against the word of God.
 
JimmyTheLock said:
Jesus told them they were of their father the devil... so you are confused to think Jesus wants us to follow those that... follow the devil.

That would be claiming Jesus is telling us to turn away from Him...

This must be why the false teachers today tell everyone to follow the false doctrines of martin luther and john calvin and to... ignore what God's Word actually teaches View attachment 258460
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He is incorrectly using Matthew 23:3 which says,

"All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.” (Matthew 23:3).

He does not understand that this verse was in regards to only keeping what God’s Word teaches in the Laws of Moses (Which was temporary). He does not understand that Christians are under a different set of Laws and not the 613 Laws of Moses. Believers today keep the Laws that come from Jesus Christ and His followers. Acts 15:1, Acts 15:5, Acts 15:24 makes it clear that Gentile Christians are not under the Laws of Moses. Granted, certain laws have been repeated into the New Covenant like, “Do not murder, do not steal, do not covet,” etcetera. But Christians do not have to keep things like the Saturday Sabbath, circumcision, dietary laws, animal sacrifices, etcetera.

Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed.
Acts 13:39 says we cannot be justified by the laws of Moses.
 
NTNT58 said:
We are not just individual believers, we are all part of the same body - 1 Corinthians 12:13. It doesn't matter how corrupt or apostate the pope is, he still has physical authority according to the Bible. Just like Romans 13:1 tells us to obey all government authority no matter how corrupt.


Mathew 16:19 in light of Isiah 22 shows that a king (Jesus) gives a key to heaven (kingdom) to his servant (Peter) with the power to open and shut (bind and loose), and that power is then passed down to his posterity (line of bishops) from Peter all the way to the current pope.
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Supposition. You can believe in the authority of the pope if you want. I'll follow the Spirit. No light in the RCC. We are not to fellowship with darkness.
Still...where do I find the qualifications of a pope?
 
Bible_Highlighter said:
This is not my first rodeo or discussion on such matters. Many years I have been debating such things. In my experience and from reading articles and looking at the knowledge of even scholars, they generally do not know the original language intimately like they own native tongue. But like I said, even if they did know, they would be correcting the Word of God and saying His Word is in error. Sorry, I believe God and not men.
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Again, that's an argument from authority. If you're such an expert in ancient Hebrew, then use your expertise to refute the argument I made.
 
Cameron143 said:
Supposition. You can believe in the authority of the pope if you want. I'll follow the Spirit. No light in the RCC. We are not to fellowship with darkness.
Still...where do I find the qualifications of a pope?
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Do you follow the laws of your country? Do you break the law when you can get away with it? Romans 13:1 tells us to obey ALL authority, no matter your opinion on the corruption of the government you are under. Is Romans 13:1 supposition as well, and we don't have to follow any law?

Your opinion on their light and corruption is irrelevant, if they have authority, then all Christians are under it, whether they choose to rebel against or not.
 
NTNT58 said:
That's not what Mathew 23:3 says. Jesus told everyone to be subject to their authority, but not their works. Governments are even more corrupt than the Pharasees, and yet Romans 13:1 still tells us to obey all authority, because all authority is ultimately sanctioned by God and anyone who rebells against authority rebells against God. Obviously we must obey them within the context of God's authority, and we must do everything they say as long as it doesn't go against the word of God.
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They have no authority because their candlestick was taken from them for their apostasy. No candlestick = no authority. You either understand or you don't.
 
Cameron143 said:
They have no authority because their candlestick was taken from them for their apostasy. No candlestick = no authority. You either understand or you don't.
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Where in the Bible does it say their candlestick was taken away? Nowhere! You are making it up. And I understand your rebellion, I hate them too, but our feelings on this matter are irrelevant because their authority is sanctioned by God according to the Bible.
 
NTNT58 said:
Where in the Bible does it say their candlestick was taken away? Nowhere! You are making it up. And I understand your rebellion, I hate them too, but our feelings on this matter are irrelevant because their authority is sanctioned by God according to the Bible.
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I don't hate them. But you are making up a line of succession that is not in the new covenant.
 
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