Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked
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Okay, but just to be precise, we are saved by the faith OF Christ (Christ's faith) by which we believe/ come to trust, IN Christ.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith OF Jesus Christ, even we have believed IN Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith OF Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith OF Jesus Christ, even we have believed IN Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith OF Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
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@DJT_47
The penalty of sin, death. That being the case, God will not charge the saved with any sin that results in their death, they are free from the penalty of sin. Those for whom Christ died He obtained for them, in their name, eternal redemption Heb 9:12
12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
The word redemption here is the greek word lýtrōsis:
So they are saved from the penalty of all their sins, and that forever !
The penalty of sin, death. That being the case, God will not charge the saved with any sin that results in their death, they are free from the penalty of sin. Those for whom Christ died He obtained for them, in their name, eternal redemption Heb 9:12
12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
The word redemption here is the greek word lýtrōsis:
- a ransoming, redemption
- deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin
So they are saved from the penalty of all their sins, and that forever !
And yet, Christ had faith, he lived by faith, he is the only one who was righteous in his faith. He was completely obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. God’s righteousness was on display through the faith of Jesus Christ. I beseech thee to come back to the KJV and believe it. Believe every word. Come back brother from your doubt.
Faith come by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Faith come by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
For Christ to have "faithfulness", it had to have come from His "faith" as its byproduct. Don't misunderstand me, I definitely agree that He was faithful - perfectly so- but that was as an out-growth (for lack of a better word) or result of His faith.
It may be your opinion that "faithfulness" is a better translation and maybe it is, but we are told that "faith" has substance and therefore has spiritual presence. It can only be reckoned to someone, if it has substance. Faith also is evidence. I do not claim any expertise in Greek, but from what I can determine, faith and faithful are different words (see definitions below) implying different things.
[Heb 11:1 KJV] 1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Because Christ's faith was/is imputed to those whom He saves, as part of His faith also is His righteousness and His works which are also reckoned with it to someone, and therefore, when reckoned, it is to God as through it were their faith, righteousness and works. That faith comes upon them from becoming born again as a fruit of the Spirit.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
[Phl 3:9 KJV] 9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
[Rom 4:9 KJV] 9 [Cometh] this blessedness then upon the circumcision [only], or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Faith:
pistis (Key)
Pronunciation
pis'-tis
Part of Speech
feminine noun
Faithful:
pistos (Key)
Pronunciation
pis-tos'
Part of Speech
adjective
It may be your opinion that "faithfulness" is a better translation and maybe it is, but we are told that "faith" has substance and therefore has spiritual presence. It can only be reckoned to someone, if it has substance. Faith also is evidence. I do not claim any expertise in Greek, but from what I can determine, faith and faithful are different words (see definitions below) implying different things.
[Heb 11:1 KJV] 1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Because Christ's faith was/is imputed to those whom He saves, as part of His faith also is His righteousness and His works which are also reckoned with it to someone, and therefore, when reckoned, it is to God as through it were their faith, righteousness and works. That faith comes upon them from becoming born again as a fruit of the Spirit.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
[Phl 3:9 KJV] 9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
[Rom 4:9 KJV] 9 [Cometh] this blessedness then upon the circumcision [only], or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Faith:
pistis (Key)
Pronunciation
pis'-tis
Part of Speech
feminine noun
Faithful:
pistos (Key)
Pronunciation
pis-tos'
Part of Speech
adjective
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No, don't think so. True repentance comes to someone from God as a gift. That repentance is manifested in repenting from one's dead works unto the trusting of Christ as Saviour. That kind of repentance can only be given to someone by God it is not of oneself.
[Rom 2:4 KJV]
4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
[Heb 6:1 KJV]
1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
[Rom 2:4 KJV]
4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
[Heb 6:1 KJV]
1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
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No, it is definitely NOT faith "in" Christ - faith "of" Christ is definitely the correct rendering.
Why? because "faith of Christ" is the genitive case, denoting ownership; that is, it is Christ's faith.
"faith in Christ" on the other hand, is not in the genitive case and therefore does not show ownership, unless, that is,
the verse is referring to faith that happens to exist within Christ Himself (again that meaning His faith), not a faith towards Christ.
You can distinguish which one is appropriate by looking at the word's case in its definition.
Why? because "faith of Christ" is the genitive case, denoting ownership; that is, it is Christ's faith.
"faith in Christ" on the other hand, is not in the genitive case and therefore does not show ownership, unless, that is,
the verse is referring to faith that happens to exist within Christ Himself (again that meaning His faith), not a faith towards Christ.
You can distinguish which one is appropriate by looking at the word's case in its definition.
Out of context scriptures you've cited. You can think what you like but the scriptural facts remain that salvation can be lost. A casual study of the Hebrew letter will bear that out. The newly converted Hebrews were warned about the dangers of renouncing Christ and embracing again their old religious beliefs.
Salvation cannot be lost. If it could, it would mean that Christ's offering was insufficient to bring forth eternal salvation but only
a transient salvation.
What do you think these verses mean:
[1Pe 1:4-5 KJV]
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
[Phl 1:6 KJV]
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:
By mentioning Hebrews, I suspect that you are referring to Hebrews 6. To understand the verses in question, read verse 9.
It clearly demonstrates that for those saved, the preceding verses do not apply.
a transient salvation.
What do you think these verses mean:
[1Pe 1:4-5 KJV]
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
[Phl 1:6 KJV]
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:
By mentioning Hebrews, I suspect that you are referring to Hebrews 6. To understand the verses in question, read verse 9.
It clearly demonstrates that for those saved, the preceding verses do not apply.
Simon the sorcerer is said to have “believed and was baptized” at the preaching of Philip (Acts 8:13) but later, when Simon offers the apostles money to have their ability to impart the Holy Spirit (verses 18–19), he is rebuked by Peter. Peter answered: "May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry, because your heart is not right before God. 22 Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. 23 For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity. (verses 20-24)
You called that saved? Even though we read that Simon "believed," the remainder of the verse hints at the true object of his belief: "the miracles and signs which were done." No saving belief in Christ.
You called that saved? Even though we read that Simon "believed," the remainder of the verse hints at the true object of his belief: "the miracles and signs which were done." No saving belief in Christ.