Is sin lawlessness or is sin the transgression of the law?

[JacobMartinMertens]

There is a difference in what the translations say. Are they both true or is there a distinction such that one is true and the other is not?

Is sin lawlessness or is sin the transgression of the law?

1 John 3:4 NASB20 - Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.

1 John 3:4 KJV - Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

 

[Karlon]

think of the 10 commandments. sin is lawlessness in God's view!

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

think of the 10 commandments. sin is lawlessness in God's view!

So, in reference to the Ten Commandments, sin is lawlessness. If I understand you correctly.

 

[Karlon]

So, in reference to the Ten Commandments, sin is lawlessness. If I understand you correctly.

yes, in reference to that but also sin is lawlessness in the WHOLE relationship with Jesus. imagine everyone in the world sinning without repentance! that's lawlessness.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

yes, in reference to that but also sin is lawlessness in the WHOLE relationship with Jesus. imagine everyone in the world sinning without repentance! that's lawlessness.

Okay. Thank you. Are you relating repentance to Jesus though? There is repentance in Jesus. Are you saying that Jesus is not lawless? What about you? I do not want to condemn, I am merely asking the question from what you said about the ramifications of it all or what you are trying to say or what you mean. I may need some clarification, but I am not sure what about. I can let it go. You have a relationship with Jesus I believe, and because you have repented, you or it are or is not lawless.

 

[maxwel]

This isn't a contradiction within scripture itself,
this is just a problem of slight differences in translation.
(Different words are being used to convey the exact same proposition... not something different.)

So we just reconcile the propositional content of the original greek, and the problem is solved.
No dilemma here.

.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

This isn't a contradiction within scripture itself,
this is just a problem of slight differences in translation.

So reconcile the propositional content of the original greek, and the problem is solved.
No dilemma here.

.

I don't know Greek.

I know that theos is translated as God. Or, "theos" is translated "God".

 

[maxwel]

I don't know Greek.

I know that theos is translated as God. Or, "theos" is translated "God".

We could look some words up, and check a few commentaries to clear it up.
But just to be really quick, it looks like the word "lawless" is not being used to mean "no existence of law", but to mean "acting as if the law doesn't apply to you." And that second definition fits with the other translation.

I think we still use the word lawless in both ways.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

We could look some words up, and check a few commentaries to clear it up.
But just to be really quick, it looks like the word "lawless" is not being used to mean "no existence of law", but to mean "acting as if the law doesn't apply to you." And that second definition fits with the other translation.

I think we still use the word lawless in both ways.

There are many ways to understand the word lawless. I believe that I do not know them all.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

There is a difference in what the translations say. Are they both true or is there a distinction such that one is true and the other is not?

Is sin lawlessness or is sin the transgression of the law?

1 John 3:4 NASB20 - Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.

1 John 3:4 KJV - Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

It means the same thing.

 

[selahsays]

Okay. Thank you. Are you relating repentance to Jesus though? There is repentance in Jesus. Are you saying that Jesus is not lawless? What about you? I do not want to condemn, I am merely asking the question from what you said about the ramifications of it all or what you are trying to say or what you mean. I may need some clarification, but I am not sure what about. I can let it go. You have a relationship with Jesus I believe, and because you have repented, you or it are or is not lawless.

I hope this helps:

1 John 1:9 "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

When we in repentance confess our sins, our heavenly Father will forgive us of all our sins. It’s a promise.

 

[Karlon]

Okay. Thank you. Are you relating repentance to Jesus though? There is repentance in Jesus. Are you saying that Jesus is not lawless? What about you? I do not want to condemn, I am merely asking the question from what you said about the ramifications of it all or what you are trying to say or what you mean. I may need some clarification, but I am not sure what about. I can let it go. You have a relationship with Jesus I believe, and because you have repented, you or it are or is not lawless.

yes. all things have been given to Jesus: 1st Timothy 2:5, Collosians 1:19, 3:17, Ephesians 1:22,23, Hebrews 1:1,2, 7;25, 8:10, 9:15, 12:24, 1st Corinthians 10:31to name a few. off to work now.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

It means the same thing.

What is the Law or the law and what is lawlessness?

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

yes. all things have been given to Jesus: 1st Timothy 2:5, Collosians 1:19, 3:17, Ephesians 1:22,23, Hebrews 1:1,2, 7;25, 8:10, 9:15, 12:24, 1st Corinthians 10:31to name a few. off to work now.

Thank you for sharing.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

There is a difference in what the translations say. Are they both true or is there a distinction such that one is true and the other is not?

Is sin lawlessness or is sin the transgression of the law?

1 John 3:4 NASB20 - Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.

1 John 3:4 KJV - Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

means same thing.
with Law in place, sin/transgression, is lawlessness
lawlessness, is sin/transgression, against the Law

sin and transgression, mean, the same thing in context.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

i did bad things to people:
therefore, i sinned or transgressed, against the Law, which is LAWLESSNESS, because Lawlessness [is the "Realm" of unforgiven sin or transgressions], until it is Forgiven.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

means same thing.
with Law in place, sin/transgression, is lawlessness
lawlessness, is sin/transgression, against the Law

sin and transgression, mean, the same thing in context.

I have thought that sin is transgression of the law. But then I was told that the law is not for Gentiles, or is not for our time. Therefore sin is lawlessness. Does that mean when things are really bad?

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

I have thought that sin is transgression of the law. But then I was told that the law is not for Gentiles, or is not for our time. Therefore sin is lawlessness. Does that mean when things are really bad?

everything about the Bible might not apply to us physically like it did the ancient Hebrew People, but, it now applies to us Spiritually.
so understanding the Law, the 613 Laws, Commandments, etc, also can be explained in the New Testament but now called something else.
and bottom line, whether one thinks the Law applies or does not to "Gentile," the Law applies just like ALL SINS apply to the 10 Commandments.

so, if i sin or transgress the Law, and i say I am not under the Law, my Human Sin Nature is Still UNDER the 10 Commandments, like the Law is also under the 10 Commandments. when i sin, it can be literally found in these Commandments. So, using the Law or Commandments, the human Sin Nature, is still, held to the Standard that [defines] sin.

 

[JacobMartinMertens]

everything about the Bible might not apply to us physically like it did the ancient Hebrew People, but, it now applies to us Spiritually.
so understanding the Law, the 613 Laws, Commandments, etc, also can be explained in the New Testament but now called something else.
and bottom line, whether one thinks the Law applies or does not to "Gentile," the Law applies just like ALL SINS apply to the 10 Commandments.

so, if i sin or transgress the Law, and i say I am not under the Law, my Human Sin Nature is Still UNDER the 10 Commandments, like the Law is also under the 10 Commandments. when i sin, it can be literally found in these Commandments. So, using the Law or Commandments, the human Sin Nature, is still, held to the Standard that [defines] sin.

Is being under the law about sin or seeking justification? Is it about obedience or sin? Because Christians are not under the law. At least that is something I know, heard, learned, or understood or understand.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Is being under the law about sin or seeking justification? Is it about obedience or sin? Because Christians are not under the law. At least that is something I know, heard, learned, or understood or understand.

we are not under the law in our spiritual being inside of our human sinful being.
the human sinful being, is still held to its ruler, which can be defined by the Law or Commandments as [sin].
but while our human sin nature is held to this, our spiritual being, that is now ALIVE through Christ Jesus, and it is under no condemnation.

reason we repent, because our spirit body connected to God, wants nothing to do with the sins we commit. the Holy Spirit, alerts us, we have sinned. God, would not let us know that we have sinned, unless sinning, is a problem. and God, ALWAYS, lets me know when i have sinned.