The Cross, Lords Supper & Todays Application

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,267
432
83
#1
Isa 53:
4 But [in fact] He has borne our griefs, And He has carried our sorrows and pains; Yet we [ignorantly] assumed that He was stricken, Struck down by God and degraded and humiliated [by Him].

5 But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was crushed for our wickedness [our sin, our injustice, our wrongdoing]; The punishment [required] for our well-being fell on Him, And by His stripes (wounds) we are healed.

1 Pet 2:
23 While being reviled and insulted, He did not revile or insult in return; while suffering, He made no threats [of vengeance], but kept entrusting Himself to Him who judges fairly.

24 He personally carried our sins in His body on the [g]cross [willingly offering Himself on it, as on an altar of sacrifice], so that we might die to sin [becoming immune from the penalty and power of sin] and live for righteousness; for by His wounds you [who believe] have been [h]healed.

(MY NOTE: Pre cross Isaiah says by His stripes/wounds we ARE healed. Post cross Peter say's by His stripes/wounds believers HAVE BEEN healed)

Matt 8 accentuates why His Body was Broken

Matt 8:
16 When evening came, many who were demon-possessed were brought to him, and he drove out the spirits with a word & ""healed ALL the sick""

17 This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet Isaiah: "He took up our infirmities" "& bore our diseases"

(MY NOTE: Via the Holy Spirit Jesus healed ALL sickness. Took our infirmities/weakness & bore our diseases <plural)

Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words: [ 2,,G771, asthenema ] INFIRMITY
akin to No. 1, is found in the plural in Romans 15:1, "infirmities," i.e., those scruples which arise through weakness of faith. Vine's Note: In Luke 7:21, AV, nosos, "a disease," is translated "infirmities" (RV, "diseases").

1 Cor 11:
23 For I received from the Lord Himself that [instruction] which I passed on to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night in which He was betrayed took bread;

24 and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, “This is (represents) My body, which is [offered as a sacrifice] for you. Do this in [affectionate] remembrance of Me.”

25 In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant [ratified and established] in My blood; do this, as often as you drink it, in [affectionate] remembrance of Me.”

26 For every time you eat this bread and drink this cup, you are [symbolically] proclaiming [the fact of] the Lord’s death until He comes [again]. (Also see Matt 26:26,27,28, Mk 14:22,23,24, Lk 22:17,18,19)

The Lord implemented this ordinance:

John 6:53 Jesus said, Truly, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, """""ye have NO LIFE in you"""""

Jn 6:53 Jesus said, Truly, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, """""ye have NO LIFE in you"""""

Recap: Jesus body was broken for every believers transgressions & healing (spiritual & physical). His blood was shed to establish & ratify a/the new eternal (Heb 9:12&15) covenant. We are to remember what He did at the cross, I believe weekly (Lev 7;6, 24:8-9, Acts 20:7).

Ps 105:37 They ate the LAMB & the next day: Although many were old "NOT ONE WAS FEEBLE AMOUNG THEM"

Final Thought:
Love GIVES: God so LOVED, He GAVE His Son (Jn 3:16)

Grace SUPPLIES:
Phil 4:19 And my God will liberally supply (fill until full) your every need according to His riches in glory in Christ Jesus.

Tit 2:11 For the [remarkable, undeserved] grace of God that [a]brings salvation has appeared to all men.
(MY NOTE: Christ & His finished sacrificial work brings salvation & unlimited supply)

Faith ACCESSES/TAKES: Rom 5:1-2, Eph 2:8.

Matthew 7:
7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
(A) Ask
(S) Seek
(K) Knock

8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?

10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?

11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?
(MY NOTE: ASK!)

Eph 3:
20 Now to Him who is able to [carry out His purpose and] do superabundantly more than all that we dare ask or think [infinitely beyond our greatest prayers, hopes, or dreams], according to His power that is at work within us,
(MY NOTE: His supply is limitless!)

21 to Him be the glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations forever and ever. Amen.

Phil 4:6 Do not be anxious or worried about anything, but in everything [every circumstance and situation] by prayer and petition with thanksgiving, continue to make your [specific] requests known to God.
(MY NOTE: ASK!)

Phil 4:19 And my God will liberally supply (fill until full) your every need according to His riches in glory in Christ Jesus

2 Cor 9:8 And God is able to make all grace [every favor and earthly blessing] come in abundance to you, so that you may always [under all circumstances, regardless of the need] have complete sufficiency in everything [being completely self-sufficient in Him], and have an abundance for every good work and act of charity.

Ja 4:2 (D) You do not have because you do not ask [it of God].

1 Jn 4:17 In this [union and fellowship with Him], love is completed and perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment [with assurance and boldness to face Him]; because as He is, so are we in this world.

Time to start ASKING & without faith it is impossible to please or receive from Him. Whatever your lack/need He has the SUPPLY. The Lord Jesus is the same today (Heb 13:8) as He was in Matt when He healed ALL their sickness & disease.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,697
593
113
#2
MY NOTE: Via the Holy Spirit Jesus healed ALL sickness. Took our infirmities/weakness & bore our diseases <plural)
Great post -----but here i believe your a bit confused ------when you say VIA the Holy Spirit Jesus heals ALL sickness ------

My view on this

The Blood Jesus shed on His back from the flogging He endured purchased our healing ---both Spiritually and Physically ------ the Holy Spirit had not come yet to indwell in the Believer ----so we had the healing available before the Holy Spirit came ----Our Faith must be in Jesus who already purchased our healing for us -----

The Scripture does not really say how many stripes Jesus took but this scripture gives us and indication of how many stripes were allotted for Flogging ----

Deuteronomy 25

New International Version

25 When people have a dispute, they are to take it to court and the judges will decide the case, acquitting the innocent and condemning the guilty.

2 If the guilty person deserves to be beaten, the judge shall make them lie down and have them flogged in his presence with the number of lashes the crime deserves,

3 but the judge must not impose more than
forty lashes. If the guilty party is flogged more than that, your fellow Israelite will be degraded in your eyes.



You can view here the 70 functions of the Holy Spirit with scripture --Healing us spiritually or physically is not one of the functions ------

https://revtrev.com/live-light/70-functions-of-the-holy-spirit/

Jesus is our great physician -----



Jesus who is full of Grace and truth has made available our Healing ----Our Faith in Jesus Receives the healing He provided for us ------
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,267
432
83
#3
Great post -----but here i believe your a bit confused ------when you say VIA the Holy Spirit Jesus heals ALL sickness ------
You're free to believe whatever you chose.

I stand behind the post. ALL miracles were preformed VIA the HOLY SPIRIT!

Lk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
(MY NOTE: Translators capitalized > Spirit (showing deity) I.E. the Holy Spirit to: deliver captives, restore the of sight to the blind etc)

Matt 10:1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.
(MY NOTE: The Holy Spirit is where this this miracle power came from)

Lk 9:
1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.
(MY NOTE: The Holy Spirit is where this this miracle healing power came from)

Matt 12:27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.

Matt 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
MY NOTE: Jesus tells them it's: VIA the HOLY SPIRIT these devils are cast out!)

Acts 19:

11 And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul:
(MY NOTE: GOD VIA HIS HOLY SPIRIT worked miracles by the hands of Paul)

12 So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.
(MY NOTE: VIA HIS HOLY SPIRIT GOD worked these miracles by the hands of Paul)

1 Cor 12:
7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
(MY NOTE: Translators capitalized > Spirit (showing deity) I.E. the Holy Spirit)

8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
(MY NOTE: For by one Spirit < Translators capitalized > Spirit (showing deity) I.E. the Holy Spirit)

9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
(MY NOTE: The word of wisdom, word of knowledge, gifts of healing ALL by preformed by the same Spirit = VIA the Holy Spirit)
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,697
593
113
#4
You're free to believe whatever you chose.
And you are as well but as long as you know that you are wrongly dividing the Word of God ---in telling others that they are healed by the Holy Spirit -------you are giving people False hope if they want healing and are Relying on the Holy Spirit to heal them

There is not one scripture that says the Holy Spirit heals you -----it is your faith in Jesus to Heal you that can heal you ------

There are 9 Gifts of the Holy Spirit and Healing is one of them ---that the Holy Spirit can give to A Person for God's purpose of advancing His earthly Kingdom ---but not all people receive this ----it takes the infilling of the Holy Spirit to have these gifts -----
  1. Word of wisdom
  2. Word of knowledge
  3. Gift of faith
  4. Gift of healing
  5. Working of miracles
  6. Prophecy
  7. Distinguishing between spirits
  8. Speaking in tongues
  9. Interpreting tongues


I say
That is different than the Healing provided by Jesus as your healing is already there for you when you receive Jesus in your heart -------your physical and Spiritual healing are in place when you are saved ----Jesus took all sickness and disease with Him on the Cross ----not the Holy Spirit -----

God's grace made your healing available ---your Faith in what Jesus did on the Cross receives it ------Healing is there but you have to receive it -----

This Word -----Receive--- in Greek -----

HELPS Word-studies
1209 déxomai – properly, to receive in a welcoming (receptive) way. with the accusative of person to receive, with the accusative of person to receive, grant access to,

1209 (déxomai) is used of people welcoming God (His offers), like receiving and sharing in His salvation and thoughts

1209/dexomai ---- means receive with "ready reception what is offered" i.e. "welcome with appropriate reception" This stresses the high level of self-involvement (interest) involved with the "welcoming-receiving."

I say ------This what it says here is important as many have no idea that they need to receive with ready reception what is offered -----that is up to us -----Faith always requires a positive response and you need to welcome Healing unto yourself -------for it to take hold -----

Example
If someone gives you a free gift ---and they leave it on your table and never pick it up then the gift is there but you haven't personally received it or claimed it ---so it remains there for you until you put your Faith into action that it is your gift and you then go pick it up ----which is bringing unto yourself and open it and claim it -----your granting access to what is available to you -----


Matthew 9:18-25

New Living Translation
Jesus Heals in Response to Faith ----

20 Just then a woman who had been subject to bleeding for twelve years came up behind him and touched the edge of his cloak. 21 She said to herself, “If I only touch his cloak, I will be healed.”

I say
Her Faith in Jesus to heal her moved her to be healed -----She receive with "ready reception what is offered"


I say -----Faith in who -----Jesus ---who is the Great Physician-----not the Holy Spirit -----

Jesus is the Word ------Faith in Jesus ----the Word ---to heal us is needed for Healing -----


 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,267
432
83
#5
And you are as well but as long as you know that you are wrongly dividing the Word of God ---in telling others that they are healed by the Holy Spirit -------you are giving people False hope if they want healing and are Relying on the Holy Spirit to heal them

There is not one scripture that says the Holy Spirit heals you -----it is your faith in Jesus to Heal you that can heal you ------

There are 9 Gifts of the Holy Spirit and Healing is one of them ---that the Holy Spirit can give to A Person for God's purpose of advancing His earthly Kingdom ---but not all people receive this ----it takes the infilling of the Holy Spirit to have these gifts -----
  1. Word of wisdom
  2. Word of knowledge
  3. Gift of faith
  4. Gift of healing
  5. Working of miracles
  6. Prophecy
  7. Distinguishing between spirits
  8. Speaking in tongues
  9. Interpreting tongues


I say
That is different than the Healing provided by Jesus as your healing is already there for you when you receive Jesus in your heart -------your physical and Spiritual healing are in place when you are saved ----Jesus took all sickness and disease with Him on the Cross ----not the Holy Spirit -----

God's grace made your healing available ---your Faith in what Jesus did on the Cross receives it ------Healing is there but you have to receive it -----

This Word -----Receive--- in Greek -----

HELPS Word-studies
1209 déxomai – properly, to receive in a welcoming (receptive) way. with the accusative of person to receive, with the accusative of person to receive, grant access to,

1209 (déxomai) is used of people welcoming God (His offers), like receiving and sharing in His salvation and thoughts

1209/dexomai ---- means receive with "ready reception what is offered" i.e. "welcome with appropriate reception" This stresses the high level of self-involvement (interest) involved with the "welcoming-receiving."

I say ------This what it says here is important as many have no idea that they need to receive with ready reception what is offered -----that is up to us -----Faith always requires a positive response and you need to welcome Healing unto yourself -------for it to take hold -----

Example
If someone gives you a free gift ---and they leave it on your table and never pick it up then the gift is there but you haven't personally received it or claimed it ---so it remains there for you until you put your Faith into action that it is your gift and you then go pick it up ----which is bringing unto yourself and open it and claim it -----your granting access to what is available to you -----


Matthew 9:18-25

New Living Translation
Jesus Heals in Response to Faith ----

20 Just then a woman who had been subject to bleeding for twelve years came up behind him and touched the edge of his cloak. 21 She said to herself, “If I only touch his cloak, I will be healed.”

I say
Her Faith in Jesus to heal her moved her to be healed -----She receive with "ready reception what is offered"


I say -----Faith in who -----Jesus ---who is the Great Physician-----not the Holy Spirit -----

Jesus is the Word ------Faith in Jesus ----the Word ---to heal us is needed for Healing -----


ALL miracles were preformed VIA the HOLY SPIRIT!


Matt 10:1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.
(MY NOTE: The Holy Spirit is where this this miracle power came from)

Lk 9:
1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.
(MY NOTE: The Holy Spirit is where this this miracle healing power came from)

Matt 12:27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.

Matt 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
MY NOTE: Jesus tells them it's: VIA the HOLY SPIRIT these devils are cast out!)
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,697
593
113
#6
Healing is not a miracle --Physical and Spiritual healing are available when you receive your Salvation -----

SOZO

Strong's Concordance
sózó: to save

I save, heal, preserve, rescue.
universally, τινα, one (from injury or peril); to save a suffering one (from perishing), e. g. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health:

Sozo is a Greek word meaning wholeness… • wholeness in spirit • wholeness in soul (mind, will, and emotions) • wholeness in body. It is complete healing for body, soul, and spirit.

I say
Healing from illness and disease is already done and in Place by Jesus ---not the Holy Spirit

The Holy Spirit Gives A PERSON A GIFT TO HEAL and DO Miracles through His INFILLING of the Person ---He gives the PERSON THE ABILITY to do a specific task for God ----I agree with This ---but the Holy Spirit cannot heal you HIMSELF of any Disease or Illness----Jesus Heals ----by and through our Faith in Him to Heal us ---

And all the Disciples at Pentecost had the infilling of the HOLY SPIRIT -----which means they were Given power---the ability -------to Heal and cast out demons etc so that they could win souls and expand the Church ------- The Infilling of the Holy Spirit is given for a specific task that God wants to accomplish -----

That is not the same as Receiving Salvation and in that package of Salvation is your Healing of Sickness and disease -----that Jesus accomplished for us ------But you have to RECERIVE that Healing ---bring it unto yourself ------

So we need to be careful and not Give False Hope to people telling them that they can get healing from the Holy Spirit ------

Where in the Bible does it say Jesus is a healer?

Matthew 9:35. Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness.

It is the same today -----Jesus heals us ------

Jesus Heals ---the Holy Spirit Give a Gift of Healing to A Person To heal for God's purpose -------The Holy Spirit Himself does not heal us ------please get that Folks -----the Holy Spirit is a Gift Giver ------

Jesus You Are My Healer (Official Live Video) - Don Moen

 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,267
432
83
#7
Healing is not a miracle --Physical and Spiritual healing are available when you receive your Salvation -----

SOZO

Strong's Concordance
sózó: to save

I save, heal, preserve, rescue.
universally, τινα, one (from injury or peril); to save a suffering one (from perishing), e. g. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health:

Sozo is a Greek word meaning wholeness… • wholeness in spirit • wholeness in soul (mind, will, and emotions) • wholeness in body. It is complete healing for body, soul, and spirit.

I say
Healing from illness and disease is already done and in Place by Jesus ---not the Holy Spirit

The Holy Spirit Gives A PERSON A GIFT TO HEAL and DO Miracles through His INFILLING of the Person ---He gives the PERSON THE ABILITY to do a specific task for God ----I agree with This ---but the Holy Spirit cannot heal you HIMSELF of any Disease or Illness----Jesus Heals ----by and through our Faith in Him to Heal us ---

And all the Disciples at Pentecost had the infilling of the HOLY SPIRIT -----which means they were Given power---the ability -------to Heal and cast out demons etc so that they could win souls and expand the Church ------- The Infilling of the Holy Spirit is given for a specific task that God wants to accomplish -----

That is not the same as Receiving Salvation and in that package of Salvation is your Healing of Sickness and disease -----that Jesus accomplished for us ------But you have to RECERIVE that Healing ---bring it unto yourself ------

So we need to be careful and not Give False Hope to people telling them that they can get healing from the Holy Spirit ------

Where in the Bible does it say Jesus is a healer?

Matthew 9:35. Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness.

It is the same today -----Jesus heals us ------

Jesus Heals ---the Holy Spirit Give a Gift of Healing to A Person To heal for God's purpose -------The Holy Spirit Himself does not heal us ------please get that Folks -----the Holy Spirit is a Gift Giver ------

Jesus You Are My Healer (Official Live Video) - Don Moen

Find additional verses to the ones already cited earlier in this thread.

The POWER to do mighty works & miracle's ALWAY'S comes from the Holy Spirit. In many cases FAITH is a conduit/assess point. But, not always. READ Lk 10:19, 24:49, Acts 1:8 3:12, Rom 15:19 below.

Mk 3:
14 And he ordained twelve, that they should be with him, and that he might send them forth to preach,

15 And to have power to heal sicknesses, and to cast out devils:
(MY NOTE: Jesus sent them forth with POWER to heal sicknesses & cast out devils)

Mk 6:
7 And he called unto him the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits;

13 And they cast out many devils, and anointed with oil many that were sick, and healed them.
(MY NOTE: Jesus/God GAVE them POWER to cast out many devils & heal the sick)

Lk 10:
19 Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
(MY NOTE: Jesus/God gave them POWER to tread on serpents & scorpions. Jesus GAVE them POWER over the enemy)

Lk 24:49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.
(MY NOTE: Jesus promises to SEND them: The promise (= Holy Spirit see Jn 7:38-38) of my Father. That will endue them with POWER)

Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
(MY NOTE: Jesus says you will receive POWER after the Holy Spitrt comes upon you)

Acts 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
(MY NOTE Peter says, we didn't heal this man from our own POWER)

Rom 15:19 Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
(MY NOTE: Paul received POWER by the Spirit < Translators capitalize spirit to show deity. To do mighty signs & wonders)

The POWER to do mighty works & miracle's ALWAY'S comes from the Holy Spirit. In many cases FAITH is a conduit/assess point. But, not always, READ Lk 10:19, 24:49, Acts 1:8 3:12, Rom 15:19 below.