He said no one knew the date before the cross in the 1st century but more info came after he spoke about it and now we have signs of that 42 month period which just precedes the Coming, as well as the 3.5 day from when the two prophets are killed, and when they resurrect we know the Coming will happen that day.
There will be no Rapture!!!
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He said no one knew the date before the cross in the 1st century but more info came after he spoke about it and now we have signs of that 42 month period which just precedes the Coming, as well as the 3.5 day from when the two prophets are killed, and when they resurrect we know the Coming will happen that day.
It does say that:
2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
There will be no gathering to Christ (rapture) until the Apostasy and man of sin's revealing takes place which places the rapture after the tribulation.
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Enoch, for the days between Adam and Noah, was the Prophet of God, like we would read later concerning Moses, Elijah, Isaiah, Ezekiel, and so forth. Enoch, is no different than Elijah, Caught Up, and with Elijah no World Ending Event took place for Elisha's time or afterwords.
Enoch and Elijah still have unfinished business.
Most people add Moses, due to the Mount of Figuration, but that exemplified Jesus fulfillment of the LAW and Prophecy concerning Him to that point and beyond. Not that those 2 are the 2 Witnesses.
It's why I read my KJV or ESV Old Testament and then go immediately to my Torah/Tanakh to make sure I have the complete and proper viewpoint of what God is telling Moses [Writer of Genesis] concerning the History of Creation till the Now.
Noah's Event, does show the Favor of God for Enoch towards Enoch's Great Grandson. But it's not a Rapture and then 2nd half of Tribulation event. If so, then we must make Elijah's Rapture Event into another 2nd half of Tribulation event. And we know that won't work.
Even 70 AD is not WORLDWIDE Tribulation, it's isolated Tribulation. So these Events connecting to a Rapture should connect to a World Wide Event.
Now, we can say, Jesus Ascended [like a Rapture] and then 70 AD happened as He Prophesied, but that is not WORLDWIDE, it's Isolated.
But what the Apostle John speaks about and Peter and Paul and Jesus is concerning a WORLDWIDE Event, like NOAH.
In Fact, Sodom was only a CITY, but Jesus, only likens Sodom to the WORLDWIDE Event because of People's behavior and the Destruction that will resemble the ashes of Sodom.
It's the Same with NOAH, Jesus, likens NOAH and LOT to People's behavior and then Destruction.
......
And concerning the AC siting on the Throne.
it's no different than when the 2 Witnesses are Rapture'd
no different than the 144k evangelizing after the exit of the 2 Witnesses and many people from all nations are Coming to Christ
no different than the False Prophet commanding to take the MOB
no different than the Jews having permission to build their Temple
no different than TODAY, where we KNOW, we are closer to 7 years from the Second Coming because when Tribulation begins, we won't know the difference at all. it will be another day.
We have all the Time we need to be Prepared and Ready.
I get up and think 7 years from now. one day, I will either be Rapture'd or I will KNOW about the TWO WITNESSES Preaching, then it's possible I will SEE the AC/Beast and False Prophet. And I will only KNOW this much about the Coming of Christ, it will be soon.
Matthew 24, Jesus Commands, to WATCH [in those days] [our days now]. Said to Watch the Stars and Moon and Events happening that it means He is Coming Soon.
So, even if we think ok here's the AC, Jesus comes now in 3 and half years, that's not saying anything different than what Jesus said we are to be Looking For in Matthew 24.
Enoch and Elijah still have unfinished business.
Most people add Moses, due to the Mount of Figuration, but that exemplified Jesus fulfillment of the LAW and Prophecy concerning Him to that point and beyond. Not that those 2 are the 2 Witnesses.
It's why I read my KJV or ESV Old Testament and then go immediately to my Torah/Tanakh to make sure I have the complete and proper viewpoint of what God is telling Moses [Writer of Genesis] concerning the History of Creation till the Now.
Noah's Event, does show the Favor of God for Enoch towards Enoch's Great Grandson. But it's not a Rapture and then 2nd half of Tribulation event. If so, then we must make Elijah's Rapture Event into another 2nd half of Tribulation event. And we know that won't work.
Even 70 AD is not WORLDWIDE Tribulation, it's isolated Tribulation. So these Events connecting to a Rapture should connect to a World Wide Event.
Now, we can say, Jesus Ascended [like a Rapture] and then 70 AD happened as He Prophesied, but that is not WORLDWIDE, it's Isolated.
But what the Apostle John speaks about and Peter and Paul and Jesus is concerning a WORLDWIDE Event, like NOAH.
In Fact, Sodom was only a CITY, but Jesus, only likens Sodom to the WORLDWIDE Event because of People's behavior and the Destruction that will resemble the ashes of Sodom.
It's the Same with NOAH, Jesus, likens NOAH and LOT to People's behavior and then Destruction.
......
And concerning the AC siting on the Throne.
it's no different than when the 2 Witnesses are Rapture'd
no different than the 144k evangelizing after the exit of the 2 Witnesses and many people from all nations are Coming to Christ
no different than the False Prophet commanding to take the MOB
no different than the Jews having permission to build their Temple
no different than TODAY, where we KNOW, we are closer to 7 years from the Second Coming because when Tribulation begins, we won't know the difference at all. it will be another day.
We have all the Time we need to be Prepared and Ready.
I get up and think 7 years from now. one day, I will either be Rapture'd or I will KNOW about the TWO WITNESSES Preaching, then it's possible I will SEE the AC/Beast and False Prophet. And I will only KNOW this much about the Coming of Christ, it will be soon.
Matthew 24, Jesus Commands, to WATCH [in those days] [our days now]. Said to Watch the Stars and Moon and Events happening that it means He is Coming Soon.
So, even if we think ok here's the AC, Jesus comes now in 3 and half years, that's not saying anything different than what Jesus said we are to be Looking For in Matthew 24.
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Thanks friend for you literally made me laugh out loud..., You are actually saying because I believe in a pre trib rapture, I could be duped one day into thinking I have gone into heaven, which is a fake heaven 
and received my new immortal body when I wont have , and I presume come face to face with my Lord, but its a parlor trick by Satan to deceive us which is followed up by you saying and believing that you think this is not an outrageous idea
and received my new immortal body when I wont have , and I presume come face to face with my Lord, but its a parlor trick by Satan to deceive us which is followed up by you saying and believing that you think this is not an outrageous idea -
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what we have DIFFERENT than NOAH and LOT is we are LOOKING for ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT and BANKING. [Possibly the Temple rebuilt]
In 70 AD, Matthew 24, Jesus tells the Judeans, to hide in the mountains when Jerusalem is being raided they did. All 100% Judeans [Christians] are said to have survived 70 AD.
So, the Judeans are like LOT, go hide, but not out of the way as Rapture'd
In 70 AD, Matthew 24, Jesus tells the Judeans, to hide in the mountains when Jerusalem is being raided they did. All 100% Judeans [Christians] are said to have survived 70 AD.
So, the Judeans are like LOT, go hide, but not out of the way as Rapture'd
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this is what's cool is knowing Matthew 24 is an Event that is prophesied and then ANOTHER EVENT is prophesied that also explains what us CHRISTIANS are to do do DURING the TRIBULATION.
We see the JUDEANS [Christians in Jesus Day] be told to hide in mountains when Jerusalem is raided. [happened 70 AD and ALL Judeans were saved].
And then we read further about US.
and LOOK, we don't get Rapture'd either. we, like the Judeans of Jesus Day, have our specific orders and says IMMEDIATELY when Tribulation is over, Jesus, GATHERS His Elect!
We see the JUDEANS [Christians in Jesus Day] be told to hide in mountains when Jerusalem is raided. [happened 70 AD and ALL Judeans were saved].
And then we read further about US.
and LOOK, we don't get Rapture'd either. we, like the Judeans of Jesus Day, have our specific orders and says IMMEDIATELY when Tribulation is over, Jesus, GATHERS His Elect!
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what do we NOTICE about NOAH, LOT, the JUDEANS?
They were Commanded to build Ark, go and don't look back at Sodom, to go Hide in the Mountains.
Where did any of them get RAPTURE'D?
So tell me, they were Commanded and they obeyed.
What, if they "did not" obey?
What, if "we" don't obey?
the Judeans [70 AD] were Christians like us [Jesus had died/resurrected/ascended] and they were not REMOVED but Commanded to HIDE!
They were Commanded to build Ark, go and don't look back at Sodom, to go Hide in the Mountains.
Where did any of them get RAPTURE'D?
So tell me, they were Commanded and they obeyed.
What, if they "did not" obey?
What, if "we" don't obey?
the Judeans [70 AD] were Christians like us [Jesus had died/resurrected/ascended] and they were not REMOVED but Commanded to HIDE!
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let this sink into the minds of the pr-tribbers:
the Judeans [70 AD] were Christians like us [Jesus had died/resurrected/ascended] and they were not REMOVED but Commanded to HIDE!
I would PROPOSE THEY were better and TRUER Followers of Jesus than we have ever been and they were not Rapture'd!
the Judeans [70 AD] were Christians like us [Jesus had died/resurrected/ascended] and they were not REMOVED but Commanded to HIDE!
I would PROPOSE THEY were better and TRUER Followers of Jesus than we have ever been and they were not Rapture'd!
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Again, pretrib falls short in actually providing Biblical evidence for the position. Pre-tribbers assume pretrib and read it into the passage, even against the plain sense of the text. Talk about stuck in the same rut.
I see a lot from your posts in the way of bragging about how great pre-trib and pretribbers are and in insulting post tribbers. How about taking that effort to dig up some Biblical evidence for pre-trib. But since you haven't been able to do that, how about just abandoning the position?
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This must be the worst mistake any post-tribber has ever made...
Let everyone witness the fact that this post-tribber has in effect said that the Lord Jesus Christ is THE DEVIL.
It doesn't get any worse than that! Shocking? Yes. Embarrassing? Yes. Outrageous? Worse than that.
And @selahsays ....every legit Bible scholar know that the Second Coming of Jesus occurs in Rev 11:19.
After the AC rises to eminence and makes war with the Saints. After the mark of the beast rolls out. After the bowl judgements are rendered for the beast-worshippers.
Rev 8:7
The first angel sounded
Rev 8:8
And the second angel sounded
Rev 8:10
And the third angel sounded
Rev 8:12
And the fourth angel sounded
Rev 8:13
And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!
Rev 9:1
And the fifth angel sounded (1ST WOE)
Rev 9:12
One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter.
Rev 9:13
And the sixth angel sounded (2ND WOE)
Rev 11:14
The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
Rev 11:15
And the seventh angel sounded (3RD WOE)
Rev 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters ***of the earth***and of the sea! for the ***devil*** is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Let everyone witness the fact that this post-tribber has in effect said that the Lord Jesus Christ is THE DEVIL.
It doesn't get any worse than that! Shocking? Yes. Embarrassing? Yes. Outrageous? Worse than that.
And @selahsays ....every legit Bible scholar know that the Second Coming of Jesus occurs in Rev 11:19.
After the AC rises to eminence and makes war with the Saints. After the mark of the beast rolls out. After the bowl judgements are rendered for the beast-worshippers.
Rev 8:7
The first angel sounded
Rev 8:8
And the second angel sounded
Rev 8:10
And the third angel sounded
Rev 8:12
And the fourth angel sounded
Rev 8:13
And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!
Rev 9:1
And the fifth angel sounded (1ST WOE)
Rev 9:12
One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter.
Rev 9:13
And the sixth angel sounded (2ND WOE)
Rev 11:14
The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
Rev 11:15
And the seventh angel sounded (3RD WOE)
Rev 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters ***of the earth***and of the sea! for the ***devil*** is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
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After the thread has been around, cv5 usually claims some kind of victory like this, after, again, no one has given any kind of Biblical evidence for pretrib.... just argued how this and that verse is supposed to fit into the pre-trib system.
The main flawed assumptions underpinning the system-- for example the idea that there is more than one parousia of Christ in the futrure, is never supported.
The main flawed assumptions underpinning the system-- for example the idea that there is more than one parousia of Christ in the futrure, is never supported.
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