Jesus, before becoming a man

[Magenta]

Personally, I don't get how people that lower Jesus' diety on this site remain members of it.

They don't, usually... unless they make an effort to fly under the radar, as it were...

 

[posthuman]

(There was also a mysterious guy who wrestled with Jacob)

yes, and Someone visible and tangible, looking like a mam, Who announced the birth of Samson, said His name is Wonderful, and the scripture calls Him God...

 

[posthuman]

Hopefully this thread also challenges those on this site who believe Jesus is a lesser being than the Father.

Personally, I don't get how people that lower Jesus' diety on this site remain members of it.

Its central to receiving salvation

It is exactly the topic of the Nicene council.

And the Arians were banished from the empire for their heresy, but what tends to happen when you banish heretics is that they become missionaries...

 

[posthuman]

Jesus' starship can exceed warp 10, so He doesn't have to do that sling-shot thingy around the sun like us mortals do...?

 

[FollowingtheWay]

.



(There was also a mysterious guy who wrestled with Jacob)

Anyway: if the Word's flesh per John 1:14 pre-existed Jesus' birth in
Bethlehem, then the Word's flesh would require two genealogies: to wit: one
genealogy connecting the Word's flesh to Adam, and another genealogy to
connect the Word's flesh to someone other than Adam.

Well; it's a relatively simple task to connect the Word's flesh to Adam, but
I've yet to encounter someone sharp enough to connect the Word's flesh to
another ancestor; and I strongly suspect it's because we're mistaking that
man in the Old Testament for the man in the New when they're likely two
entirely different manifestations that we've presumed to give the same
name.

Well; as for me: I'm confident that the Word's alter ego Jesus didn't exist till
his conception per Luke 1:26-35 and that man in the Old Testament was a
special manifestation of someone about whom many of us know next to
nothing.
_

So after some thought. This is what I think. You are applying limited human logic to a limitless God. Have you tried to figure out how manna fell out of heaven yet to feed the Israelites or how in the world they wandered a desert 40 years but their clothing did not wear out? How did water come from a rock that Moses struck? How did Jesus feed 5000 plus people from 5 loaves and 2 small fish? - at some point we need to stop asking the how and simply believe it says what it says. The only other time these words are uttered is to Moses from the burning bush
“Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy.” And Joshua did so.”
‭‭Joshua‬ ‭5‬:‭15‬ ‭NIV‬‬

an angelic being coming to give a message to Joshua - would not command this from a human. As angels are actually subordinate to humans. They are “ministering spirits “ to the saints. This has to be In my opinion none but God Himself, but if scripture is correct that no one can see the Father. Then this has to be the pre-incarnate Son or as you call Him the Word in flesh or flesh like appearing as a man. I mean I’m convinced it’s Jesus myself. Guess it’s one of those mysterious things we won’t know till we get there and ask Him ourselves “hey was that you Holding a sword talking to Joshua?How did that work” 😜

 

[Magenta]

Who Jesus is...

 

[Webers.Home]

.
● Judg 13:22 . . And Manoah said unto his wife: We shall surely die, because we have
seen God.

Here's another:

● Ex 24:9-11 . .Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the
elders of Israel: and they saw the God of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were
a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness.
And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God,
and did eat and drink.

Did any of those people actually see the supreme being in person? Well; according to
Ex 32:20, John 1:18, and 1Tim 6:16 they didn't.

The ancient rabbis were perplexed by what looked to them as two Gods in the Old
Testament, i.e. two Jehovah's. There is the invisible Jehovah in Heaven who no man
ever yet has seen, and then a second Jehovah, visible to men, who spoke for God,
spoke as God, and is required to be respected as God.

The rabbis gave the second Jehovah the name Metatron: a mysterious celestial being
whose name is his master's; which, in a roundabout way, introduces Jesus' new name.
According to Phil 2:9-11 God rewarded Jesus' exceptional performance by bestowing
upon him the name that is above all names so that Jesus is now authorized to be
identified as Jehovah, addressed as Jehovah, and respected as Jehovah.
_

 

[Inquisitor]

Getting very good response thus far. However, to keep the post on course, when I asked, "before Jesus became a man," I met before he took on the form of man, not growing into manhood as the two previous post were centered.

Philippians 2:5
Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, as He already existed in the form of God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself by taking the form of a bond-servant and being born in the likeness of men. And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death: death on a cross.

 

[selahsays]

Here also, we see none other than our Lord Jesus Christ:

Hebrews 7:1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;

 

[Mem]

One of my favorite appearances is to Menoah's wife when Menoah, not knowing that it was 'the Angel of the LORD,' asked Him, "what is your name?" and He answered Menoah something like, "Why do you ask? my name is a wonder." And when Menoah realized that it was indeed the Angel of the Lord when He went up into the flames of the burnt offering that the Angel had instructed him to offer "to the LORD," Menoah feared saying to his wife, "We are going to die! for we have seen God!" (Judges 13)


And Jacob received a similar answer after he wrestled with a Man when he requested, "Please tell me your name," after the Man asked him his name and then told him he would no longer be called Jacob but Israel, "because you have struggled with God and with men, and you have prevailed."
And Jacob marveled that his life was spared after seeing God 'face to face.' (Genesis 32)

And of course, God Himself said that He and Moses spoke 'face to face.' And well it is right that 'no one shall see God and live.' (for He is just). Yet, it is the Son that reveals the Father, for He is the only way to the Father, after all, so when Moses saw God 'face to face' they saw His Mercy (and isn't that exactly what He requires of us, mercy and not justice? and I don't think I quote that wrongly though I wish I had 'instant recall' of the verse) and I think they were permitted to see Him "face to face" because they recognized/acknowledged/believed in? His Faithfulness (Holy Spirit) So then, in short, the OP's request in exploring Jesus' representation of the Godhead leads us to "the more important matters of the law-justice, mercy and faithfulness (Matthew 23:23)." And this brings to mind Psalm 85:10, "Loving devotion and faithfulness meet; righteousness and peace have kissed."

Thinking of these previously mentioned accounts where, when a request for His Name was answered with, "Why do you ask?" causes me to wonder and conduct research about whether there is actually any instance written of anywhere of anyone directly addressing Jesus by His Name while in His Presence...

 

[Magenta]

... mercy and not justice? and I don't think I quote that wrongly though I wish I had 'instant recall' of the verse)

Matthew 9:13 ~ I desire mercy, not sacrifice.

 

[Mem]

Matthew 9:13 ~ I desire mercy, not sacrifice.

I should fully know by now that you would have me covered in case of the need for instant recall!
I'm totally going to "go and learn (exactly) what this means too!

 

[posthuman]

Thinking of these previously mentioned accounts where, when a request for His Name was answered with, "Why do you ask?" causes me to wonder and conduct research about whether there is actually any instance written of anywhere of anyone directly addressing Jesus by His Name while in His Presence...

brings to mind -

Proverbs 30:4
Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What [is] His name, and what [is] His Son's name, If you know?

 

[posthuman]

causes me to wonder and conduct research about whether there is actually any instance written of anywhere of anyone directly addressing Jesus by His Name while in His Presence..

at least Joseph -

Matthew 1:21
And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name JESUS, for He will save His people from their sins.

 

[posthuman]

causes me to wonder and conduct research about whether there is actually any instance written of anywhere of anyone directly addressing Jesus by His Name while in His Presence..

interesting question!

through word searches i found no instance in the NT where anyone explicitly called Him by His name.

But it's implied with Joseph, and also here:

Luke 23:24
So Pilate gave sentence that it should be as they requested.

Pilate's order would have named Him, I would think..?

 

[Mem]

interesting question!

through word searches i found no instance in the NT where anyone explicitly called Him by His name.

But it's implied with Joseph, and also here:

Luke 23:24
So Pilate gave sentence that it should be as they requested.

Pilate's order would have named Him, I would think..?

I suppose that He might've been asked, "Are you Jesus?" with some added elaboration but, for example in Joseph's case, knowing who Jesus actually is via the visiting angel, Joseph might've called him Lord, Master, or even "son" but not without being cognizant of an appropriate capital "S."

 

[posthuman]

One of my favorite appearances is to Menoah's wife when Menoah, not knowing that it was 'the Angel of the LORD,' asked Him, "what is your name?" and He answered Menoah something like, "Why do you ask? my name is a wonder." And when Menoah realized that it was indeed the Angel of the Lord when He went up into the flames of the burnt offering that the Angel had instructed him to offer "to the LORD," Menoah feared saying to his wife, "We are going to die! for we have seen God!" (Judges 13)

one of my favorite too

refusing to eat their food, but suggesting an offering by fire - and then ascending in their sight in the flame! wow!

Judges 13:16
And the Angel of the LORD said to Manoah, "Though you detain Me, I will not eat your food. But if you offer a burnt offering, you must offer it to the LORD." (For Manoah did not know He [was] the Angel of the LORD.)

again, wow!
the reason He says if you offer, you must offer To G_D is that Manoah didn't realize he was speaking to THE Angel of the LORD!
What more proof can anyone possibly need that this is the LORD Himself speaking to Him? it's just like the rich, young pharisee calling Him "good teacher" and His reply, "ya know only God is good, so..."
And it dawns on Menoah when he sees the ascension - just like it will dawn on Israel when she sees Him return!

 

[posthuman]

I suppose that He might've been asked, "Are you Jesus?" with some added elaboration but, for example in Joseph's case, knowing who Jesus actually is via the visiting angel, Joseph might've called him Lord, Master, or even "son" but not without being cognizant of an appropriate capital "S."

How crazy it must be to call your son "lord"

((king David rolls his eyes, Ps. 110))

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Based on your knowledge of the bible, what do you know about Jesus before He became a man and was given the name Jesus?

Was He inactive or proactive in revealing the Godhead to God's creation?

Please explain in some detail, not looking for a yes or no response here. The reason for the question is to expand our knowledge and appreciation of the Godhead.

I would say Jesus appears in the first lines of the bible when it says "God created the heavens and earth and the spirit of god moved and God spoke his word .....it's all him it's only that the old testament hides Jesus name and face and words they are there but hey are obscured by the old testament word Jesus created all things so everytime the bibles or speaks of God it's Jesus before he became flesh and blood he says this alot in many ways


Let all the nations be gathered together, and let the people be assembled: who among them can declare this, and shew us former things? let them bring forth their witnesses, that they may be justified: or let them hear, and say, It is truth. Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God.
Isaiah 43:9‭-‬12 KJV


There's just one , the first and the last is the same God . It's only in the new testament that we learn the lord's name Jesus Christ I's lord , the ot is always talking about him it's just saying " the lord God" or some other title instead of the name above every name that every tounge must confess that Jesus Christ is Lord

 

[Pilgrimshope]

at least Joseph -

Matthew 1:21
And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name JESUS, for He will save His people from their sins.

Ever look at Jesus name hrough the ot commands about Gods name ? Though shalt not take the lord thy Gods name in vein ....

that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Philippians 2:10‭-‬11 KJV

I don't think many make the connection .....sorry brother I was reading the comments and that came to mind maybe it's Jesus name we aren't to take upon ourselves in vein .....