Saved by faith alone?

[Magenta]

Did not Jesus say faith of a mustard seed would move a mountain?

Who do you trust. Jesus or your works?

Jesus' words in Matthew 17:20-21
Faith the size of a mustard seed moved the mountain of my unbelief .

 

[Lamar]

Okay but why does it not mean what it says?

Salvation is in the very moment when a person believes in Christ and accepts salvation.

Everything else, occurs after that fact. Nothing, and the Bible is very clear on that, nothing saves us but the blood of Christ
shed on the cross. We cannot add to that sacrifice and it is an insult to God to think we can.

We should be baptized as per directions in scripture...but you know the Jordan is not just over the next hill...most churches now have a baptismal tank and that is where both profession in Christ and identification with Him is expressed and the baptism occurs or at a river or lake or pond or what have you.

Salvation is not incremental. If it were, then it means that what Jesus said on the cross, 'IT IS FINISHED' is not true.

Our part is to continue in faith, as we began in faith and God is faithful and true to His promises and He will keep us. We cannot keep or save ourselves.

Your salvation is between you and Jesus and God and receive the Holy Spirit to enable you to walk your walk of faith in Christ by the power of God's Holy Spirit.

This is the text:

Acts 2:37-39

37 When the people heard this, they were deeply upset. They asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”
38 Peter answered them, “All of you must turn to God and change the way you think and act, and each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins will be forgiven. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift. 39 This promise belongs to you and to your children and to everyone who is far away. It belongs to everyone who worships the Lord our God.”

This is the promise, this is the Gospel.

To deny, alter, malign or ignore these words to fit faith alone regeneration theology is pushing a false gospel.

There is a very good reason why you can not find an example of the use of "faith alone" when it comes to salvation. Because it does not exist.

It should exist if it was the core tenet of the Gospel. But it is certainly not, hence its absence.

I truly cannot make this any clearer. If you cannot see this then you are either in the ditch or leading others to it.

 

[Lamar]

i dont believe in works-based salvation, Lamar does. That's why I posed him that question.

I do not believe in "works-based salvation" nor have I ever.

Since you believe that obedience is not necessary for salvation, should I label you as a follower of Hyper-Grace?

I await your reply.

 

[Cameron143]

Okay but why does it not mean what it says?

This is the text:

Acts 2:37-39

37 When the people heard this, they were deeply upset. They asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”
38 Peter answered them, “All of you must turn to God and change the way you think and act, and each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins will be forgiven. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift. 39 This promise belongs to you and to your children and to everyone who is far away. It belongs to everyone who worships the Lord our God.”

This is the promise, this is the Gospel.

To deny, alter, malign or ignore these words to fit faith alone regeneration theology is pushing a false gospel.

There is a very good reason why you can not find an example of the use of "faith alone" when it comes to salvation. Because it does not exist.

It should exist if it was the core tenet of the Gospel. But it is certainly not, hence its absence.

I truly cannot make this any clearer. If you cannot see this then you are either in the ditch or leading others to it.

In the KJV verse 37 reads...When they heard this, they were pricked in their hearts, and said men and brethren, what shall we do?

Before they are told what to do they heard the word of God...faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Faith is already present. They were also pricked in their hearts. This is the circumcision of the heart pictured in physical circumcision. It is what Ezekiel 36:26 is describing in taking out the heart of stone and giving a heart of flesh.

In this condition, their response was what is the proper response. This isn't surprising given that faith always calls for a response. Plenty of other people heard the same words and did not respond this way. Why? Because the operation of faith was not present in them.

 

[wrecked]

I do not believe in "works-based salvation" nor have I ever.

Since you believe that obedience is not necessary for salvation, should I label you as a follower of Hyper-Grace?

I await your reply.

Grace. That's God's part in providing mankind a way of salvation through Jesus Christ.
Faith. Better translated 'living faith' is the believer's part in conducting an acceptable walk with Christ.
Works. Works are the evidence that something significant has transpired in a believer's life resulting in doing good for the cause of Christ. Works don't save you but neither does grace if you don't accept it. And neither does faith if it's not 'living faith.' You can't separate grace, faith, and works.

Matthew 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

Works are not only the evidence that one has accepted God's grace by sending His son, they are what determine our reward. As long as we don't do them only to be seen and noticed. Mathew 23:5.

 

[Radius]

I do not believe in "works-based salvation" nor have I ever.

Since you believe that obedience is not necessary for salvation, should I label you as a follower of Hyper-Grace?

I await your reply.

What is obedience? Work. What is baptism? A work.

You are preaching from a spirit of Cain. Abel brought innocent blood to sacrifice, that is what God demanded. Cain (you) are bringing the works of your hands (a sheaf of wheat from Cain, and baptism from you). See how God reacted to bringing ANYTHING but the blood?

Come on, do not go down this path.

 

[CS1]

Okay...but what about the question?

Let me rephrase it for you.

Is "saved by grace through faith" equivalent to "saved by grace through faith alone"?

I'm sorry, but the question. I do not understand. Are you asking if there is more for one to do after they are saved? Yes, there is.

They must live the life of Christ before men. They will be gin the life long process of Sanctification. To become more Like Christ and less like CS1.

 

[Lamar]

So many people are confused as to what scripture says about the remission of sins.


Please look at http://www.biblestudytools.com and do a search in the King James version for remission. Then look at every passage which has that word in the New Testament. Then look at the meaning of the words in each passage.


To summarize it, to be baptized for the remission of sin is NOT to be baptized so one will be forgiven (have remission) of sin, but because one has forgiveness of sins.


Let’s look at this in more detail:


Matthew 26:28 tells us, “For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”


In Mark 1:4, we see, “John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance FOR the remission of sins.”


In Luke 3:3, we see, “And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance FOR the remission of sins.”


In Acts 2:38, we see, “Then Peter said unto them, Repent , and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ FOR the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”


Now, before you get confused that people must be baptized in order to have the remission of sin, there are two ways to use the word “for.” What is meant by the phrase “Billy the Kid is wanted for murder”? It can either mean he is wanted so he can murder someone, or it can mean he is wanted because he murdered someone. Obviously, we understand the phrase to mean the latter – he was wanted because he murdered someone. This is the same usage of the word translated as “for” (the Greek word is Eis) in Matthew 26:28, Mark 1:4, Luke 3:3: Christ shed his blood because people would receive salvation through faith in what He did, and people should be baptized because of what Christ did – not so they will receive forgiveness, but because of the forgiveness they have already received when they believed. The idea is we should be baptized because of what Christ did for us (shed blood so our sins could be forgiven when we have faith) – not so we will receive forgiveness of sin.

You made this up!!!

Jesus shed His blood "because" our sins were already forgiven? Have you no bounds? He shed His blood "so that" our sins would be forgiven.

Do ANY of these verses say "because of" in your Bible?

There is NO version of the Bible, either old or modern that translate ANY of these verses in such a way as to imply "because of".

Nor are there ANY versions in other languages that translate ANY of these verses in such a way as to imply "because of".

Regardless of what the ENGLISH word "for" can mean, it is what the GREEK word "eis" means. And it certainly does not mean "because of".

Are you and others so blinded by faith alone regeneration theology that you are willing to go down this absurd road. Did every Bible translation, in every language get it wrong by not using "because of".

If Luke wanted to write "because of" in Acts 2:38 he simply would have used "hoti" which means "because of" in Greek. A word Luke was very familiar with since he used it well over 150 times.

I would like to hear from other faith alone regeneration theology followers about this notion. Do you agree with this?

 

[Miriam_Jasmine]

James 2:24 states that we are justified by works and not by faith alone so was the reformation wrong?

 

[Lamar]

I'm sorry, but the question. I do not understand. Are you asking if there is more for one to do after they are saved? Yes, there is.

They must live the life of Christ before men. They will be gin the life long process of Sanctification. To become more Like Christ and less like CS1.

The question is rather simple. Are the phrases equivalent?

 

[CS1]

The question is rather simple. Are the phrases equivalent?

Grace is the noun, and Belief, which is faith in action, is a verb. You receive grace and believe unto Salvation.

As Roman chapter 10:9-11 says

 

[wrecked]

James 2:24 states that we are justified by works and not by faith alone so was the reformation wrong?

Of course they were wrong! They were wrong on most things and still are today!

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Absolutely not.


For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, Ephesians 2:8


Faith must have grace.

Grace is the God given ability to do what we can not do, without it.


Grace is the Holy Spirit; the Spirit of grace.


Grace, like truth, like wisdom, like understanding, like the fear of the LORD, and so many other things in the Bible is both something and Someone.


Grace is something and Someone. The Spirit of grace.


Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 10:28-29



Faith must have grace, because faith operates by a principle or law.

Faith must have the corresponding action of obedience to make it complete as well as alive (activated) in order for faith to produce the intended divine result.


I will break this down with scripture in the next post if you want to discuss.




JPT

Word games.

 

[Lamar]

What is obedience? Work. What is baptism? A work.

You are preaching from a spirit of Cain. Abel brought innocent blood to sacrifice, that is what God demanded. Cain (you) are bringing the works of your hands (a sheaf of wheat from Cain, and baptism from you). See how God reacted to bringing ANYTHING but the blood?

Come on, do not go down this path.

Here is the text:
Genesis 4:3-7

3 And in the course of time Cain brought an offering from the fruit of the ground to Yahweh, 4 and Abel also brought an offering from the choicest firstlings of his flock. And Yahweh looked with favor to Abel and to his offering, 5 but to Cain and to his offering he did not look with favor. And Cain became very angry, and his face fell. 6 And Yahweh said to Cain, “Why are you angry, and why is your face fallen? 7 If you do well will I not accept you? But if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. And its desire is for you, but you must rule over it.”

You are in error. Both Cain and Abel brought an offering from the work of their hands. Cain and Abel both worked to produce their offering.

"If you do well will I not accept you?" God is clearly demanding that Cain do something in order for God to accept him.

The "spirit of Cain" is known as the spirit of disobedience. So it seems that if you are labeling obedience as not an acceptable offering then it is you who is preaching from the spirit of Cain.

 

[Lamar]

Word games.

Boy, you really showed him.

 

[Lamar]

Grace is the noun, and Belief, which is faith in action, is a verb. You receive grace and believe unto Salvation.

As Roman chapter 10:9-11 says

Okay....but what about the question?

 

[Lamar]

In the KJV verse 37 reads...When they heard this, they were pricked in their hearts, and said men and brethren, what shall we do?

Before they are told what to do they heard the word of God...faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Faith is already present. They were also pricked in their hearts. This is the circumcision of the heart pictured in physical circumcision. It is what Ezekiel 36:26 is describing in taking out the heart of stone and giving a heart of flesh.

In this condition, their response was what is the proper response. This isn't surprising given that faith always calls for a response. Plenty of other people heard the same words and did not respond this way. Why? Because the operation of faith was not present in them.

Before I respond, please define what you mean by "the operation of faith"?

 

[CS1]

Okay....but what about the question?

I said I did not know your question, which you said

"The question is rather simple. Are the phrases equivalent? "

I would say there is no salvation without BOTH, and they are SIMULTANEOUS.



I don't get into that OSAS or Calvinist Armenian argument. They are debated by those who in both sides claim to be saved LOL.

LOL hahahaha

 

[Lamar]

LOL now do you want to stop skirting around the quesiton and give me a real attempt at a truthful answer? Im talking about true saving faith. One has it. Now what is the cut off line in terms of good works does one need to know they're saved? Or is it a guessing game until your final breath?

"Now what is the cut off line in terms of good works does one need to know they're saved?"

Here is your answer. As I have said many times before, there are no good works needed to be saved.

I have answered your question now answer mine.

 

[Lamar]

I said I did not know your question, which you said

"The question is rather simple. Are the phrases equivalent? "

I would say there is no salvation without BOTH, and they are SIMULTANEOUS.



I don't get into that OSAS or Calvinist Armenian argument. They are debated by those who in both sides claim to be saved LOL.
LOL hahahaha

"I would say there is no salvation without BOTH, and they are SIMULTANEOUS." I don't even know what this means.

"LOL hahahaha" Um...are you o.k.?