Angels can procreate

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seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
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#21
If you're saying the Sons of GOD were

I keep hearing Christians say "There is no sex in heaven" I strongly disagree.
ANOTHER sex thread John?


God's Girl is right.

A good number of your threads and posts are always about sex, to the point of insisting there must be sex in heaven, while professing that marriage (which sex was created for) is only for this earthly life.

So if there is sex in heaven, are you saying it would be outside of marriage?

After seeing so many of your posts go round and round, I am genuinely curious.

Why are you so obsessed with sex?

I mean, if you get to heaven and find out there is no sex going on there, what will you do?

Ask God to send you back?!

You always sound as if you will be absolutely devastated if there isn't a possibility for you to have sex.

I'm not meaning to be critical, but it genuinely seems like a fixation to you.

Why?

And what other topics are you interested in?
 

Eli1

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2022
4,621
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#22
Why are you so obsessed with sex?
A church he was in, many years ago, has ruined his chances for a relationship so he’s upset (rightly so) and he can’t forgive them and move on.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
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#23
A church he was in, many years ago, has ruined his chances for a relationship so he’s upset (rightly so) and he can’t forgive them and move on.
Does anyone have a link to the posts talking about that? I'd be interested in reading them.

I've read many of his posts where he's said he always wanted to be married and that even the church people told him they've never seen someone work so hard at trying and yet wind up single.

And for that, I'm very sorry. I was married young and he left me for someone even younger, so I understand the pain of longing to be married. I hoped to remarry all my life and it's never happened.

But to be honest, if I knew a great Christian lady around his age, I'd have to do a lot of praying before thinking of introducing them. I've only seen his posts talk about sex and/or wanting to get married.

Maybe I missed his posts about his desire to love and serve a spouse and God through marriage - if so, feel free to link those posts.

This might be because I'm a woman, but I probably wouldn't introduce my friends to someone who seems preoccupied with sex, because I'd be concerned that the primary focus would be to use them as an outlet for a lifetime of pent-up frustration, even after marriage.

I know the Bible says to marry to avoid sin but no one wants to feel like someone's last-ditch effort at getting sex.

I understand being wounded by the church -- that's part of why I'm here, too.

I wish John well.

I've written plenty of threads about sex as well, but usually centered around healing from trauma and abuse so that we can move on to healthy marriages.
 

JohnB

Well-known member
Jul 31, 2022
2,078
456
83
Calif
#26
God's Girl is right.

A good number of your threads and posts are always about sex, to the point of insisting there must be sex in heaven, while professing that marriage (which sex was created for) is only for this earthly life.

So if there is sex in heaven, are you saying it would be outside of marriage?

After seeing so many of your posts go round and round, I am genuinely curious.

Why are you so obsessed with sex?

I mean, if you get to heaven and find out there is no sex going on there, what will you do?

Ask God to send you back?!

You always sound as if you will be absolutely devastated if there isn't a possibility for you to have sex.

I'm not meaning to be critical, but it genuinely seems like a fixation to you.

Why?

And what other topics are you interested in?
when GOD said "The two shall become one", I would think it's really important.
 

JohnB

Well-known member
Jul 31, 2022
2,078
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Calif
#27
Things reproduce after their own kind. Do you know of a scriptural reference where this has been exempted for angels or do you assume it?
I repeat, Angels can take human form. I would think that would include the reproductive parts too.
 

JohnB

Well-known member
Jul 31, 2022
2,078
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83
Calif
#28
@JohnB , I have a cousin in Italy who’s single.
You want me to ask her if she’s interested in an American Protestant?
too far away. I have a hard enough time meeting someone in my own state.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
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#29

Thank you again for the links, Lady Magenta. I've been spending the past several minutes going through John's posts. So far, this is the one that I identified with the most:

I remember when I went forward in church, when I was 30 (I'm now 70), begging GOD not to leave me in the single's life. I hate it. The one thing I asked him not to do, he does. To me, being single has never been a gift, it has been a curse.
John, I can relate to this very well.

My husband left me when I was in my 20's. He gave me no reason why. We were fighting a lot, yes. And one day, I came home from work to a half-empty house that he had moved out from without telling me. He had divorce papers sent to me in the mail, with the heading being, "You Are Being Sued For Divorce." The good church people told me I must now remain single for the rest of my life. I was 25, and the thought of spending the every minute from now on to my dying day as a single person was more than I could bear. People then chastised me even more when I became depressed and had suicidal thoughts. I was told I wasn't really a Christian to begin with.

Several months later after I had moved out of the area (I can't remember how much time went by, but it at least 6, 8 months? Maybe closer to a year -- it was so long ago, I can't remember) and a friend called me at about 2 in the morning with the answer that had eluded me for so long.

He had a girlfriend, but they had kept it a secret until long after I left. In fact, I found out he had been storing things for her in our house, and the only reason he came back one day (while insisting I not be there,) was to collect his girlfriend's things (apparently hidden somewhere in the shed, which I rarely went into.) Despite all the outer judgment from "Christians," I had a Biblical reason for divorce and didn't even know it -- and I would have never known it -- if my friend wouldn't have taken the time to make that phone call.

I was terrified of two things:

1. First, I was scared I would never find anyone I felt bonded with as I did with him. We had certain things in common that were very unique, like ethnic backgrounds, so we had both been bullied in the same ways throughout our lives. He could relate to me in ways no one else could because my family is a different ethnicity than I am. For the first time, I felt like I belonged -- and with someone who was often seen as a misfit, just like me. We had also been raised in countries/cultures other than where we were born, giving us a special bond through our unusual circumstances.

2. Second, I was petrified that I would be single for the rest of my life.

So far, both of those things have happened and still ring true today. I'm not looking for a clone of my ex -- just someone I could feel as connected with, for whatever reasons, even if they were entirely different. But it's never happened. I am adopted and couldn't handle being rejected by first my birth parents and then my own husband. He never spoke to me again after our court date.

Years later I found out from someone that he had remarried and they had at least 2 children. He had also gone on to do things he had talked about while he was still with me. I went numb inside. I couldn't handle it. I didn't understand why God's hand seemed to be with him, but He had left me behind. I began to listen to people's judgments and wonder if they were right, and that's why God was punishing me.

Sometimes I still don't understand, and I go back and forth between feelings of sadness, anger, confusion, and disappointment.

I'm not trying to make this about me at all, but rather, I say all this to say, I understand, and I'm sorry you've been so hurt, John. I truly am. And I'm sorry for all you've been through because of it.

I am a far way from being 25, and I am also a far way from being 70, but I've gone through enough years of being single to be able to at least empathize with you. It's very possible that someday I might be your age, still single, and feeling the same way you do.

I wish I could give you some magic words of encouragement, or something to say to make it better, but I know only God can do that, and I know it feels like your wounds are being salted when no answer appears, or when others get what you long to have.

I know in my own life, God seems to have often said, "I'm not giving you this, but I'm giving you that instead." There have been many times I haven't been very happy with the "substitutions" -- work, church, co-workers, family -- always someone to try to help, always someone to try to look after, even when you may feel that there isn't anyone looking after you.

I truly am sorry for your loneliness. I know it very well. And though I don't have have as much life experience, I can sympathize with having to do everything alone. I'll be flying across the country at some point in the future, and it's always alone, which I hate just as much as you.

Again John, I am sorry.

And I will most definitely keep you in my prayers.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
18,892
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#30
I repeat, Angels can take human form. I would think that would include the reproductive parts too.
They still aren't human. They don't possess human seed. It goes beyond what scripture reveals.
 

Flannery

Active member
Mar 20, 2023
270
70
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#31
It's not that I don't believe you. I have also heard of this, but it was from a Jehovah's Witness. My problem with him is less that he is JW than the fact that he and I are not the same nationality.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
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#32
when GOD said "The two shall become one", I would think it's really important.

It is.

For marriage, in this life.

You haven't answered my question. Even you have said that the Bible has said marriage is only for life here on earth, as God says there is no marriage in heaven.

If there is no marriage in heaven, and if sex was created for marriage, are you saying that there is sex in heaven outside of marriage?

I'm starting to think that you're saying, in your insistence upon angels having sex with humans, that there is somehow going to be sex between angels and humans in heaven?

But even if that were so, God says there will be no marriage.

So angels and humans that did participate in this, if it's even a possibility, would be outside of God's commands, which would be sin. If angels did have sex with humans here on earth, it was sin.

And sin will not be allowed/will be cast out in heaven.

I"m not trying to criticize -- I'm truly trying to understand your reasoning here. Angels won't marry humans because God says, there will be no marriage.

So how could there be sex between them in heaven?
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
113
#33
I repeat, Angels can take human form. I would think that would include the reproductive parts too.
Even if one is a supernatural being who takes on human form (including reproductive parts,) that doesn't mean they are supposed to use them for those purposes in that form.

Jesus was fully God and fully man (so yes, I'm pretty sure he had reproductive parts.)

But it wasn't within His purpose to use those parts of the body for marriage or reproduction.

Rather, He did what God commanded Him to do while He was on earth.

I'm guessing that for the angels who chose to remain obedient, God never commanded nor condoned angels in human form to have sex with humans.

Having the parts doesn't automatically justify using them for sexual purposes.
 

2ndTimeIsTheCharm

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2023
1,871
1,058
113
#34
It is.

For marriage, in this life.

You haven't answered my question. Even you have said that the Bible has said marriage is only for life here on earth, as God says there is no marriage in heaven.

If there is no marriage in heaven, and if sex was created for marriage, are you saying that there is sex in heaven outside of marriage?

I'm starting to think that you're saying, in your insistence upon angels having sex with humans, that there is somehow going to be sex between angels and humans in heaven?

But even if that were so, God says there will be no marriage.

So angels and humans that did participate in this, if it's even a possibility, would be outside of God's commands, which would be sin. If angels did have sex with humans here on earth, it was sin.

And sin will not be allowed/will be cast out in heaven.

I"m not trying to criticize -- I'm truly trying to understand your reasoning here. Angels won't marry humans because God says, there will be no marriage.

So how could there be sex between them in heaven?

Yeah, there was a previous thread he started very similar to this one. I think he posts like this because it makes him have something to look forward to in heaven? *Shrug* He won't acknowledge the reality of it all though, so I've learned to just let him believe whatever he wants - it's good for new readers though!

 

JohnB

Well-known member
Jul 31, 2022
2,078
456
83
Calif
#35
It is.

For marriage, in this life.

You haven't answered my question. Even you have said that the Bible has said marriage is only for life here on earth, as God says there is no marriage in heaven.

If there is no marriage in heaven, and if sex was created for marriage, are you saying that there is sex in heaven outside of marriage?

I'm starting to think that you're saying, in your insistence upon angels having sex with humans, that there is somehow going to be sex between angels and humans in heaven?

But even if that were so, God says there will be no marriage.

So angels and humans that did participate in this, if it's even a possibility, would be outside of God's commands, which would be sin. If angels did have sex with humans here on earth, it was sin.

And sin will not be allowed/will be cast out in heaven.

I"m not trying to criticize -- I'm truly trying to understand your reasoning here. Angels won't marry humans because God says, there will be no marriage.

So how could there be sex between them in heaven?
Just because there is no marriage in heaven, does not mean there is no sex. People on earth who are not married have sex. Your sex parts work outside of marriage.
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
8,048
1,609
113
#36
Even if one is a supernatural being who takes on human form (including reproductive parts,) that doesn't mean they are supposed to use them for those purposes in that form.

Jesus was fully God and fully man (so yes, I'm pretty sure he had reproductive parts.)

But it wasn't within His purpose to use those parts of the body for marriage or reproduction.

Rather, He did what God commanded Him to do while He was on earth.

I'm guessing that for the angels who chose to remain obedient, God never commanded nor condoned angels in human form to have sex with humans.

Having the parts doesn't automatically justify using them for sexual purposes.

If you consider though that an human virgin,(Mary) was found with child (conceived by the Holy Spirit) it might make more sense towards what these angels were attempting in mimicking God ...
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
113
#37
Yeah, there was a previous thread he started very similar to this one. I think he posts like this because it makes him have something to look forward to in heaven? *Shrug* He won't acknowledge the reality of it all though, so I've learned to just let him believe whatever he wants - it's good for new readers though!
Thanks very much for cluing me in to this (the repetition.) I had noticed it in the Singles Forum, but I don't read much over here so I wasn't aware that it had been duplicated in other parts of the forum.

Personally, I think this is part of the unique challenge of faith for singles and/or people who feel deprived of/missed out on sex in this lifetime.

The Bible says God has reserved things that have never been heard nor seen nor even imagined for those who love Him.

I've come to believe that a big part of the hurdle of faith for those who feel so strongly about sex (and it could be married people too, such as those who are deprived or unhappy with their sex lives,) is actually God challenging to us to believe that there are things EVEN BETTER than sex in heaven. Some can accept this more readily than others (and I could be completely wrong.)

But our feeble human minds aren't big enough or powerful enough to even begin to dream up anything of that caliber (or anything else we really, really like here on earth,) and so we remain fixated (stuck) on only the things we know from this worldly life.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
113
#38
Just because there is no marriage in heaven, does not mean there is no sex. People on earth who are not married have sex. Your sex parts work outside of marriage.
Don't you see the problem with this reasoning?

You're saying that sex in heaven would exist outside of marriage.

Are you saying that God would go back on His Word or change the rules just for heaven? Because God says that there will be no marriage in heaven, and sex is for marriage.

You just said yourself that just because there is no marriage, it doesn't mean there won't be sex.

Don't you see the problem here?

If sex is happening in heaven, it's outside of marriage, and would therefore be a sin, and sin will neither be tolerated nor allowed in heaven.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
18,892
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#39
If you consider though that an human virgin,(Mary) was found with child (conceived by the Holy Spirit) it might make more sense towards what these angels were attempting in mimicking God ...
How did they know that was God's intention? The angel story comes long before the virgin birth.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
16,424
5,371
113
#40
If you consider though that an human virgin,(Mary) was found with child (conceived by the Holy Spirit) it might make more sense towards what these angels were attempting in mimicking God ...
Yes, I understand.

And I've seen it interpreted that angels had sex with human women and produced "giants." But even so, and even if disobedient angels were trying to create their own version of a super being (heavenly/human offspring,) it wasn't sanctioned by God.

Rather, what I'm saying is that even if something has full sex organs, whether a human or an angel in human form, it doesn't automatically mean that God is giving them the thumbs up to having sex and/or procreating. John's post seems to indicate that if something has the organs, they should be using them. But God says hold on a minute, there's a guideline I want you to follow.

Which is of course why God tells us sex is reserved for marriage.

Just because you have the tools, it doesn't mean you automatically get to plant a garden.

Whether human or angel in human form, God might still be telling that person/being to hold back on any such activity, even if they have the tool boxes.