Ukraine the bad guy?

[Fundaamental]

यदि आप एक निजी बातचीत करना चाहते हैं तो आप एक निजी संदेश भेज सकते हैं, यह मंच सार्वजनिक है, सार्वजनिक मंच पर निजी बातचीत जैसी कोई चीज नहीं है

I did not say anything about this place not being a private forum.
It is public forum your correct but making somebody out to be insane publicly is better kept private don't you think ?.

There is a private section, it's called pm.

To bad you never thought of this first.

I though you never spoke goggledegook 😂😏😊

 

[Fundaamental]

Throughout history, there have been many instances where individuals who spoke out against the ruling power were punished or silenced. Examples include the imprisonment of Nelson Mandela in South Africa during apartheid, the crackdown on pro-democracy protests in Tiananmen Square in China, and the persecution of journalists and activists in many countries around the world.

In countries where the press is not free, journalists and media outlets may face censorship, harassment, or imprisonment for reporting on government corruption or other sensitive topics. Examples include the imprisonment of journalists in countries like Egypt, Turkey, and Russia.

Censorship is a form of infantilization, where the government or other authority figure treats the public like children who cannot handle certain information or ideas.

Speaking truth to power can be dangerous, especially in societies where the ruling elite are corrupt or oppressive. Throughout history, there have been many examples of individuals who were persecuted or even killed for speaking out against the government or other powerful institutions. Examples include the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. in the United States and the imprisonment and torture of political dissidents in countries like China, North Korea, and Cuba.

oooh the plot thickens

 

[Evmur]

This is so far off the mark....where on earth are you getting your information?

NATO is a defensive treaty....pure and simple. Each member nation is obligated to come to the defense of the others and obligated to spend money on equipment for its own defense as well....and they cannot isolate themselves with equipment that won't coordinate with the other nations.

IOW it's not a way to cheapskate on military expenditures....(ahem France, Greece, Italy)

Currently we are having issues with Hungary....they only grudgingly are siding with NATO that they literally begged to be a part of. And I would be surprised if they weren't giving Russia NATO intelligence.

try telling that to Iraq or Libya or Vietnam

yeh their rockets are cuddly teddy bear shaped things coming to kiss the kids goodnight ... defensive

 

[ZNP]

Today,
Google suspended many accounts on YouTube and remonetized other accounts.
Upon their review they suspended accounts that were promoting Russian and Wagner propaganda to Western Countries. Especially ones that had "proven ties and links" to Kremlin propaganda networks.

And plan on turning the information over to the state department for targeting by CIA and FBI investigations.

Meaning that the "alphabets" are coming for you if you back Russian aggression...and there's nowhere to hide.

Well, guess this will be censored

WW3, Russia, Ukraine, U.S., NATO, all Planned Long Ago

 

[cv5]

And the other conversation could be...

Ukrainian General; "hmm I wonder if Wagner is pulling out of Bakhmut and actually falling back to where their supplies are where they can rest and get replacements? I wonder if after we rush into Bakhmut if the drone strike and the reserved response has anything to do with flanking an army that thinks they have an army on the run? I wonder if Twitter is an useful tool where armies can grumble in public and lure armies into positions of their own choosing? Wouldn't it just be peachy to have to have the photo intel on supply movements and bombers being fueled?"

Congratulations. Somebody gets it....

 

[Evmur]

Didn’t Medvedev threaten to sink the UK in a wave of radioactive seawater?

... after Britain offered to send Zelenski the means to make a dirty bomb.

This was the most avoidable war in the history of the world, all they had to do was abide by the Minkst agreement which Kiev, Europe and Russia signed up to.

The day after signing it Kiev sent the army down to the Donbas to shell the poor village people down there, why? because they are Russian. They were shelling those poor folks for 8 years ... unreported by western media. Men, women and children.

Putin warned them again and again that he would defend them.

 

[Fundaamental]

Well, guess this will be censored

WW3, Russia, Ukraine, U.S., NATO, all Planned Long Ago

well zelenski was a commedian befor he became a president for Ukraine, how do you know he's not a secret rich oligarch for putin, or the whitehouse, how do you know Putin is really Putin anymore or zelenski is really zelenski anymore.
Or biden is really biden anymore.

 

[Fundaamental]

Befor you answer dont forget this is the conspiracy forum @ZNP

 

[Fundaamental]

It's where you get to speak goggledegook 😂😱

 

[Fundaamental]

... after Britain offered to send Zelenski the means to make a dirty bomb.

This was the most avoidable war in the history of the world, all they had to do was abide by the Minkst agreement which Kiev, Europe and Russia signed up to.

The day after signing it Kiev sent the army down to the Donbas to shell the poor village people down there, why? because they are Russian. They were shelling those poor folks for 8 years ... unreported by western media. Men, women and children.

Putin warned them again and again that he would defend them.

Did you know that the Syrian leader general Assad trained to be an eye surgeon in the UK.

Just a thought but he could have been swapped with a clone in a UK laboratory. 😱 And he has now cloned Putin 😱

 

[Fundaamental]

Red alert warning the the UK spies are watching you could be court marshalled for sabotage

 

[cv5]

Today,
Google suspended many accounts on YouTube and remonetized other accounts.
Upon their review they suspended accounts that were promoting Russian and Wagner propaganda to Western Countries. Especially ones that had "proven ties and links" to Kremlin propaganda networks.

And plan on turning the information over to the state department for targeting by CIA and FBI investigations.

Meaning that the "alphabets" are coming for you if you back Russian aggression...and there's nowhere to hide.

$1000 a day for mercs who fight Russkies. If you can swing a hammer you can dig a trench. What are you waiting for? Glory awaits. Make your daddy proud. And worse comes to worse, they will draft your sons and daughters to get the job done.

BTW.....why is it that the words "peace treaty" have never crossed your lips?

All I want is an IMMEDIATE CREASE FIRE AND END TO HOSTILITIES....NO PRE-CONDITIONS.

And you?

 

[Fundaamental]

$1000 a day for mercs who fight Russkies. If you can swing a hammer you can dig a trench. What are you waiting for? Glory awaits. Make your daddy proud. And worse comes to worse, they will draft your sons and daughters to get the job done.

BTW.....why is it that the words "peace treaty" have never crossed your lips?

All I want is an IMMEDIATE CREASE FIRE AND END TO HOSTILITIES....NO PRE-CONDITIONS.

And you?

my life is worth more than 1000 dollars thanks.

I would rather fast for 40 days but thanks anyway yeah this is indespensable alright 😱

 

[Gideon300]

NATO is like an Al Capone protection racket, they tell a nation if you don't sign up something awful will happen [and they can arrange that something]

NATO is America

When a nation joins NATO it takes over that nation's defence policy, ultimately their foreign policy. America's friends become their friends, America's enemies become their enemies.

NATO is run by fat American generals who have a George S Paton fixation. He hated Russia and believed that sooner or later America must go to war with Russia.

Since the collapse of the USSR their has been NO CAUSE for NATO to creep ever eastwards to hem in Russia on all sides, setting up US military capabilities. Putin has been warning for 30 years that he will not have America on his doorstep.

When a nation joins the EU they take over that nation's trade policy and ultimately that nation's economic policy and the EU has been squeezing Russia trade since it's inception.

You add to that Crimea and the eastern border of Ukraine being ethnically Russian and pro Russia, then you add to that a coup de tat which overthrew the elected government in Kiev with the new government crying "death to the Russian rats" and "Nuke Russia"

You have the seeds of war.

Some of us have been warning about it for more than a decade.

Don't let facts get in the way of your conspiracy theories. Trade? Russia has been profiting massively from oil and gas sales to Europe. Check out the times that Russia has attacked other nations. Chechnya, Georgia, Transnistria, Syria, Abkhazia and South Ossetia give the lie to your pro Russian propaganda.

If Putin wants peace, he has an odd way of going about it. Finland has been neutral since WW2. Putin's unwarranted invasion of Ukraine has driven the Finns to join NATO. Well done Vlad! European military spending was pathetically low. Now they are ramping up. Western nations get the opportunity to use up old weapons that just sit in storage and test out new ones in actual combat. Russia's military weakness is on display for the whole world to see. Putin's 3 day "special operation" has become over a year of death and destruction. And for what?

You should learn some history. Patton and Churchill were exactly right about Russia. Poland, Bulgaria, Romania and East Germany were occupied by one of the most evil regimes in history. Russia inflicted incalculable harm on those nations as well as its own people. Christians were persecuted, imprisoned, torured and murdered.

The collapse of the Soviet Union was one of the best things to happen in the 20th century. Putin thinks it's the worst. His deluded desire to restore Russia to its former glory will fail. The war is bleeding the country white and Chechnya may well revolt again. Putin's army may well be too weak to prevent Chechin independence. If Chechnya goes, others may follow.

 

[JohnDB]

Don't let facts get in the way of your conspiracy theories. Trade? Russia has been profiting massively from oil and gas sales to Europe. Check out the times that Russia has attacked other nations. Chechnya, Georgia, Transnistria, Syria, Abkhazia and South Ossetia give the lie to your pro Russian propaganda.

If Putin wants peace, he has an odd way of going about it. Finland has been neutral since WW2. Putin's unwarranted invasion of Ukraine has driven the Finns to join NATO. Well done Vlad! European military spending was pathetically low. Now they are ramping up. Western nations get the opportunity to use up old weapons that just sit in storage and test out new ones in actual combat. Russia's military weakness is on display for the whole world to see. Putin's 3 day "special operation" has become over a year of death and destruction. And for what?

You should learn some history. Patton and Churchill were exactly right about Russia. Poland, Bulgaria, Romania and East Germany were occupied by one of the most evil regimes in history. Russia inflicted incalculable harm on those nations as well as its own people. Christians were persecuted, imprisoned, torured and murdered.

The collapse of the Soviet Union was one of the best things to happen in the 20th century. Putin thinks it's the worst. His deluded desire to restore Russia to its former glory will fail. The war is bleeding the country white and Chechnya may well revolt again. Putin's army may well be too weak to prevent Chechin independence. If Chechnya goes, others may follow.

Very soon Poland is going to have the largest army in Europe. Somewhere to the tune of 500,000 soldiers all trained and equipped. They are tired of being the victim. They don't want anything to do with Russia ever again.

And make no mistake....Poland is a highly industrialized nation that Putin wants back in his borders.

 

[Gideon300]

What is your point? You feel very strongly that Russia is in the wrong, so strongly in fact you want to fight with Russia and pay any cost. I support you, go for it.

However, I do not feel that strongly about it, doesn't mean I think that Russia is not in the wrong, it just means I am going to sit this war out. I also have better things to do with my money. I am not going to tell you what to do, you want to fight, that is your prerogative, you want to send all your money to Ukraine, again, it is your money, do with it as you please.

What kind of a coward would tell others they must go and fight and pay for a war if they aren't willing to do that themselves first? That is my point.

There is a foreign brigade serving with Ukraine forces. A whole lot of people joined at the start of the war. Many thought it was like a video game. They discovered that a trench is not like a loungeroom. Those that survived went home pretty quick. Ukraine discovered that those with no military experience are a liability. So they reject anyone who has no military experience. There are several thousand foreigners serving in Ukraine.

It would be wonderful if this debate was based on facts. Way too much heat and not nearly enough light.

 

[Gideon300]

Very soon Poland is going to have the largest army in Europe. Somewhere to the tune of 500,000 soldiers all trained and equipped. They are tired of being the victim. They don't want anything to do with Russia ever again.

And make no mistake....Poland is a highly industrialized nation that Putin wants back in his borders.

Exactly. The Poles well remember Russia's occupation and betrayal by the allies. I've met a lot of Poles in Australia. They are some of the smartest people I've worked with. If only I could understand their accent.....

Putin has no hope. It's about time he pulled out of Ukraine and went back to pre 2014 borders. His oligarchs could get corruptly rich again as sanctions were removed. Europe would be a market for oil and gas again. Putin's Napolean complex will prevent this common sense approach.

 

[JohnDB]

There have been many Americans, Canadians, Brits, Irish, and even Australians that have answered Zelenski's call for foreign fighters to fight off Russia.
Where some have done it for money....many people aren't. They have reported back and told of the atrocities Russia has done in the occupied areas.

Make no mistake...even though some people are horrible from the West with their greed and outlandish tales...many others are respectable soldiers who are going to help those in desperate need.

They deserve respect and a salute.

 

[ZNP]

There is a foreign brigade serving with Ukraine forces. A whole lot of people joined at the start of the war. Many thought it was like a video game. They discovered that a trench is not like a loungeroom. Those that survived went home pretty quick. Ukraine discovered that those with no military experience are a liability. So they reject anyone who has no military experience. There are several thousand foreigners serving in Ukraine.

It would be wonderful if this debate was based on facts. Way too much heat and not nearly enough light.

What debate? Everyone agrees that Russia is a "bad guy" and even those against the US taking the lead to defend Ukraine liken Putin to a cartel leader. No one is debating that.

Then I have yet to see any credible response to the claim that NATO and Europe should be taking the lead and not the US. I have not seen any debate on that point either.

Those of us against the war are arguing for peace talks, what is the issue here and let's resolve it. The war does not profit the Ukrainians and I agree that Ukraine is essential for Russia's national security, so why can't we find common ground for peace? I have not heard any debate on this.

Instead we are told that if we disagree with the Official line then you will be censored and put under observation.

 

[SomeDisciple]

Instead we are told that if we disagree with the Official line then you will be censored and put under observation.

Yeah, and frankly I've been sick and tired of it since day 1... and it's doing nothing but actually making me less and less sympathetic to the Ukrainians.