Is continued ongoing emotional trauma proof of unforgiveness?
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Okay,
First off you need to understand that YOU are human. You aren't God, no matter how much you try to be like Jesus you are going to fail at it. Thank God for Jesus eh?
I'm not saying to not try....far be it from me to suggest such a thing. However you are human and mortal at this moment.
Let's look at the Gospel of Luke for a minute. Luke records 4 parables in a row to explain a truth. Lost sheep, lost coin, and prodigal son....these three parables describe 4 types of sin that God forgives except the last one which is the angry brother who refuses to join the non-stop party (in heaven).
Then comes the story that people dismiss.....the Shrewd Manager. Each of these people have debts they owe. Each amount of debt (in a commodity based economy) that the manager forgave was of the same value...all equal. Some owed practically nothing where for others it was still a substantial sum.
Such is YOUR ability to forgive....because you are not God....you can't forgive like God does because you are touchable and God is not. You are capable of being hurt....God is not.
Then....Jesus demonstrated the proper use of Boundaries. Like you desperately need some. You must put some distance emotionally and sometimes physically between yourself and these people who keep hurting you. Don't reach out to those that don't have your best interests in mind...they are only thinking of themselves. Where EVERYONE does this at some point (act only for themselves) that doesn't mean that it's their only life goal.
Secondly....
"The cuts of a friend are more sure than the kisses of an enemy" is a famous proverb. Meaning that just because someone says things you don't want to hear doesn't mean that you don't need to hear them either.
First off you need to understand that YOU are human. You aren't God, no matter how much you try to be like Jesus you are going to fail at it. Thank God for Jesus eh?
I'm not saying to not try....far be it from me to suggest such a thing. However you are human and mortal at this moment.
Let's look at the Gospel of Luke for a minute. Luke records 4 parables in a row to explain a truth. Lost sheep, lost coin, and prodigal son....these three parables describe 4 types of sin that God forgives except the last one which is the angry brother who refuses to join the non-stop party (in heaven).
Then comes the story that people dismiss.....the Shrewd Manager. Each of these people have debts they owe. Each amount of debt (in a commodity based economy) that the manager forgave was of the same value...all equal. Some owed practically nothing where for others it was still a substantial sum.
Such is YOUR ability to forgive....because you are not God....you can't forgive like God does because you are touchable and God is not. You are capable of being hurt....God is not.
Then....Jesus demonstrated the proper use of Boundaries. Like you desperately need some. You must put some distance emotionally and sometimes physically between yourself and these people who keep hurting you. Don't reach out to those that don't have your best interests in mind...they are only thinking of themselves. Where EVERYONE does this at some point (act only for themselves) that doesn't mean that it's their only life goal.
Secondly....
"The cuts of a friend are more sure than the kisses of an enemy" is a famous proverb. Meaning that just because someone says things you don't want to hear doesn't mean that you don't need to hear them either.
you didn't say if you are Christian as in born again Christian. John 3:5- "verily, verily, i say unto thee, except a man be born of the water & of the spirit, he can not enter the kingdom of God". the devil never sleeps! he's always on the attack but God's got your back. the devil knows everyone's biggest weaknesses. all pastors have their strong points in preaching & teaching. ask around. look on the computer who is a pro at teaching forgiveness. for yourself, do this: sit in your favorite room with quietness, relax yourself slowly (it may take awhile), put your heart, mind, body, soul, conscious & spirit in total relax mode. begin your talk with Jesus & ask Him to show you your weakness & what to do to get healed. all Christians already have healing in place: "by who's stripes ye WERE healed". claim your healing in the name of Jesus. more than likely, its going to be a gradual process. DO NOT LET THE DEVIL IN!!!! here's what it'll him: "devil, you & all your about get out"! cast him out with a smile & a positive attitude not dwelling in the problem but being THRU the problem. the devil has no power against the believer unless the believer lets him! and RESIST, him DON'T fight him!!! (James 4:7). you are on your way to healing my friend!!! yeah!!!!
I can understand how you feel.
I was raised by parents who loved me very much. However, childhood traumas stole much joy and peace in my life.
As an adult I've had so many strange attempts on my life few people would believe it. However, God protected me through them all. Have we seen incredible injustices?.....Yes, many, too many.
All the same, the Lord is greater than our circumstances. There are a number of things that I can share, but it would fill a book.
I hope to publish books on this subject some day.
David and a number of prophets and the apostle Paul had their personal injust attacks upon their lives. I can look at those and praise the Lord for mine. The Lord is our strength.
One of my many battles that looked hopeless from any man's perspective, was another victory, to God's glory!
I did not know where to look at the time, but as soon as I earnestly prayed, He supernaturally took me here. I opened my KJV Bible and He brought my eyes immediately to this.
"No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD."
Isaiah 54:17
Shortly thereafter I was notified by mail that a life changing crises was over with.
God was the only One Who did that.
When people hurt and harm us,
I'm not saying that all the pain goes away right away. But there are many personal and many Bible examples of people who suffered greatly, but came through those crises.
One post is not enough to cover such an important topic. It took me years of learning from God's Word to find solutions that are not found in a college of psychology. I spent 5 years taking classes in one so that so I could hopefully help others. Guess what I found? Psychology knows the problems, but they do Not have the solutions.
The solution begins Here and Here
in case you haven't done that yet.
After that, there is much hope for healing for you and many promises from the Lord that will apply Asian friend.
🙂
Have a blessed week.
I was raised by parents who loved me very much. However, childhood traumas stole much joy and peace in my life.
As an adult I've had so many strange attempts on my life few people would believe it. However, God protected me through them all. Have we seen incredible injustices?.....Yes, many, too many.
All the same, the Lord is greater than our circumstances. There are a number of things that I can share, but it would fill a book.
I hope to publish books on this subject some day.
David and a number of prophets and the apostle Paul had their personal injust attacks upon their lives. I can look at those and praise the Lord for mine. The Lord is our strength.
One of my many battles that looked hopeless from any man's perspective, was another victory, to God's glory!
I did not know where to look at the time, but as soon as I earnestly prayed, He supernaturally took me here. I opened my KJV Bible and He brought my eyes immediately to this.
"No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD."
Isaiah 54:17
Shortly thereafter I was notified by mail that a life changing crises was over with.
God was the only One Who did that.
When people hurt and harm us,
I'm not saying that all the pain goes away right away. But there are many personal and many Bible examples of people who suffered greatly, but came through those crises.
One post is not enough to cover such an important topic. It took me years of learning from God's Word to find solutions that are not found in a college of psychology. I spent 5 years taking classes in one so that so I could hopefully help others. Guess what I found? Psychology knows the problems, but they do Not have the solutions.
The solution begins Here and Here
in case you haven't done that yet.
After that, there is much hope for healing for you and many promises from the Lord that will apply Asian friend.
🙂
Have a blessed week.
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Sometimes science looks at how God created our world and shows us the logistics of how a principle works. This is true of brain imaging. Science can now take pictures of how our brain works under different conditions.
The abuse of one person of another causes harm that can be pictured with brain imaging, and also the healing of those hurts shows up in changes in the brain that can be pictured. When someone uses imagination to forgive someone who has hurt them, and sees themselves as healed from that hurt, it actually happens and can be pictured.
God is truth, a truth that can be depended on to always be absolutely correct. Science is not always truth, but sometimes they get something right.
The abuse of one person of another causes harm that can be pictured with brain imaging, and also the healing of those hurts shows up in changes in the brain that can be pictured. When someone uses imagination to forgive someone who has hurt them, and sees themselves as healed from that hurt, it actually happens and can be pictured.
God is truth, a truth that can be depended on to always be absolutely correct. Science is not always truth, but sometimes they get something right.
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Many have already given some very good advice and explanations but I felt compelled to answer also.
First, the verse you were trying to think of was Matthew 6:15:
Matthew 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
Matthew 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
In this translation, the Greek word is translated "TRESPASSES", it could have been translated: "SINS" or "OFFENCES". The idea is this - If God, who we have sinned greatly against, can Justify us and forgive our sins as if they never happened and remember them no more. We, as believers, with mature understanding, should be able to forgive those who might have caused us offense. After all, no matter how badly they may have hurt us or offended us, it is far less than we have offended our God.
Forgiving a persons sin or sins against you, can be thought of in this way. If you were in a court of law, standing before the judge with the one who has sinned - transgressed - offended you -- you would not bring any charges against this person. Let this one be judged by others. Let them bring the accusations but I have forgiven this one. This is why our Lord, just before He died, said:
Luke 23:34a And Jesus said, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.
If He could ask His Father to forgive them, it should be easy for us to forgive another. After all, they were putting Him to death.
As others have said on this chat - forgiving or not laying a charge against them before God, is not the same thing as "forgetting". You must remember what that person or persons did to you or others incase they repeat it. BUT, you do not want to dwell upon it or the hurt you may have received. Learn from it and move on. This is harder to do, if you are a young Christian but becomes easier with maturity as a Christian. When you are a new convert, you see only the superficial forgiveness of God towards you. As you mature and grow in Grace and Knowledge, you see the depth of that forgiveness.
If the offences continue, from the same person, then you need to separate yourself from this person. All of us have our limits - even the Apostles. Note these from the Scriptures:
Acts 15:37-40 And Barnabas was minded to take with them John also, who was called Mark. 38 But Paul thought not good to take him with them who withdrew from them from Pamphylia, and went not with them to the work. 39 And there arose a sharp contention, so that they parted asunder one from the other, and Barnabas took Mark with him, and sailed away unto Cyprus; 40 but Paul choose Silas, and went forth, being commended by the brethren to the grace of the Lord.
Paul had no confidence in Mark because he often left them without explanation.
Gal 2:11 But when Peter came to Antioch, I rebuked him to the face, because he stood in error.
Gal 2:12 For before that certain (jews) came from James, he ate with the Gentiles; but when they came, he drew back and separated himself, fearing them that were of the circumcision.
Just keep in mind, that if the one who has transgressed against you is unsaved and living in the ways of the world, you should expect them to hate you. But you should pray for them.
Finally, take these words to heart and try to live by them:
Rom 12:9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
Rom 12:10 Be kindly affectionate one to another with brotherly love; in honor preferring one another;
Rom 12:11 Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
Rom 12:12 Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
Rom 12:13 Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
Rom 12:14 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
Rom 12:15 Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
Rom 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
Rom 12:17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
Rom 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
Rom 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, says the Lord.
I hope this may help you, as others have.
First, the verse you were trying to think of was Matthew 6:15:
Matthew 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
Matthew 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
In this translation, the Greek word is translated "TRESPASSES", it could have been translated: "SINS" or "OFFENCES". The idea is this - If God, who we have sinned greatly against, can Justify us and forgive our sins as if they never happened and remember them no more. We, as believers, with mature understanding, should be able to forgive those who might have caused us offense. After all, no matter how badly they may have hurt us or offended us, it is far less than we have offended our God.
Forgiving a persons sin or sins against you, can be thought of in this way. If you were in a court of law, standing before the judge with the one who has sinned - transgressed - offended you -- you would not bring any charges against this person. Let this one be judged by others. Let them bring the accusations but I have forgiven this one. This is why our Lord, just before He died, said:
Luke 23:34a And Jesus said, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.
If He could ask His Father to forgive them, it should be easy for us to forgive another. After all, they were putting Him to death.
As others have said on this chat - forgiving or not laying a charge against them before God, is not the same thing as "forgetting". You must remember what that person or persons did to you or others incase they repeat it. BUT, you do not want to dwell upon it or the hurt you may have received. Learn from it and move on. This is harder to do, if you are a young Christian but becomes easier with maturity as a Christian. When you are a new convert, you see only the superficial forgiveness of God towards you. As you mature and grow in Grace and Knowledge, you see the depth of that forgiveness.
If the offences continue, from the same person, then you need to separate yourself from this person. All of us have our limits - even the Apostles. Note these from the Scriptures:
Acts 15:37-40 And Barnabas was minded to take with them John also, who was called Mark. 38 But Paul thought not good to take him with them who withdrew from them from Pamphylia, and went not with them to the work. 39 And there arose a sharp contention, so that they parted asunder one from the other, and Barnabas took Mark with him, and sailed away unto Cyprus; 40 but Paul choose Silas, and went forth, being commended by the brethren to the grace of the Lord.
Paul had no confidence in Mark because he often left them without explanation.
Gal 2:11 But when Peter came to Antioch, I rebuked him to the face, because he stood in error.
Gal 2:12 For before that certain (jews) came from James, he ate with the Gentiles; but when they came, he drew back and separated himself, fearing them that were of the circumcision.
Just keep in mind, that if the one who has transgressed against you is unsaved and living in the ways of the world, you should expect them to hate you. But you should pray for them.
Finally, take these words to heart and try to live by them:
Rom 12:9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
Rom 12:10 Be kindly affectionate one to another with brotherly love; in honor preferring one another;
Rom 12:11 Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
Rom 12:12 Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
Rom 12:13 Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
Rom 12:14 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
Rom 12:15 Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
Rom 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
Rom 12:17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
Rom 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
Rom 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, says the Lord.
I hope this may help you, as others have.
one day, i was reading the Lord's Prayer and came to the portion that states..."forgive me of my SINS ((as i FORGIVE)) those who trespassed [SINNED] against me.
...and i stopped here and began to reason until i understood what was being said here. so i began praying and asked God, if there are people that i have not forgiven, please remind me of what they did so i can forgive them. for a few days memories of people began popping into my mind and the sin(s) they did against me. it still happens to this very day. now, one would think having all of these memories would be demonically Depressing, because these thoughts are not good at all. each thought represents a moment in time where i am the Victim and was done Wrong. but in truth, eventually as the list of memories went and gone, i felt instantly relieved once i forgave them.
for me, this has become a true silver lining in the clouds Blessing. but for others, remembering things that aren't nice being done towards you might be more Burden some to have to remember instead of finding relief for being able to forgive them. and maybe that is an area that should be examined. when there is more self destruction that happens rather than the Blessings that comes in way of healing when forgiving someone, that means the Need for serious alone time with God.
Jesus was thrilled to Forgive, enough so, He literally Died to do it. so if we don't feel like Jesus did when someone is forgiven, we need to seek after God until we become more like Him. because, we should be just as happy to give someone Forgiveness as they are feeling happy to be Forgiven.
...and i stopped here and began to reason until i understood what was being said here. so i began praying and asked God, if there are people that i have not forgiven, please remind me of what they did so i can forgive them. for a few days memories of people began popping into my mind and the sin(s) they did against me. it still happens to this very day. now, one would think having all of these memories would be demonically Depressing, because these thoughts are not good at all. each thought represents a moment in time where i am the Victim and was done Wrong. but in truth, eventually as the list of memories went and gone, i felt instantly relieved once i forgave them.
for me, this has become a true silver lining in the clouds Blessing. but for others, remembering things that aren't nice being done towards you might be more Burden some to have to remember instead of finding relief for being able to forgive them. and maybe that is an area that should be examined. when there is more self destruction that happens rather than the Blessings that comes in way of healing when forgiving someone, that means the Need for serious alone time with God.
Jesus was thrilled to Forgive, enough so, He literally Died to do it. so if we don't feel like Jesus did when someone is forgiven, we need to seek after God until we become more like Him. because, we should be just as happy to give someone Forgiveness as they are feeling happy to be Forgiven.
Forgiveness is a choice. The degree of our hurting is usually greater the more we cared. Accept that it's gone, at least the way it was. Now draw near to the Lord by devoting yourself to the scriptures and as you grow closer to the Lord, he will draw closer to you. He'll share his heart with you and his love for others. As you grow and heal, the hurt will fad with time. Stop letting how you feel dictate the resolve of your choices or you'll never get over it. There is no quick fix for our pain, be it regarding a loved one or our guilt. Seek ye first the kingdom of God and his righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you.
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Thank you for all the responses...I sometimes feel like people on here are brothers and sisters in Christ who I just can't see in person until that glorious day! I just wanted to make one thing clear about the various people in the past who have hurt me. It's not an ongoing thing that's happening right now every day, it's just the feelings keep coming back often because my healing is super-slow.
Most of that was more than 20 years ago, except for one that was 2 years ago. I wont go into details about those, but my point is the wounds still feel fresh sometimes especially when I feel emotionally weak, for some reason....like having a bad day and trying not to believe lies I was told about myself as a child (I was bullied really badly and told NO one then, not even my parents whom I always felt I had to pretend everything was fine.)
I get "triggered" I guess you could say when I see a child treated badly or bullied in a movie or tv show, for example. Probably not as severe as PTSD, but memories are really strong and flood back into my mind when I see stuff like that and vividly remember what they did and said to make me feel like the ugliest, nerdiest, grossest, person ever on the planet. And to top it off, imagine having an unusual name in an almost all white school in a sea of Jennifers, Amys, Allisons, and Heathers in the 70's!!! I've had to unlearn a lot of mean stuff spewed at me because now as a believer I know I am loved by God who cherishes me greatly and all of that were lies I was told.
The later stuff which I wont go into detail about are friends I thought I could finally trust when I was new Christian in early 90's in college...I got saved around the same time as some of them too. Today I'm not still friends with a single one from that time, as well as the ones I made after college when I returned home. My friends meant quite a lot to me being an only child, ya know?
And as far as my church goes, I'm not sure if the Lord is leading me to another one. I've been really trying to get involved after 10 years and still hardly know anyone there....it's fairly medium- large church and growing fast. I have some issues with it and it might be time to move on, but I haven't found anything near me that's even close in teaching/worship style and diversity. And thanks for prayers! I really appreciate them.
Most of that was more than 20 years ago, except for one that was 2 years ago. I wont go into details about those, but my point is the wounds still feel fresh sometimes especially when I feel emotionally weak, for some reason....like having a bad day and trying not to believe lies I was told about myself as a child (I was bullied really badly and told NO one then, not even my parents whom I always felt I had to pretend everything was fine.)
I get "triggered" I guess you could say when I see a child treated badly or bullied in a movie or tv show, for example. Probably not as severe as PTSD, but memories are really strong and flood back into my mind when I see stuff like that and vividly remember what they did and said to make me feel like the ugliest, nerdiest, grossest, person ever on the planet. And to top it off, imagine having an unusual name in an almost all white school in a sea of Jennifers, Amys, Allisons, and Heathers in the 70's!!! I've had to unlearn a lot of mean stuff spewed at me because now as a believer I know I am loved by God who cherishes me greatly and all of that were lies I was told.
The later stuff which I wont go into detail about are friends I thought I could finally trust when I was new Christian in early 90's in college...I got saved around the same time as some of them too. Today I'm not still friends with a single one from that time, as well as the ones I made after college when I returned home. My friends meant quite a lot to me being an only child, ya know?
And as far as my church goes, I'm not sure if the Lord is leading me to another one. I've been really trying to get involved after 10 years and still hardly know anyone there....it's fairly medium- large church and growing fast. I have some issues with it and it might be time to move on, but I haven't found anything near me that's even close in teaching/worship style and diversity. And thanks for prayers! I really appreciate them.
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If you were bullied bad enough then not doing anything to actively recover and take active steps to heal, then it won't heal, it'll just continue repeating.
And if bad enough it may have been traumatic to a degree, even if not PTSD.
Also by not sharing at the time, to get help then, will only have made the wounds deeper.
To recover from this you one thing that'll be important is replacing those negative thoughts you hear repeating from others with positive thoughts about yourself.
Also putting up little notes of encouragement or positive traits about yourself in random places you frequent. Bathroom mirrors, taped to a washing machine, etc... maybe even places you know you'll go but not often, perhaps forgetting its there and being surprised.
I'm sure some will suggest using scripture as well. I'd say a combo of that, things that directly contradict the kinds of things you were told and unrelated ones as well to build you up in other areas, raising you up as a whole.
Of course this won't erase everything magically, even over time, but it's a good place to start and a solid foundation to build from.
And if bad enough it may have been traumatic to a degree, even if not PTSD.
Also by not sharing at the time, to get help then, will only have made the wounds deeper.
To recover from this you one thing that'll be important is replacing those negative thoughts you hear repeating from others with positive thoughts about yourself.
Also putting up little notes of encouragement or positive traits about yourself in random places you frequent. Bathroom mirrors, taped to a washing machine, etc... maybe even places you know you'll go but not often, perhaps forgetting its there and being surprised.
I'm sure some will suggest using scripture as well. I'd say a combo of that, things that directly contradict the kinds of things you were told and unrelated ones as well to build you up in other areas, raising you up as a whole.
Of course this won't erase everything magically, even over time, but it's a good place to start and a solid foundation to build from.
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