Hell, Sheol, Hades...
- Thread starter GRACE_ambassador
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Actually I did answer your question. You just didn't like the answer.
Now please answer mine.
Do you affirm that God alone is immortal?
Do you affirm that the wages of sin is death?
Do you affirm that life ever after is granted to those who believe by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Jesus Christ, Who paid our sin debt, and that those not covered by grace are condemned under the law and pass into the second death at the end of this age?
Or are you one of those who repeats the lie of Satan at the heart of the fall
of man and corruption of all creation by saying, you shall not surely die?
Now please answer mine.
Do you affirm that God alone is immortal?
Do you affirm that the wages of sin is death?
Do you affirm that life ever after is granted to those who believe by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Jesus Christ, Who paid our sin debt, and that those not covered by grace are condemned under the law and pass into the second death at the end of this age?
Or are you one of those who repeats the lie of Satan at the heart of the fall
of man and corruption of all creation by saying, you shall not surely die?
And also until God's purposes have been fulfilled.
But instead we have people spouting such nonsense as, Satan gives eternal life to the unsaved.
Saying, utterly destroy does not mean utterly destroy, dead means alive, death is not punishment.
People refusing to acknowledge even that Scripture -from beginning to end- plainly states such things as the wages of sin is death, that life ever after is gained by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Jesus Christ, and all others pass into the second death.
Those that say such things then turn around and tell us that we are confused and the
ones not believing Scripture when we affirm what is says, while they deny it. LOL.
Some even say sleep is a metaphor for watchful, wakeful awareness.
But instead we have people spouting such nonsense as, Satan gives eternal life to the unsaved.
Saying, utterly destroy does not mean utterly destroy, dead means alive, death is not punishment.
People refusing to acknowledge even that Scripture -from beginning to end- plainly states such things as the wages of sin is death, that life ever after is gained by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Jesus Christ, and all others pass into the second death.
Those that say such things then turn around and tell us that we are confused and the
ones not believing Scripture when we affirm what is says, while they deny it. LOL.
Some even say sleep is a metaphor for watchful, wakeful awareness.
Indeed.
God not only is righteous, He must also appear righteous. And sure, it's not according to the "ways of men". That's a verse Baptists use to get out of a reasonable argument. But God, who is a Father, will not torment the ungodly forever and ever. He'll destroy them, just as it is written.
The principle in the age to come is: "God will be all in all". God will not be in the eternal conscious torment of demons and the godless.
-
1
- Show all
Well, I certainly was not referencing true believers when I talked about eternal punishment because the sins are against an eternal God. These would be those that are not covered by the blood of Christ. I thought everyone understood that point. Jesus Christ's Sacrifice is eternal because He is both fully God and fully man and His sacrifice will eternally cover the Saints sins.
Jer 19:5 and have built the high places of Baal, to burn their sons in the fire for burnt-offerings unto Baal; which I commanded not, nor spoke it, neither came it into my mind:
As far as this verse is concerned, this does not teach that God will not use fire in the final judgement. It simply states that the Lord never gave them a commandment to sacrifice their children - nor had He ever spoke such a thing - nor thought of such.
However, what about these, which are more to the point:
Isa_33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; trembling hath seized the godless ones: Who among us can dwell with the devouring fire? who among us can dwell with everlasting burnings?
In this verse, the fire and burning of God, represent His Anger and Wrath (fire), and everlasting indignation (burning).
Jer 19:5 and have built the high places of Baal, to burn their sons in the fire for burnt-offerings unto Baal; which I commanded not, nor spoke it, neither came it into my mind:
As far as this verse is concerned, this does not teach that God will not use fire in the final judgement. It simply states that the Lord never gave them a commandment to sacrifice their children - nor had He ever spoke such a thing - nor thought of such.
However, what about these, which are more to the point:
Isa_33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; trembling hath seized the godless ones: Who among us can dwell with the devouring fire? who among us can dwell with everlasting burnings?
In this verse, the fire and burning of God, represent His Anger and Wrath (fire), and everlasting indignation (burning).
It seems very much that you - in common with certain others of the HellFire Brigade - are so immersed in your literal interpretation of Scripture that uses symbolic language that you can't help but misrepresent my position and in so doing miss the point.
I am not disputing that God will send 'some' people, namely, wilful unrepentant sinners who stubbornly refuse His hand of friendship and grace and reject His Sovereign rights, to eternal casting off i.e. castaways for eternity.
Do you understand on that significant aspect we are on the same page?
What I'm challenging is this compulsive obsession with the belief that God will throw those sinners into a literal Lake of Fire where they will be burned alive for eternity!.
Neither you nor any others who share that cruel torture as 'just punishment' can articulate a sound reasonable argument in your very own words and with references to the ORIGINAL meaning of Hell, Hades, Sheol, and Gehenna.
All that you do is parrot what you've been told to believe. In other words you've uncritically swallowed whole sermons from some Hell Fire preacher who himself hasn't bothered to drill down into the details and very possible because he may just get enjoyment from the thought that others are being roasted whilst he self-righteously pats himself on the back for 'not being a sinner like those others.'
I am not disputing that God will send 'some' people, namely, wilful unrepentant sinners who stubbornly refuse His hand of friendship and grace and reject His Sovereign rights, to eternal casting off i.e. castaways for eternity.
Do you understand on that significant aspect we are on the same page?
What I'm challenging is this compulsive obsession with the belief that God will throw those sinners into a literal Lake of Fire where they will be burned alive for eternity!.
Neither you nor any others who share that cruel torture as 'just punishment' can articulate a sound reasonable argument in your very own words and with references to the ORIGINAL meaning of Hell, Hades, Sheol, and Gehenna.
All that you do is parrot what you've been told to believe. In other words you've uncritically swallowed whole sermons from some Hell Fire preacher who himself hasn't bothered to drill down into the details and very possible because he may just get enjoyment from the thought that others are being roasted whilst he self-righteously pats himself on the back for 'not being a sinner like those others.'
It won't have escaped your notice - and so I'm stating the obvious but nonetheless will say it anyway - that those who hold like a barnacle to that belief are oh so fond of citing a Scripture here and there in isolation and taken entirely out of context.
IF they were being consistent they would have to believe that when the Psalmist wrote: "...there is no God," they would have to believe that too!
IF they were being consistent they would have to believe that when the Psalmist wrote: "...there is no God," they would have to believe that too!
-
1
- Show all
You bet I take the Word of God literally. Unless, the literal will not fit within the context. To toss the literal interpretation out, willy-nilly, is to remain in the dark on many great Doctrines of Scripture.
Is the eternal punishment of God a literal fire? Well... probably not. Fire usually implies an ongoing judgement of God's indignation against those who rejected His Son and the Truth. Saints are said to be refined by fire. This fire is not literal but the pain of being refined is likened to that of being burned.
To spend eternity in punishment is also likened to being in the fire. It is the absents of the Lord. The total and complete absents of the Lord. The person in torment, is left with nothing but their reality of their sins and what they cost them. No joy. No hope.
Is the eternal punishment of God a literal fire? Well... probably not. Fire usually implies an ongoing judgement of God's indignation against those who rejected His Son and the Truth. Saints are said to be refined by fire. This fire is not literal but the pain of being refined is likened to that of being burned.
To spend eternity in punishment is also likened to being in the fire. It is the absents of the Lord. The total and complete absents of the Lord. The person in torment, is left with nothing but their reality of their sins and what they cost them. No joy. No hope.
-
1
- Show all