Agreed, but now people are aware there's solid Biblical Evidence that Jesus died for the Unrighteous, not the Elect.
Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked
- Thread starter ResidentAlien
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Oh, I realize that. I just wanted you to see that the "us" of the "us-ward" being the elect as is Peter (that's how it is "us"), and that
which he made clear in 1:1.
Grace is Love
And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.
Very interesting with one slight flaw: I never said that He died for the saved, I said He died for the elect -
those chosen, who throughout time, WILL become saved BY His death and not by anything they may do.
So, your attachment from Romans 5, fits perfectly. The elect aren't the saved, and are of the ungodly until they're saved.
Mercy is also Love and Longsuffering, but Grace is a Time Period that will FACTUALLY END like other time related periods do.
Lie to someone else!
The Bible is specific about dying for the UNGODLY, not how you interpret and twist it.
No one is righteous, including the elect, until they are saved. It is Christ's righteousness that makes them righteous.
Your error is that you want works unto salvation instead of grace.
I don't care what you say!
You ADDED WORDS not directly related nor found in conjecture to what you claimed.
Your comment makes no sense - "not directly related nor found in conjecture"? Huh?
The fact of God's LOVE for the world, LOVE for the ungodly, LOVE for sinners has been demonstrated to all of creation in the sacrifice of the only and beloved Son of God at the cross. This magnificent demonstration will be sung about in praises by angels, the host of heaven, and Saints, and be acknowledged by Satan, demons and damned souls of men......perpetually forever and ever.
This vast, unparalleled, never to be repeated demonstration of loving grace and mercy has settled FOR ALL ETERNITY the question of whether God is a God of love or a cruel despot.
The crucifixion also refutes and settles, once and for all, this very same slander that Satan has propagated since the fall: that God is NOT a God of love but a hateful cruel King. A slander that continues to this present day.
I wonder....does @rogerg realize that he is approving, agreeing with and propagating the slander of Satan against the Father? For he is declaring that God HATES the ungodly and HATES the sinner and HATES the world.
Somebody inform this person of their woeful folly.
I'm not shocked that you have no comprehension considering you have literally ADDED WORDING that cannot be found directly related to what Christ did.
You make it up to your own viewpoint not the Holy Spirits.
I'm sure you're lost on many Truths.
God hates everyone not justified by Christ and His wrath abides upon them.
wrath:
- anger, the natural disposition, temper, character
- movement or agitation of the soul, impulse, desire, any violent emotion, but esp. anger
- anger, wrath, indignation
- anger exhibited in punishment, hence used for punishment itself
- of punishments inflicted by magistrates
[Rom 1:18 KJV] 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
[Eph 5:6 KJV] 6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
[Col 3:6 KJV] 6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
The Bible clearly states Jesus DIED FOR THE UNGODLY!
That means those who are Saved and those who will never be Saved were both and are the UNGODLY!
ULTIMATELY, the UNGODLY means Jesus DIED FOR EVERYONE AS IN EVERY HUMAN BEING EVER.
So if someone claims Jesus only died for the Saved, that person is full of Satan!
Because Romans 5 clearly is the HOLY SPIRIT saying God died for EVERY HUMAN BEING EVER!!
That means those who are Saved and those who will never be Saved were both and are the UNGODLY!
ULTIMATELY, the UNGODLY means Jesus DIED FOR EVERYONE AS IN EVERY HUMAN BEING EVER.
So if someone claims Jesus only died for the Saved, that person is full of Satan!
Because Romans 5 clearly is the HOLY SPIRIT saying God died for EVERY HUMAN BEING EVER!!
Don't lay that accusation on me buddy. Such words have NEVER EVER come out of my mouth and there is NO POST OF MINE that you can quote from that says anything like that.
What you accuse me of is nothing less than SLANDER. But this is your habit after all isn't it?
Agree.
Does, @rogerg actually believe that JESUS DIED ONLY FOR THE GODLY? That JESUS DIED ONLY FOR THE RIGHTEOUS?
Someone please ask this person and clarify this crucial matter. Thank you.
Once justified/saved by Christ, they become a new person in Christ and no longer of the ungodly. Only the
unsaved remain of the ungodly but that doesn't mean they all will be saved.
Your logic is messed-up. Because Jesus died for some of the ungodly, does also not dictate that He died for all of the ungodly. You are making your own assumption about that, and it is illogical and doesn't exist. If Christ died for everyone, then
everyone must become saved and would demonstrate that salvation by coming to faith in Christ - but not all can or will, otherwise,
the wrath of God wouldn't/couldn't abide upon them but it does.
You clearly have NO AUTHORITY from God to make any claim when the Holy Spirit makes a concise and precise Satement and you spend 24 hours twisting it to fit YOUR FALSE DOCTRINE.
YOU NEED GOD!
Only a FOOL would listen to YOU!