Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

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cv5

cv5

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rogerg said:
"for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust."

That exactly my point - that God provides for the elect and non-elect alike in the physical realm. My point
was regarding the spiritual realm not the physical realm - they are different.

The verses you provided are directed toward those who are of the saved. They explain how the saved are to treat the unsaved.
They have nothing to do with, nor do they affect, whether or not any of them will become saved.
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Look....if you do not understand that post of mine.....we can part ways.

https://christianchat.com/threads/once-saved-always-saved-osas-debunked.201128/post-5015508
 
cv5

cv5

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rogerg said:
I don't understand your point?
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Here is the point....

2Pe 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Despite God's love, longsuffering and patience, some refuse and do not "come to repentance" and must be judged accordingly. Thats my point.

That is the tragedy of the Nation Israel. God's loving warnings went unheeded.....until the stroke of judgement came. Did God hate Israel? NO. In fact God has and eternal LOVE for Israel and will redeem them soon enough.
 
T

ThereRoseaLamb

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cv5 said:
Here is the point....

2Pe 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Despite God's love, longsuffering and patience, some refuse and do not "come to repentance" and must be judged accordingly. Thats my point.

That is the tragedy of the Nation Israel. God's loving warnings went unheeded.....until the stroke of judgement came. Did God hate Israel? NO. In fact God has and eternal LOVE for Israel and will redeem them soon enough.
Click to expand...

Standing O, perfectly said!!
 
cv5

cv5

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rogerg said:
They of Nineveh repented because they were symbolic of the saved.
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Ridiculous statement.

The fact is that God LOVED the Ninevites while they were STILL SINNERS and sent a prophet to warn them. They responded appropriately to God's loving warnings. And escaped judgement.
 
R

rogerg

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cv5 said:
Here is the point....

2Pe 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
Click to expand...
No. You don't understand who the "us-ward" are that God is not willing that any of should perish.
You need to read the salutation of 2 Peter verse 1:1 to know that, which you obviously didn't do. Observe:

"[2Pe 1:1 KJV] 1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:"

The "us-ward" includes "them that have obtained like precious faith with us". How? "(T)hrough the righteousness of God and our
Saviour Jesus Christ". Faith comes only through the righteousness of God - it is not produced by man, nor can it be given to oneself.
God, in like manner, is not willing that any of the elect should perish but come to repentance. True repentance
is given by God but only as a gift to the elect.

[2Ti 2:25 KJV] 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
 
R

rogerg

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cv5 said:
Ridiculous statement.

The fact is that God LOVED the Ninevites while they were STILL SINNERS and sent a prophet to warn them. They responded appropriately to God's loving warnings. And escaped judgement.
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Whatever - that's your opinion. I thought we were done with this dialogue - I know am.
 
cv5

cv5

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rogerg said:
Whatever - that's your opinion. I thought we were done with this dialogue - I know am.
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@rogerg: "They of Nineveh repented because they were symbolic of the saved."

First of all, that is a stretch to begin with. But if you want to head in that direction.....let me edit the statement to illustrate my position in the matter of the Ninevites.

"They of Nineveh were symbolic of the saved because they repented."
 
B

ButterflyJones

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rogerg said:
No. It is that whosoever is born-again, believes.

[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,



A dead person cannot give to spiritual themselves life, and all were spiritually dead before becoming born again.
So, it is not a question of forcing it is of being given life from death.

[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
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The carnal natural mind cannot understand the things of God.

That means something has to change that state of mind for us to understand things of God. And that thing is his Holy Spirit.
 
R

rogerg

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ButterflyJones said:
The carnal natural mind cannot understand the things of God.

That means something has to change that state of mind for us to understand things of God. And that thing is his Holy Spirit.
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Absolutely correct, ButterflyJones, and until and unless He does, then natural man (the unsaved) cannot understand.
 
R

rogerg

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cv5 said:
@rogerg: "They of Nineveh repented because they were symbolic of the saved."

First of all, that is a stretch to begin with. But if you want to head in that direction.....let me edit the statement to illustrate my position in the matter of the Ninevites.

"They of Nineveh were symbolic of the saved because they repented."
Click to expand...
Gee whiz, you keep going, don't you?

NO. Repentance is from salvation, not the reverse.
 
cv5

cv5

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rogerg said:
No. You don't understand who the "us-ward" are that God is not willing that any of should perish.
You need to read the salutation of 2 Peter verse 1:1 to know that, which you obviously didn't do. Observe:

"[2Pe 1:1 KJV] 1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:"

The "us-ward" includes "them that have obtained like precious faith with us". How? "(T)hrough the righteousness of God and our
Saviour Jesus Christ". Faith comes only through the righteousness of God - it is not produced by man, nor can it be given to oneself.
God, in like manner, is not willing that any of the elect should perish but come to repentance. True repentance
is given by God but only as a gift to the elect.

[2Ti 2:25 KJV] 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
Click to expand...
Look man, I don't know if you realize it or not, but what you are doing is extrapolating/assuming/projecting that God's sovereign ELECTION (which is undoubtedly Biblical and to which I fully agree) carries with it some bizarre notion that God FIRST HATES sinners and FIRST HATES the world. Right now, today. And back in the days of old Israel. And even further back, hating everyone born since the fall. And if you carry this insane concept further, God FIRST HATED the creation because of the inevitable rebellion and fall.

This is not Biblical, but it IS outrageous, and the craziest thing that I have ever hear on CC.

BTW.....we fallen creatures have NO IDEA of how man's repentance and election work together. No idea. But to assume that God FIRST HATED sinners and then loves us after we are saved/elect is utter nonsense.

“The ‘whosoever wills’ are the elect. The ‘whosoever won’t’ are the non-elect.”
-D.L. Moody

“Lord, save the elect, and then elect some more!”
-D.L. Moody
 
HeIsHere

HeIsHere

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The_Watchers_2017 said:
This I got saved and now I can live like the devil is the greatest message Satan ever preached.

Look at how many believe in that?
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I see twisting on your side too!

They accused Paul of teaching grace was a license to sin. He was not impressed.

And why not say, “Let us do evil that good may come”?—as we are slanderously reported and as some affirm that we say.
Their condemnation is just.

Roman 3:8

Meaning this slander comes from a heart of disbelief!
 
The_Watchers_2017

The_Watchers_2017

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HeIsHere said:
I see twisting on your side too!

They accused Paul of teaching grace was a license to sin. He was not impressed.

And why not say, “Let us do evil that good may come”?—as we are slanderously reported and as some affirm that we say.
Their condemnation is just.

Roman 3:8

Meaning this slander comes from a heart of disbelief!
Click to expand...
You think I am promoting being Saved means we can Sin?
 
The_Watchers_2017

The_Watchers_2017

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I've let the FALSE PROPHET rogerg run his lies all day that Jesus died for the Elect.

But I think it's time to prove he is a LIAR!

Read my attachment from Romans 5:

You will notice that it claims Jesus died for the [[UNGODLY]] not for the Saved.

Can't believe this Site continues to allow these LIARS to spread their DEMONIC GOSPEL!!
 

Attachments

S

Sipsey

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The_Watchers_2017 said:
I've let the FALSE PROPHET rogerg run his lies all day that Jesus died for the Elect.

But I think it's time to prove he is a LIAR!

Read my attachment from Romans 5:

You will notice that it claims Jesus died for the [[UNGODLY]] not for the Saved.

Can't believe this Site continues to allow these LIARS to spread their DEMONIC GOSPEL!!
Click to expand...
That ought to solve the issue, but somehow, I don’t think it will.
 
The_Watchers_2017

The_Watchers_2017

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HeIsHere said:
I think you are attacking grace, saying those who preach grace are preaching a license to sin.
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Grace is a time period.

Why is it that when the Antichrist and the Mark of the Beast are here and the beheaded are gone you don't read about the Grace of God any more?

You only read about the WRATH of God.

Because it ENDS!

If Grace ENDS, it means it is related to TIME.
 
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