Does God desire the salvation of all mankind?
- Thread starter Nehemiah6
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How was Scripture written by divine revelation if nobody had the Holy Spirit?
I think a distinction needs to be made between being indwelt, and being sealed.
When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. Luke 1:41
In Psalm 51:11, David prayed: Cast me not away from Your presence; take not Your Holy Spirit from me.
Numbers 27:18 And the Lord said to Moses: “Take Joshua the son of Nun with you, a man in whom is the Spirit, and lay your hand on him;
Judges 3:10a The Spirit of the Lord came upon him, and he judged Israel.
Judges 6:34 But the Spirit of the Lord came upon Gideon; then he blew the trumpet, and the Abiezrites gathered behind him.
Judges 13:25 And the Spirit of the Lord began to move upon him at Mahaneh Dan between Zorah and Eshtaol.
Judges 14:6 And the Spirit of the Lord came mightily upon him, and he tore the lion apart as one would have torn
apart a young goat, though he had nothing in his hand. But he did not tell his father or his mother what he had done.
1 Samuel 10:9-10 So it was, when he had turned his back to go from Samuel, that God gave him another heart;
and all those signs came to pass that day. When they came there to the hill, there was a group of prophets
to meet him; then the Spirit of God came upon him, and he prophesied among them.
1 Samuel 16:14 But the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and a distressing spirit from the Lord troubled him.
^ Those are just a few examples...
Not trying to top you like you always do me but merely to extend your most erudite of explanations, the difference isn't so much in the nature of the Spirit but the extent or expression of it. That is, much like the difference in sprinkling and pouring.
K
kaylagrl
Guest
"If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple" (Luke 14:26).
Is God telling me to hate my family?! Some of you need to learn where the Bible is literal. Preferring one nation over another, God's chosen, Israel, does not mean hate.
All scripture must harmonize before you will understand the truths found in the gospel.
How do you explain
The natural man, before he has been quickened to the new spiritual life, by God's grace, cannot have any understanding about spiritual things.
Your response has nothing to do with Romans 9: 11-13. God does not hate everybody. He hates sin and demands whorship and wants you to love Him and everyone else.
K
kaylagrl
Guest
Please answer the question. Hate is used in both verses. Should I hate my family?
Sorry, I got sidetracked. Isaiah 63:11 says that God put his Holy Spirit within Moses. All of the old testament saints were bern again, in the same manner that we are.
2 Tim 3:16 - All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.
You do realize that I think the same thing about the false doctrine you teach.
K
kaylagrl
Guest
Matt.3 In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.”
Matt 4 From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, z“Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”
Luke 5 Jesus answered them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 32 I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
Then why did both John and Jesus, and others, preach repent? Who were they telling to repent?
Forgiveness and healing is spiritual and unregenerate people understood that in the New Testament many times.
John 14:17 disagrees. what you're seeing before John 20:22 is the Holy Spirit ON unregenerate people. Being "Born again" in the present fashion wasn't POSSIBLE until the Ressurection.
BUT the "Natural man" (which all you have in the OLD TESTAMENT CAN be externally impressed by God in order to accomplish God's Will in his life. "Born Again" is a whole 'nuther breed of cat - ONLY possible after Jesus' perfect SIN OFFERING.
Actually the distinction is between being "Endued" (externally clothed with) power, and being INDWELLED by the Holy Spirit (being Born again).
The Calvie "Total depravity" theology, goes a lot too far, in it's proclaimed limits of what "Unregenerate man" is capable of. God, by his Holy Spirit spoke to me many times before I became a Christian.
UPON THEE is not the same as INDWELLING THEE. The Holy Spirit was IN NOBODY until John 20:22
When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. Luke 1:41
Surely Luke 1 precedes the events of John 20.
The unborn can react to the presence of the Holy Spirit ON them just like anybody else. MANY folks in the OLD Testament experienced the Holy Spirit ON themselves, but until John 20:22, The Spirit was IN nobody.
Hi Kaylagrl
Following the statement that we must "hate our father and mother, Jesus relates a metaphor about a man who builds a house without first counting the cost (Luke 14: 28-30). The man finds that he cannot follow through with what he set out to do. He leaves the house unfinished because he cannot pay what is required. Jesus' illustration helps explain His difficult statement about hating our mother and father--namely we must count the cost of being a disciple. There is a cost, and that is the point of the passage.
In order to be a disciple, we must be willing to give up everything for Jesus. Following Jesus requires commitment and faithfulness, even if our parents choose not to follow the Lord. If and when we are faced with the painful choice of loyalty to family versus loyalty to Jesus, we must choose Jesus. Even if our family members disown us - or worse- for being Christians, we must follow Christ. It is in this sense that we are "hating" our family. Jesus command to " hate father and mother" requires us to prioritize our relationship with Jesus over our relationship with parents, siblings, and other family members.
Of course, it is right to love our family members, and want them to love and follow God. Elsewhere, Jesus confirmed the 5th commandment that we honor our fathers and mothers (Mark 9: 7-13). And Paul sternly warned that " anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever" ( 1 Tim 5:8). Jesus' statementthat we "hate" father and mother must be seen in relation to the whole of Scripture. His point is not that we are to be heartless toward our families, only that we must love Him more.
In otherwards, if you want to be Jesus' disciple, you must hate everyone else by comparison.