Speaking in Tongues

[Polar]

Here's a good little book by a former tongue speaker who left the tongues movement. 17 Reasons Why I left The Tongues Movement.pdf by Alfred H. Pohl.

Quite a read. the interesting thing, is that he simply disagrees with many practices, which I do also, but does not trash tongues as you do

however, when one emphasizes the gifts above the One who gives them, most people will run into trouble

so again, he does not trash tongues. what he emphasizes, is correct teaching from scripture for the use of any of the gifts

 

[ResidentAlien]

One of the biggest problems with tongue speaking denominations is they elevate one thing (tongues or other miraculous sign gifts) above everything else. Tongue speaking has become to these sects what the Sabbath is to Seventh-Day Adventists.

 

[Wansvic]

I don't know that "Tongues" in and of themselves has had much of an impact on my life. It's kind of intellectually ridiculous to babble in a tongue that's meaningless to you - BUT - The Bible says that when I speak in tongues I'm "Edifying myself", so I take it on faith that the Bible doesn't LIE.

Self edification, of course, is a GOOD thing, since it inevitably leads to ministry to others. And speaking stuff that the Holy Spirit sources is good practice of other aspects of spoken giftings - like teaching, interpretation, prophesy.

The PRIMARY PRACTICAL aspect of being "Filled with the Holy Spirit" (AG/Pentecostal vernacular - Biblically: "Endued with POWER from on high" according to Jesus) with "tongues" being a feature of that, was that suddenly I was able to teach small group Bible studies, and adult Sunday School classes with Biblical content, that would simple "flow in" before the classes, and I could go on with materials given by the Holy Spirit every week for YEARS. BEFORE that would have been simply IMPOSSIBLE to do.

I've NEVER spoken in tongues in a public setting, however I have on many occasions been burdened to INTERPRET tongues in meetings, and occasionally to speak prophetically (same gifting, different "language").

Just curious. If you don't mind could you explain what you experience when your operate in the gift of interpretation? ie, Do you hear the message in your mind as the person presents the message in an unknown language? And then speak what you heard?

 

[VARob]

One of the biggest problems with tongue speaking denominations is they elevate one thing (tongues or other miraculous sign gifts) above everything else. Tongue speaking has become to these sects what the Sabbath is to Seventh-Day Adventists.

Some might, not all do.

You're against it, you don't believe in it. You're just saying stuff, hoping something will "stick."

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

When Jesus returns tongues will no longer be necessary since we will speak with Him face to face.

So, you're saying that tongues are necessary? Would you elaborate on that for us? Thank you.

If Tongues are necessary, what am I missing? How am I incomplete? What do those who speak in Tongues have that I do not have?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

You said:
"if we’re saying remarkable things and no one understands what we are saying what benefit is it to anyone ? Interpretation is the gift that needs to compliment tongues in order for there to be any benefit at all even the prayer wouldn’t understand or benefit from a prayer without known words it truly would be babelling Incoherantly not even knowing what was being said"

This is true only in the assembly or if you misapplied the Gift.

#1 - The Gift of Tongues is a known language to God in which HE delights in.

#2 - It is for the edification of the individual Believer FIRST and FOREMOST.

#3 - The Holy Spirit administers the Gifts which are recieved (as all blessings are) thru faith in the Word.

#4 - Cessation Gifts in this present time is a lie far greater then the lie of pre-trib rapture.

#5 - The Authoritative Confirmed Duration of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit with His Gifts are clearly given in 1 Corinthians which is the FINAL AUTHORITY on this Truth.

Peace and blessing in Christ fill you today my Brother

“2 - It is for the edification of the individual Believer FIRST and FOREMOST.”

where do we learn this in scripture ?

“For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭14:14‬

how is it benefiting the person ? If no one knows what’s being said even the person saying it ? Sort of Paul’s point there without us having to explain anything else.

Is there any scripture to tell us the benefit ? I’m actually asking if your aware of any scriptures that tell us about the benefit to the individual in personally not aware of many explaining any of that but that doesn’t mean they aren’t there

do you know of any scriptures saying what your saying there about the gift of tongues ? I always sort of require scripture for anything to make much sense

I would say every spiritual gift is for the entire body even tongues and for it to be beneficial it needs interpretation even if the persons alone it still
Isn’t going to benefit them just babbling and not knowing what they are saying pauls Making the point not me

As far as tongues being an I dividuao
Benefit I’m not sure hate in scriptire it seems a gift meant for the edifying of the church If there’s an interpretation

“And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭12:28-31‬

I’m not sure any of us actually understand the gift of tongues I know I don’t completely understand it but also the res a lot we can learn about it if we study the subject in scriptire

let’s do that brother let’s talk about what the scriptures explain about tongues

the first point it seems to appear is here

“And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilæans? And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:4, 6-8, 11-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Then again

“And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:45-46‬ ‭

what can we learn out tongues from those two examples ? And the. What can we learn from the rest of the New Testament about tongues ?

that’s sort of where my Mind is brother we all have opinions and beliefs yours are respected and appreciated but what can the Bible explain about these many things we all have thoughts about ?

 

[VARob]

So, you're saying that tongues are necessary? Would you elaborate on that for us? Thank you.

Tongues are not strictly necessary, but:

1 Cor 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

If Tongues are necessary, what am I missing? How am I incomplete?

You're missing being edified and built up in the ways that tongues do (1 Cor 14:4, 14, 17; Jude 1:20).

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

let’s do that brother let’s talk about what the scriptures explain about tongues

I've been trying, but par for the course, folks refuse to answer some questions and even turn questions into accusations. Good luck getting to the bottom of this issue, for when people refuse to use their brains and rely upon their emotions, disaster is nearly guaranteed.

 

[ResidentAlien]

You're against it, you don't believe in it. You're just saying stuff, hoping something will "stick."

I'm not against it, I'm for truth. If you want to babble nonsense be my guest.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Tongues are not strictly necessary, but:

Right, so we should never reference the necessity of Tongues, for not all possess this Gift.

I would like to add that I don't run around telling people who speak in Tongues that they are wrong, or that they are being deceived. I have a woman in our weekly Bible study who prays in front of us through Tongues. There is no interpreter, thus she shouldn't be doing it, but nonetheless, if this amazing woman believes that she possesses this gift, who am I to argue (with her)? I would never do such a thing. Further, I am friends with a member here who claims to be a Prophet, and I support him 100%. I have never been a discouraging voice to this person nor would I ever be. If someone claims these Powers and these Gifts, I will support them in all healthy ways, never intending to discourage . . . unlike some here, who attempt to discourage me in my beliefs. Go figure.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

You're missing being edified and built up in the ways that tongues do (1 Cor 14:4, 14, 17; Jude 1:20).

That is not entirely True. I have been asking someone to tell of this edification, and what Tongues bring to their life that is not being brought to mine. We're getting a big zero for a response on that point, aren't we/I? Now, none of you likely feels that this is a problem, but I do. And so pardon me for an opinion.

 

[VARob]

I'm not against it, I'm for truth. If you want to babble nonsense be my guest.

To you, it's nonsense. To God:

1 Cor 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

1 Cor 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

1 Cor 14:14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

1 Cor 14:17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.

Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

 

[VARob]

Right, so we should never reference the necessity of Tongues, for not all possess this Gift.

Was this wishful thinking?

1 Cor 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

I would like to add that I don't run around telling people who speak in Tongues that they are wrong, or that they are being deceived. I have a woman in our weekly Bible study who prays in front of us through Tongues. There is no interpreter, thus she shouldn't be doing it, but nonetheless

That's right. When tongues are spoken in public, that must be interpreted.

if this amazing woman believes that she possesses this gift, who am I to argue (with her)? I would never do such a thing. Further, I am friends with a member here who claims to be a Prophet, and I support him 100%. I have never been a discouraging voice to this person nor would I ever be. If someone claims these Powers and these Gifts, I will support them in all healthy ways, never intending to discourage . . . unlike some here, who attempt to discourage me in my beliefs. Go figure.

 

[VARob]

That is not entirely True. I have been asking someone to tell of this edification, and what Tongues bring to their life that is not being brought to mine. We're getting a big zero for a response on that point, aren't we/I? Now, none of you likely feels that this is a problem, but I do. And so pardon me for an opinion.

To me, it's enough to believe what the Bible says:

1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

When a person speaks in tongues, he KNOWS he has the gift of the Holy Spirit, that he is a child of God. Saved.

Also, speaking in tongues is "giving thanks well" (1 Cor 14:17).

 

[ResidentAlien]

Generally speaking, tongue talkers and Charismatics don't understand the scripture. They have a lot of head knowledge and can quote scriptures backwards and forwards but they don't have a true understanding of what it means or how to understand it. The reason for this is simple: they base their understanding of scripture on their experiences. That is, they have an experience and then look for scriptures to support their experience rather than truly understanding the scripture and then basing their experiences on truth. This leads to errors one after another.

 

[DJT_47]

OK but dear sir you cannot say that the church today [or at any time in her history] has improved on what she was then. We have not come to a unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ.

We still see as through a glass darkly we still know only in part.

I think the perfect Paul speaks about is the kingdom of God, when He comes, so it is still Christ, seeing He is the King. We shall see Him face to face praise His name forever.

We have the scriptures and the scriptures encourages us to speak in tongues and to earnestly seek the gifts of the Spirit

The need for the various gifts which Paul equated to the human body was needed then, but not now. Why was there prophecy, because there was no written word to guide, and tongues to convince the nonbelievers, also because there was nothing else to do so. The various body memebers which had various gifts were necessary then. Not now. We have the bible and no longer need prophecy. The word is complete and it's the entire revelation.

The unity of the faith then is clear. It was due to the division they were already expierencing, i e.; I am of Apollos, or I am of Cephas, etc. The letter was to them to address their issues, not us and not based on some yet future event, so it must be looked at accordingly.
We no longer know in part as they did, hence the individual gifts, which were in part. We have the complete word of God and no longer need piece meal gifts.

 

[wattie]

To me, it's enough to believe what the Bible says:

1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

When a person speaks in tongues, he KNOWS he has the gift of the Holy Spirit, that he is a child of God. Saved.

Also, speaking in tongues is "giving thanks well" (1 Cor 14:17).

Whoa ... tongues are not a requirement nor proof of having received eternal life.

As they were , they were among gifts that not all had. Believers in a church had different gifts to compliment that parts of the local church body. So some wouldn't be speaking in tongues but would have the gift of knowledge for example.

The evidence of having received the Holy Spirit individually is the fruits of the Spirit like patience, love, hope, brotherly kindness etc..

You probably are meaning something I am missing here.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Noted... But spiritually and doctrinally, we're the same as they were. 1 Cor 14 applies to us today, just as it applied to them.

Sure - and????

 

[wattie]

The need for the various gifts which Paul equated to the human body was needed then, but not now. Why was there prophecy, because there was no written word to guide, and tongues to convince the nonbelievers, also because there was nothing else to do so. The various body memebers which had various gifts were necessary then. Not now. We have the bible and no longer need prophecy. The word is complete and it's the entire revelation.

The unity of the faith then is clear. It was due to the division they were already expierencing, i e.; I am of Apollos, or I am of Cephas, etc. The letter was to them to address their issues, not us and not based on some yet future event, so it must be looked at accordingly.
We no longer know in part as they did, hence the individual gifts, which were in part. We have the complete word of God and no longer need piece meal gifts.

Yes, the sign gifts were associated with an immature Christianity.

The unity of the faith is in the completed New Testament. The process of inspiration was still going on then and now is finished. The apostles passed and early churches set up.

And yes.. when Paul says desire to speak in tongues.. it is to the church of Corinth then. Not to us now.. unless there is nothing limiting its use, but there is with inspiration of the Scriptures finished.

A key thing though is getting these gifts defined rightly. From that point, then it is clearer what has happened to them.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

The need for the various gifts which Paul equated to the human body was needed then, but not now.

So "no need" for "Wisdom", "Knowledge", "Discerning of Spirits", "Physical Healing", "FAITH", or "Miracles" in 2022!!!

WHO KNEW!!!

Chuckle!!!