Is Baptism necessary for Salvation?
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A new member with 4 posts to their name in this thread. And they're insisting, surprise, baptism saves.
God's word doesn't change?
There are said to be over 60 versions of God's word published in the English language.
If we were saved by Salvation both Jesus and Paul would have set poor examples in delivering God's good news.
Because Jesus baptized no one. And Paul said he did not come to baptize.
Lastly, you claim the apostles were told to baptize in the name of the father,son, holy spirit. Those aren't names.
What was that name?
Jesus.
Or,Lord.
Acts 8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
Acts 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
The apostles never baptized anyone in those three names.Because they aren't names.
They are the identity of God.
God is holy spirit. Jesus was God, who was The Word made flesh.
The name above all names.
Wrong
That sounds like blasphemy of God to me. We are delivered from sin and its consequences because of Jesus. You just said Jesus set a poor example of delivering the gospel.
Wrong
John 3:22 After these things Jesus and his disciples came into Judean territory, and there he spent time with them and was baptizing
John 3:26 And they came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, he who was with you on the other side of the Jordan, about whom you testified—look, this one is baptizing, and all are coming to him!"
Wrong
You’ve taken that out of context and here’s why: Paul isn’t above the great commission. Christ commanded all Christians to teach, make disciples, and water baptize.
Wrong
You still don’t understand what “In the name of…” means. It isn’t some incantation that is uttered prior to a water baptism. In the name of means by the authority of.
In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit means by the authority of God and guess who the Son is? That’s Jesus.
Wrong
Jesus said in Matthew 28:19 “in the name of”
“Therefore, go and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,”
What occurs in obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus is not symbolic. A spiritual reality occurs. As Paul said those who have been baptized into Jesus Christ are baptized into His death. As such, having been crucified with Him is when the body of sin is destroyed. Remember, the words of Paul are those inspired by God.
Rom 6:3-6
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:"
God alone brings about the spiritual reality that occurs when man submits to God's command to be baptized. Paul makes this point in Romans 6:3-6:
"Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." Rom 6:3-6
Jesus accomplished his purpose on earth as we know when before he gave up his life and from the cross said, it is accomplished.
Jesus baptized no one. Paul said he did not come to baptize.
Your hypothesis does not survive those facts reported in scripture.
Hope you don't mind my replying with a description given by someone else that explains what I believe scripture reflects as well:
W. A. Criswell, pastor of the First Baptist Church of Dallas, Texas, and past president of the Southern Baptist Convention, described the deity of Christ in the following terms:
"I often wonder at people who think that in heaven they are going to see three Gods. If you ever see three Gods, then what the Mohammedan says about you is true and what the Jewish neighbor says about you is true. You are not a monotheist, you are a polytheist. You believe in a multiplication of Gods, plural. “Hear, O Israel, the Lord thy God is one God.” We know God as our Father, we know God as our Saviour and we know God by His Spirit in our hearts. But there are not three Gods.
The true Christian is a monotheist. There is one God. “I and my Father are one.” “He that hath seen me hath seen the Father.” The Lord God is He that speaks. It is He that John saw when he turned around. The only God you will ever see is the Lord God whom John saw in the vision of the lampstands. The only God you will ever feel is the Lord God’s Spirit in your heart. The only God there is, is the great Father of us all. The one Lord God, Christ. In the Old Testament we call Him Jehovah. In the New Testament, the New Covenant, we call Him Jesus. The one great God, standing in authority and in judgment and in judicial dignity among His churches, here today, watching over us. “I saw one like [a great mystical symbol] unto the Son of man.” It is the very Lord God who is coming, for Christ Jesus is God of this universe. We are not going to see three Gods in heaven. Never persuade yourself that in glory we are going to look at God No. 1 and God No. 2 and God No. 3. No! There is one great Lord God. We know Him as our Father, we know Him as our Saviour, we know Him as the Holy Spirit in our hearts. There is one God and this is the great God, called in the Old Testament, Jehovah, and, incarnate, called in the New Testament Jesus, the Prince of heaven, who is coming.
Jesus is Yahweh of the Old Testament. This is established by studying many Old Testament statements concerning Yahweh that the New Testament applies to Jesus. For example, in Isaiah 45:23 Yahweh said, “Unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear,” but in Romans 14:10-11 and Philippians 2:10-11 Paul applied this prophecy to Christ. The Old Testament describes Yahweh as the Almighty, I am, only Savior, Lord of lords, First and Last, only Creator, Holy One, Redeemer, Judge, Shepherd and Light; yet the New Testament gives all these titles to Jesus Christ.
Jesus is the Father. “His name shall be called . . .The mighty God, The everlasting Father” (Isaiah 9:6). “I and my Father are one” (John 10:30). “The Father is in me, and I in him” (John 10:38). “He that hath seen me hath seen the Father” (John 14:9). Jesus is the father of overcomers (Revelation 21:6-7). The Bible attributes many works both to the Father and to Jesus: resurrecting Christ’s body, sending the Paraclete, drawing men to God, answering prayer, sanctifying believers, and resurrecting the dead.
The Holy Spirit is literally the Spirit that was in Jesus Christ. “The Spirit of truth . . . dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you” (John 14:17-18). “The Lord is that Spirit” (II Corinthians 3:17). The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Son and the Spirit of Jesus Christ (Galatians 4:6; Philippians 1:19). The New Testament ascribes the following works both to Jesus and to the Holy Spirit: moving on prophets of old, resurrection of Christ’s body, work as the Paraclete, giving words to believers in time of persecution, intercession, sanctification, and indwelling of believers. While not rejecting trinitarianism, Lewis Smedes has acknowledged, “The experience of the Spirit is the experience with the Lord. In the new age, the Lord is the Spirit. . . . The Spirit is the ascended Jesus in His earthly action. . . . The Spirit is Christ in His redemptive functions. . . . This suggests that we do not serve a biblical purpose by insisting on the Spirit as a person who is separate from the person whose name is Jesus.”
He made an insulting conjecture and did not ask any question.
So I told him go on and put his money up, being thats where he went with it.
Then I asked him a question.
We're of course wasting our time posting to the works by Baptism is the only means of salvation crowd here.
Hopefully if there are people reading sites like this hoping to learn about Jesus they'll find a Bible, not a forum. While if they've read threads like this I hope they learn that they will never come to Salvation by Baptism. Baptism is a work, an effort, undertaking, by people. Baptism does not bring anyone into Salvation.
Never has, never will. Never, ever.
John 5:24“Truly, truly, I [Jesus] say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
John 3:18 He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
John 6:35 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst.
John 1:12 to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Proverbs 3:5-6 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths.
Baptism does not secure,insure,guarantee,
bring , Salvation.
John 6:28-29 Then they said to him, “What must we do, to be doing the works of God?” Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.”
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. ''
If someone is reading this wondering how to know Jesus please, trust Jesus to save you. Not liquid water.
Jesus is the water of life. The creator of liquid water.
If liquid water saves you, when 3/4th of Earth's surface is covered in water all you would have to have done is take a swim.
Most everyone's heard the name Jesus. Just go swimming in the sea,ocean,river,lake. You're saved!
That's not true either.
God bless.
Jesus' sacrifice is what makes one's spiritual rebirth possible. And what Paul said about baptism still holds true, and will continue until Jesus returns. Please pay close attention to what Paul actually said, keeping in mind that only those who have had their sins destroyed will gain entrance into the kingdom of God:
"Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
"FOR IF we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed..." Rom 6:3-6
Actually being obedient to the command to be water baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus is the result of trusting in God. For it was He who instituted the NT command along with it's purpose.
About 90% of the KJV Bible and 75% of the revised standard version was taken from the Biblical Scholar, Linguist, and Protestant Reformer William Tyndale translation.
https://www.gotquestions.org/William-Tyndale.html
''For his work on the English Bible, Tyndale drew the ire of the Anglican Church, the Roman Catholic Church, and other powerful entities. The established church taught that they alone were the conservators and interpreters of God’s Word and that the laity had no business reading it for themselves. Tyndale worked tirelessly to make the Bible accessible to all, even if the church opposed him. Tyndale famously said, “I defy the Pope and all his laws. If God spare my life ere many years, I will cause the boy that drives the plow to know more of the scriptures than you!” ''
More over not a work of man, but a work of God. I mean do we say because a man preach and another believe that it is a work of man? Certainly not. So why would we say if two men enter the water and proclaim the Gospel and the Words of Jesus that it is a work of man. Every man bathes in water yet this is not baptism.
Not true. Otherwise Jesus,who baptized no one, did not example that purpose you wrongly add as a work of man to assist God's grace that saves through faith.
You also in that false attribution therein condemn every person who accepted Christ and were not also baptized.
But you know this. It's your purpose and intent.
The men who did the translating the 47 or what number it was were all but one Anglican priests, bishops, scholars.
Regardless of their use of Tyndale or Erasmus
Yes, I read your other post that stated the same thing. I'm informing you of where those translators gained their materials. That is 90% of which was from the work of William Tyndale.
Who was burned at the stake for his efforts pre-KJV.
"Sons of God" are always believers. Human believers. They are defined as such in John 1:12 and at least 2 other places in the NT by saying things like "we"(believers) are the "sons of God" and "they"(believers) are the "sons of God" . There is none such passage which equates "sons of God" with "angels" or any other being besides believers, none, zero.