Part of the reason that prompted this question is that Pastor Steven Anderson said that "oene" in the NT refers to non-alcoholic fruit juice.
I'd be interested in reading others' opinions.
I'd be interested in reading others' opinions.
Did Jesus drink alcohol?
- Thread starter AndrewMorgan
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mr. anderson says a lot of things.
how many are true??
that is the question.
but, my opinion- Jesus was called a winebibber.
so that points to alcohol.
Remember the first miracle of Jesus, turning water into wine at a wedding in Cana...... Jesus humself must have drunk a little bit of wine himself, i think it would have been an affront in these days not to have to.
Everything you need to know you have in the words of Christ throughout the bible, your most valuable source of info. Blessings
JF
One thing we know for certain. It was common to dilute wine with two to three parts water. It is documented in many sources from the time. All historians agree that it was the culture. I don't find many interested in diluting their wine today which suggest that their motives are not good. So never let anyone tell you that Jesus or the Christians drank the same strength of wine you buy today. Unless you dilute it with two to three parts water which was the common custom at that time.
This can be discovered with a Google search. That is how plentiful the ancient documentation is to support this cultural fact. Even Plato wrote about it. There are lots of documents from the time about it. It is not even a debate among historians. Only uneducated debate it.
This can be discovered with a Google search. That is how plentiful the ancient documentation is to support this cultural fact. Even Plato wrote about it. There are lots of documents from the time about it. It is not even a debate among historians. Only uneducated debate it.
J
joecoten
Guest
Back then, they didn't have refrigeration. The clear reading is that Jesus drank wine. There's nothing wrong with drinking wine. Whereas drinking too much wine is a problem. Scripture warns about overdrinking alcohol. That's how I understand it. Some disagree...so what?
it took at lot of wine to get wasted back in that time.
that is why God spoke against " those who are mighty at drinking wine".
Nope....
He needs to learn proper anthropology.
They called Jesus a drunk for a reason...and it wasn't because he always abstained from alcohol.
I know it was a Roman and Greek thing to do so but did not know the jewish people of that time did so... the torah does not mention wine dilution.
JF
Active duty priests did....Aaron's sons died because they got drunk....
But alcohol was a sterilizing agent for water. Also a flavoring agent.
For some the real question would be, is it a sin to drink alcohol?
The answer has to be no. Yes, sobriety is the ideal, but conditions exist under
which alcohol was recommended, and celebrations were one such occasion.
However...
The first two mentions of wine in scriptures were LOT and his daughters and Noah...
Neither was all that good of a deal.
The first two mentions of wine in scriptures were LOT and his daughters and Noah...
Neither was all that good of a deal.
P
pottersclay
Guest
I was under the impression that wine needs to ferment. So if thats the case id say no but then again if the wine had a chance to age....? Or possible there were 2 kinds of wine offered?
The reason they called Jesus a winebibber and a glutton is because he ate with those who were known to be such. In that culture and religious teachings it was considered condoning the sins of the people you had food fellowship with.
They just assumed that if Jesus was eating with sinners who were known to be town drunks, miscreants and naredowells he was probably drinking as heavy as they were known to do. It's not that they had any proof of Jesus drinking.
I don't believe it was ever a sin to drink diluted wine but that is not why they called him a winebibber. It was because of the company he kept.
There were known drunkards, gluttons and prostitutes who were among that dinner party and therefore in their minds Jesus was probably guilty of doing the same things. They believed that if he was a real prophet he would know not to eat with such heathens.
They just assumed that if Jesus was eating with sinners who were known to be town drunks, miscreants and naredowells he was probably drinking as heavy as they were known to do. It's not that they had any proof of Jesus drinking.
I don't believe it was ever a sin to drink diluted wine but that is not why they called him a winebibber. It was because of the company he kept.
There were known drunkards, gluttons and prostitutes who were among that dinner party and therefore in their minds Jesus was probably guilty of doing the same things. They believed that if he was a real prophet he would know not to eat with such heathens.
Well it's obscured by the original language as "blood of the grape" in literal terms but Hebrew is a metaphoric language...
We know from anthropology that there were several types of wine including fortified wines, aperitif, liquor and jam made from grapes all with the same label. They also made beer and many liked it....the vinegar they gave Jesus was a type of drink using vinegar and water but still had some sugar...almost a lemonade.
Kinda interesting stuff when you look at it.
Also, most of the scripture references used to say that drinking alcohol is a sin actually say that drunkenness is a sin, meaning drinking too much of alcohol. Of course we are called to use our judgement.
Yes, he did. Consider the topography of Jesus day.
Wine nourishes the body. And when water is not the "turn the tap and drink your fill" luxury it is for us today, a life saver.
Remember too, the wedding at Cana. Just turned water stored in stone jars I to wine at his mother's request.
If drinking alcoholic beverages is a sin, Jesus contributed to sinners ability to sin by making jars full of wine. Rather than leaving the people water to drink.
Of course Jesus could never sin.
Drinking alcoholic beverages is not a sin. Becoming drunk, losing or compromising your faculties, is.
Hope that helps.
From what I have learned, they had "new wine," that being wine not yet fermited, and they had fermited wine. I would expect Jesus drank both at one time or another.
That being said, there is a huge difference between wine and "alcohol." Alcohol brings to mind strong drink such as whiskey or some such. I do not believe Jesus ever drank such as these, and there is no evidence that I have found that He did.
Do not know this Pastor Anderson person, so can not comment on the truth of his teachings..
Yes. As well, the Apostle Paul spoke of such in his instructions to those desiring to be Bishops or Deacons in 1st Timothy, Chapter 3:
1This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
8Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
This tells me that Paul did not believe Bishops should partake of ferminted wine AT ALL, and Deacons only a wee bit!
Boy, that teaching didn't last through the ages did it?
John Gill:
or for wine, or for strong drink;
to drink with his food, whether wine or any other liquor; the Targum of Jonathan is, wine new or old, which he chose; but the latter, strong drink, Aben Ezra says, was a liquor made of honey and of dates, of wheat and of barley:
here:
Deuteronomy 14 Commentary - John Gill's Exposition of …
However, this is under the 1st Covenant is it not? From all the Scriptures in the New Testament, it is clear to me that Jesus did drink fermited wine, but there is no evidence He drank "hard liquor." Having a glass of wine is not a sin, but drinking wine until one is drunk IS.....
Luke 7:33,34
1 Corinthians 6:2
or for wine, or for strong drink;
to drink with his food, whether wine or any other liquor; the Targum of Jonathan is, wine new or old, which he chose; but the latter, strong drink, Aben Ezra says, was a liquor made of honey and of dates, of wheat and of barley:
here:
Deuteronomy 14 Commentary - John Gill's Exposition of …
However, this is under the 1st Covenant is it not? From all the Scriptures in the New Testament, it is clear to me that Jesus did drink fermited wine, but there is no evidence He drank "hard liquor." Having a glass of wine is not a sin, but drinking wine until one is drunk IS.....
Luke 7:33,34
1 Corinthians 6:2