Were Nephilim (Gen 6) judged differently by God?
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One step at a time, brother.
I am still waiting for your answer to my question (post# 187) with quoted Scripture before I offer my position on that.
Again, my question was:
How do you know the supernatural beings in Dan 10:10-21, Eph 6:10-13, and 1 Pet 5:8 are angels?
Your answer was:
Daniel 10:10-21 are combatting angels / good vs evil
Eph 6:10-13 "the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms." = fallen angels
1 Peter 5:8 = the devil = this includes the fallen angels under his authority"
To which my response was:
How do you know that?
Please show me with Scripture how you know these beings are angels. If not, there's no shame in saying you don't know.
I am still waiting for your answer to my question (post# 187) with quoted Scripture before I offer my position on that.
Again, my question was:
How do you know the supernatural beings in Dan 10:10-21, Eph 6:10-13, and 1 Pet 5:8 are angels?
Your answer was:
Daniel 10:10-21 are combatting angels / good vs evil
Eph 6:10-13 "the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms." = fallen angels
1 Peter 5:8 = the devil = this includes the fallen angels under his authority"
To which my response was:
How do you know that?
Please show me with Scripture how you know these beings are angels. If not, there's no shame in saying you don't know.
Jesus said in Mark 16:15
15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
If we take that literally, which we have no reason to suspect Jesus meant it any other way, then that means preach the gospel to everything in in creation which includes other spiritual beings. There isn't an aparent reason Jesus would command His disciples to preach the gospel to all creation unless somehow the gospel was applicable to all of creation.
This command to preach the gospel to all creation expands the scope of what, especially who, the gospel actually applies to.
Paul said in Romans 1:16 that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation for everyone that believes.
I am not saying I believe fallen angles, nephilim, or unclean spirts are judged differently by God, can be forgiven, receive salvation, etc, but Jesus said to preach the gospel to literally every creature or everything in creation and I don't think He said that pointlessly.
15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
If we take that literally, which we have no reason to suspect Jesus meant it any other way, then that means preach the gospel to everything in in creation which includes other spiritual beings. There isn't an aparent reason Jesus would command His disciples to preach the gospel to all creation unless somehow the gospel was applicable to all of creation.
This command to preach the gospel to all creation expands the scope of what, especially who, the gospel actually applies to.
Paul said in Romans 1:16 that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation for everyone that believes.
I am not saying I believe fallen angles, nephilim, or unclean spirts are judged differently by God, can be forgiven, receive salvation, etc, but Jesus said to preach the gospel to literally every creature or everything in creation and I don't think He said that pointlessly.
Good Morning,
Thank you for reposting my scriptural answers = which verify that these are combatting angels/spirits that have been asigned dominion 'rights' that they seek to guard.
All truth begins in Genesis.
The Garden Account gives us the First Truth which all Truth will build upon.
The Garden Account gives us the First Truth = Spiritual Battle = Good vs Evil
Now, since i have given, at the very least, foundational scripture - please let me know your thoughts.
AGREE - since we are not in person or over the phone directly, we can go slow.
P.S. = i sustained an internal injury to my chest = please offer up a prayer for healing = thank you
Thank you for reposting my scriptural answers = which verify that these are combatting angels/spirits that have been asigned dominion 'rights' that they seek to guard.
All truth begins in Genesis.
The Garden Account gives us the First Truth which all Truth will build upon.
The Garden Account gives us the First Truth = Spiritual Battle = Good vs Evil
Now, since i have given, at the very least, foundational scripture - please let me know your thoughts.
AGREE - since we are not in person or over the phone directly, we can go slow.
P.S. = i sustained an internal injury to my chest = please offer up a prayer for healing = thank you
I hope you heal up well and soon!
The beings in Daniel 10, Eph 6, and 1 Pet 5...You keep calling them angels, but the verses don't call them angels. I haven't given my opinion yet because I am currently examining your claim, not mine.
Since you called them angels, I am asking, how do you know they are angels?
The beings in Daniel 10, Eph 6, and 1 Pet 5...You keep calling them angels, but the verses don't call them angels. I haven't given my opinion yet because I am currently examining your claim, not mine.
Since you called them angels, I am asking, how do you know they are angels?
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In those days I, Daniel, was mourning three full weeks. 3I ate no pleasant food, no meat or wine came into my mouth, nor did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.
4Now on the twenty-fourth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, that is, the Tigris,
5I lifted my eyes and looked, and behold, a certain man clothed in linen, whose waist was girded with gold of Uphaz!
6His body was like beryl, his face like the appearance of lightning, his eyes like torches of fire, his arms and feet like burnished bronze in color, and the sound of his words like the voice of a multitude.
7And I, Daniel, alone saw the vision, for the men who were with me did not see the vision; but a great terror fell upon them, so that they fled to hide themselves. 8Therefore I was left alone when I saw this great vision, and no strength remained in me; for my [vigor was turned to frailty in me, and I retained no strength. 9Yet I heard the sound of his words; and while I heard the sound of his words I was in a deep sleep on my face, with my face to the ground.
10Suddenly, a hand touched me, which made me tremble on my knees and on the palms of my hands.
11And he said to me, “O Daniel, man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak to you, and stand upright, for I have now been sent to you.” While he was speaking this word to me, I stood trembling.
12Then he said to me, “Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your words. 13But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
14Now I have come to make you understand what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision refers to many days yet to come.”
18Then again, the one having the likeness of a man touched me and strengthened me.
No one upholds me against these, except Michael your prince
"And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought," - Revelation ch12
After studying the Word for 35 years (and being Baptized in the Holy Spirit) = Truth becomes accessible thru the Holy Spirit and the Word = Gospel of John
4Now on the twenty-fourth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, that is, the Tigris,
5I lifted my eyes and looked, and behold, a certain man clothed in linen, whose waist was girded with gold of Uphaz!
6His body was like beryl, his face like the appearance of lightning, his eyes like torches of fire, his arms and feet like burnished bronze in color, and the sound of his words like the voice of a multitude.
7And I, Daniel, alone saw the vision, for the men who were with me did not see the vision; but a great terror fell upon them, so that they fled to hide themselves. 8Therefore I was left alone when I saw this great vision, and no strength remained in me; for my [vigor was turned to frailty in me, and I retained no strength. 9Yet I heard the sound of his words; and while I heard the sound of his words I was in a deep sleep on my face, with my face to the ground.
10Suddenly, a hand touched me, which made me tremble on my knees and on the palms of my hands.
11And he said to me, “O Daniel, man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak to you, and stand upright, for I have now been sent to you.” While he was speaking this word to me, I stood trembling.
12Then he said to me, “Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your words. 13But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
14Now I have come to make you understand what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision refers to many days yet to come.”
18Then again, the one having the likeness of a man touched me and strengthened me.
No one upholds me against these, except Michael your prince
"And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought," - Revelation ch12
After studying the Word for 35 years (and being Baptized in the Holy Spirit) = Truth becomes accessible thru the Holy Spirit and the Word = Gospel of John
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There is so much of this we don't know. What I believe... We know some are held in chains since they would not obey God. We don't know before Noah how many were on the earth. Could have been thousands or billions. How many of them were Neph. But we know every thought .. jusu wow every thought was evil. I believe they are the demons we see today. Well they are always looking for a host for they have no body where as a fallen angel still has everything God made and gave them. Their bodies are far superior to mans. What we do know is we will judge those angles. Forgiven? No that is only for man. Since man was deceived they were not.
I don't see God allowing this. Well we know OT NT Satan is the god of this world. Christ said "if this was my kingdom my servants would not allow you to take me". Like it or not those fallen angels had rights here
I don't see God allowing this. Well we know OT NT Satan is the god of this world. Christ said "if this was my kingdom my servants would not allow you to take me". Like it or not those fallen angels had rights here
J
When I was 15, my friend and I encountered a human-shaped being that appeared to be made out of light energy. We encountered it while taking a 15-minute walk. We arrived at our destination an hour later than we should've. Neither one of us had any memory of the missing hour.
One night 2 1/2 years later, I saw this being again from across the schoolyard. I ran home. I think it was what Enoch would've called a lucifer, a fallen angel.
One night when I was 17, I woke to find a strange-looking being at the end of my bed. I was paralyzed and terrified. I couldn't form a thought. Then the name Jesus dropped into my head and the being, light, paralysis, and fear were instantly gone. I think it was some kind of Nephilim.
In the past 8 years, I've seen UFOs 3 times, including last summer when I was with 4 other people. Lots of people see these things.
"For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this world’s darkness, and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms." - Ephesians 6:12 BSB
One night 2 1/2 years later, I saw this being again from across the schoolyard. I ran home. I think it was what Enoch would've called a lucifer, a fallen angel.
One night when I was 17, I woke to find a strange-looking being at the end of my bed. I was paralyzed and terrified. I couldn't form a thought. Then the name Jesus dropped into my head and the being, light, paralysis, and fear were instantly gone. I think it was some kind of Nephilim.
In the past 8 years, I've seen UFOs 3 times, including last summer when I was with 4 other people. Lots of people see these things.
"For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this world’s darkness, and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms." - Ephesians 6:12 BSB
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Ok, I gave you several chances to confess your mistaken assumption, but now I'm done beating around the bush.
No. You have not given me "crystal clear Scripture" to substantiate your claim.
You gave me the addresses (Daniel 10:10-21, Eph 6:10-13, 1 Peter 5:8), and told me these passages say what you're claiming.
But they do not say what you are claiming. The reason you won't quote from them is that they don't say what you claim they say.
Since you won't quote the Scripture you cited, I will:
None of these passages says they are fallen angels.
I find your claim lacking Biblical support.
No. You have not given me "crystal clear Scripture" to substantiate your claim.
You gave me the addresses (Daniel 10:10-21, Eph 6:10-13, 1 Peter 5:8), and told me these passages say what you're claiming.
But they do not say what you are claiming. The reason you won't quote from them is that they don't say what you claim they say.
Since you won't quote the Scripture you cited, I will:
“Then behold, a hand touched me and set me trembling on my hands and knees. He said to me, “O Daniel, man of high esteem, understand the words that I am about to tell you and stand upright, for I have now been sent to you.” And when he had spoken this word to me, I stood up trembling. Then he said to me, “Do not be afraid, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart on understanding this and on humbling yourself before your God, your words were heard, and I have come in response to your words. “But the prince of the kingdom of Persia was withstanding me for twenty-one days; then behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left there with the kings of Persia. “Now I have come to give you an understanding of what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision pertains to the days yet future.” When he had spoken to me according to these words, I turned my face toward the ground and became speechless. And behold, one who resembled a human being was touching my lips; then I opened my mouth and spoke and said to him who was standing before me, “O my lord, as a result of the vision anguish has come upon me, and I have retained no strength. “For how can such a servant of my lord talk with such as my lord? As for me, there remains just now no strength in me, nor has any breath been left in me.” Then this one with human appearance touched me again and strengthened me. He said, “O man of high esteem, do not be afraid. Peace be with you; take courage and be courageous!” Now as soon as he spoke to me, I received strength and said, “May my lord speak, for you have strengthened me.” Then he said, “Do you understand why I came to you? But I shall now return to fight against the prince of Persia; so I am going forth, and behold, the prince of Greece is about to come. “However, I will tell you what is inscribed in the writing of truth. Yet there is no one who stands firmly with me against these forces except Michael your prince.” (Daniel 10:10–21)
“Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might. Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm.” (Ephesians 6:10–13)
“Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.” (1 Peter 5:8)
“Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might. Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm.” (Ephesians 6:10–13)
“Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.” (1 Peter 5:8)
None of these passages says they are fallen angels.
I find your claim lacking Biblical support.
"preach the gospel to every creature"
Romans 8
19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God.
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time.
(I'm not making a case for nephilim salvation with this. I just think it ties in with what Jesus said)
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The creatures that are waiting for the Return of their Creator are the ones that the LORD created and said "it was good".
"Then God said, “Let the waters abound with an abundance of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the face of the firmament of the heavens.” So God created great sea creatures and every living thing that moves, with which the waters abounded, according to their kind, and every winged bird according to its kind.
And God saw that it was good."
Nephilim and the abominations of gene splicing that the fallen angels produced do not qualify under "Good" from the LORD.
"That which has been is what will be,
That which is done is what will be done,
And there is nothing new under the sun."
Eccliesiastes 1:9
The abominations have returned and more is to come - unfortunately.
"Then God said, “Let the waters abound with an abundance of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the face of the firmament of the heavens.” So God created great sea creatures and every living thing that moves, with which the waters abounded, according to their kind, and every winged bird according to its kind.
And God saw that it was good."
Nephilim and the abominations of gene splicing that the fallen angels produced do not qualify under "Good" from the LORD.
"That which has been is what will be,
That which is done is what will be done,
And there is nothing new under the sun."
Eccliesiastes 1:9
The abominations have returned and more is to come - unfortunately.
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Thank you for posting the scriptures that clearly show fallen angels in battle against angels that serve the LORD.
You left out these scriptures that verify angelic warfare between Angels of Glory and fallen angels:
Then he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the Angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to oppose him. And the Lord said to Satan, “The Lord rebuke you, Satan! The Lord who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Is this not a brand plucked from the fire? - Zecharia 3:1-2
Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.
Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” But these speak evil of whatever they do not know;
Jude ch1
Then a war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. But the dragon was not strong enough, and no longer was any place found in heaven for him and his angels. And the great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Revelation ch12
For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; 5and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly; 6and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8(for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)— 9then the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment, 10and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of [c]dignitaries, 11whereas angels, who are greater in power and might, do not bring a reviling accusation against them before the Lord.
2 Peter ch2
You left out these scriptures that verify angelic warfare between Angels of Glory and fallen angels:
Then he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the Angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to oppose him. And the Lord said to Satan, “The Lord rebuke you, Satan! The Lord who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Is this not a brand plucked from the fire? - Zecharia 3:1-2
Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.
Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” But these speak evil of whatever they do not know;
Jude ch1
Then a war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. But the dragon was not strong enough, and no longer was any place found in heaven for him and his angels. And the great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Revelation ch12
For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; 5and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly; 6and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8(for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)— 9then the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment, 10and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of [c]dignitaries, 11whereas angels, who are greater in power and might, do not bring a reviling accusation against them before the Lord.
2 Peter ch2
I don't deny the existence of fallen angels.
I don't deny that they fight against angels of glory.
I don't deny their clear involvement in Zech 3, Jude, and Rev 12
But these aren't the passages you brought up in post# 198.
You said there were fallen angels in Daniel 10, Ephesians 6, and 1 Peter 5.
My question is: "How do you know those are "fallen angels" in those passages?"
It's not clear. That's why I'm asking you to show me how you know they are fallen angels.
I don't deny that they fight against angels of glory.
I don't deny their clear involvement in Zech 3, Jude, and Rev 12
But these aren't the passages you brought up in post# 198.
You said there were fallen angels in Daniel 10, Ephesians 6, and 1 Peter 5.
My question is: "How do you know those are "fallen angels" in those passages?"
It's not clear. That's why I'm asking you to show me how you know they are fallen angels.
Good Morning
To everyone who understands the scriptures from Genesis to Revelation = clear from the passage and supporting scripture.
The pertinent question is = What is conflicting in your thoughts about this passage?
You have not shown a single scripture to say other then 'fallen angels vs Glory angels'.
To everyone who understands the scriptures from Genesis to Revelation = clear from the passage and supporting scripture.
The pertinent question is = What is conflicting in your thoughts about this passage?
You have not shown a single scripture to say other then 'fallen angels vs Glory angels'.
Quote Scripture rather than saying it's obvious. Someone else could make the opposite claim, and neither of you would have a leg to stand on.
I already told you that I would share my understanding after you substantiate your claim. I made it clear that I'm investigating what you claimed. My understanding has nothing to do with your claim. You claimed something, and I asked, "how do you know that?". That's what's going on here.
I don't have to; that's not how the burden of proof works. If you make a claim and are challenged, you are the one who has to substantiate your claim. If I had made a claim, then I would also be obligated, but I haven't made a claim about who the beings are. I see no evidence for your claim, so it seems to just be an assumption.
Are your words in post# 198 just your opinion or does Scripture say they are "fallen angels"?
I already told you that I would share my understanding after you substantiate your claim. I made it clear that I'm investigating what you claimed. My understanding has nothing to do with your claim. You claimed something, and I asked, "how do you know that?". That's what's going on here.
I don't have to; that's not how the burden of proof works. If you make a claim and are challenged, you are the one who has to substantiate your claim. If I had made a claim, then I would also be obligated, but I haven't made a claim about who the beings are. I see no evidence for your claim, so it seems to just be an assumption.
Are your words in post# 198 just your opinion or does Scripture say they are "fallen angels"?