Research: Majority of Americans Believe Works Are the Key to Salvation

[Jackson123]

Seem to me endurance need all the time not only during gt
2 Tim 4:7
I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith.
Hebrews 10:36 ESV / 136 helpful votes
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.

In Tim Paul that die before gt also talking about keeping the faith or endure to the finish

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Did I say Jesus didn't teach Grace? No....
But if you can...show me where, you believe, Jesus taught Grace. LOL...And I really don't need any help from you.

Lol
good Day sir, you don’t need help,from me. You need help from above.

in the mean time I am done playing games

 

[Goliath]

Yep, there you go again attacking the man instead of his doctrine, because you and the rest of the OSAS don't have any theological ground to stand on

Thanks brother, I believe he meant well. He just got in over his head. And that's all many folks have to defend their position.

 

[Goliath]

Do you believe He taught it in principle?

Oh..absolutely!!
And you probably share my problem, with how Grace is taught in the Christian community. Many denominations can tell you what Grace is...but they can not tell the believers....how Grace is obtained.
Jesus taught how we receive Grace in (John 14:21)...and Paul in (Romans 2:5-7). But false teachings, teachings from generation to generation, have cast these teachings aside. These teachings which attempt to make the word of God conform to the image of man...and not to the image of Christ.

The word they use is....."Works", the word which is feared by those who follow the False Doctrines. When Jesus and Paul both teach that we receive Grace...through our "Works"....through our obedience to the Lord Jesus. This is why many believers become unBelievers....they don't understand Grace and How wonderful life can be....if they only had Grace.

Ahh..but are we talking about the Ten Commandments?
Yes and No...as it pertains to the confusion caused by the word, Works.
Why?????
The Ten Commandments do not require us to do anything...so how can they be called.... Works??
Paul is not teaching against the Ten Commandments.....he is teaching against the Works of the Law of Moses. That part of the Law of Moses which required, Works!! The, do this, part of the Law, not the, don't do that, part of the Ten Commandments......not that keeping those Laws aren't part of receiving God Grace. Look at this passage...at something most people miss...knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
(Galatians 2:16)
As I hope this illustrates Paul is talking about the...Works...of the Law of Moses.
Now Jesus also has Laws which require "Works". Only these works are done out of Love. Jesus commands us to feed those who are hungry...cloth those who are cold...house those who need shelter. These Laws require us to do something, and since they are done out of Love....This is what makes them...Good Works!!
Spent more time on this than I meant to. Gotta go brother. God bless you!!

 

[Goliath]

Lol
good Day sir, you don’t need help,from me. You need help from above.

in the mean time I am done playing games

Well that's good of you, because for me, ones salvation is not a game.

 

[Jackson123]

Oh..absolutely!!
And you probably share my problem, with how Grace is taught in the Christian community. Many denominations can tell you what Grace is...but they can not tell the believers....how Grace is obtained.
Jesus taught how we receive Grace in (John 14:21)...and Paul in (Romans 2:5-7). But false teachings, teachings from generation to generation, have cast these teachings aside. These teachings which attempt to make the word of God conform to the image of man...and not to the image of Christ.

The word they use is....."Works", the word which is feared by those who follow the False Doctrines. When Jesus and Paul both teach that we receive Grace...through our "Works"....through our obedience to the Lord Jesus. This is why many believers become unBelievers....they don't understand Grace and How wonderful life can be....if they only had Grace.

Ahh..but are we talking about the Ten Commandments?
Yes and No...as it pertains to the confusion caused by the word, Works.
Why?????
The Ten Commandments do not require us to do anything...so how can they be called.... Works??
Paul is not teaching against the Ten Commandments.....he is teaching against the Works of the Law of Moses. That part of the Law of Moses which required, Works!! The, do this, part of the Law, not the, don't do that, part of the Ten Commandments......not that keeping those Laws aren't part of receiving God Grace. Look at this passage...at something most people miss...knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
(Galatians 2:16)
As I hope this illustrates Paul is talking about the...Works...of the Law of Moses.
Now Jesus also has Laws which require "Works". Only these works are done out of Love. Jesus commands us to feed those who are hungry...cloth those who are cold...house those who need shelter. These Laws require us to do something, and since they are done out of Love....This is what makes them...Good Works!!
Spent more time on this than I meant to. Gotta go brother. God bless you!!

Yep
Noah believe than work thousand hour to build an ark and receive the grace of salvation from the flood

 

[Goliath]

Yep
Noah believe than work thousand hour to build an ark and receive the grace of salvation from the flood

Notice the difference between the sheep and the goats....those who keep the Law of Christ...those who didn't. Again..for those who are watching...again...two different types of followers. Those who keep the commands of Christ and those who don't.
And before Him shall be gathered all nations, and He shall separate them one from another as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats. And He shall set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. Then shall the King say unto them on His right hand, ‘Come, ye blessed of My Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I hungered, and ye gave Me meat; I was thirsty, and ye gave Me drink; I was a stranger, and ye took Me in; naked, and ye clothed Me; I was sick, and ye visited Me; I was in prison, and ye came unto Me.’ Then shall the righteous answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when saw we Thee hungering and fed Thee, or thirsty and gave Thee drink? When saw we Thee a stranger and took Thee in, or naked and clothed Thee? Or when saw we Thee sick, or in prison, and came unto Thee?’ And the King shall answer and say unto them, ‘Verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me.’ “Then shall He say also unto them on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I hungered, and ye gave Me no meat; I was thirsty, and ye gave Me no drink; I was a stranger, and ye took Me not in; naked, and ye clothed Me not; sick and in prison, and ye visited Me not.’ Then shall they also answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when saw we Thee hungering or athirst or a stranger, or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister unto Thee?’ Then shall He answer them, saying, ‘Verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to Me.’ And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal.”
(Matthew 25:32-46)

Something to think about folks...just something to think about.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Seem to me you believe as long as we once believe than deny the next day you are save, I am not share this believe

Please allow me to make this perfectly clear to you.

I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, they POSSESS eternal life. John 5:24 says this.
I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, the recipient SHALL NEVER perish. John 10:28 says this.

Why don't you believe the Bible and what Jesus says?

You believe in 7 years people must endure but now we don't need to endure

You are very confused. The verse about enduring to the end isn't even about salvation. If you lack spiritual discernment, you will not be able to understand any of this.

that Jesus say the endure requirement only during 7 years tribulation?

Not for salvation. That is the point.

If Jesus meant that "enduring to the end of your life for salvation", then He is the confused One. Because John 5:24 and 10:28 are His words, not mine.

But Jesus was and is NOT confused! YOU are. Very confused. I give you straight up biblical truth and you reject it. Or don't understand it.

1 John 5:19 - We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.
Rev 12:9 - The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

The devil has taken many believers down the path of deception. One of which is the nutty idea that God's salvation can be lost.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Seem to me endurance need all the time not only during gt
2 Tim 4:7
I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith.
Hebrews 10:36 ESV / 136 helpful votes
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.

In Tim Paul that die before gt also talking about keeping the faith or endure to the finish

In 1 Cor 9:27 Paul taught that enduring results in blessings and eternal reward.

No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.

Heaven is no "prize". It is a gift. There is a big difference.

Eternal reward means blessings OVEER AND ABOVE just entering heaven. All believers will enter heaven. Only the faithful and obedient believers will be rewarded in heaven.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Yep
Noah believe than work thousand hour to build an ark and receive the grace of salvation from the flood

Do you actually believe that Noah received soul salvation by working those 1,000 hours to build an ark???

No, that is confusion. Noah built an ark to be delivered, rescued, saved from DROWNING from the flood.

Those without discernment to figure out what is meant by "saved" in the various verses will not understand them.

 

[TMS]

All have sinned
And sin = death.
We are all in need of salvation.
Salvation from sin.
Sin = the transgression of the law.

We need to be 100% sinless when judged. One sin will cause us to be guilty and justice will result in eternal death.
Praise God for Jesus.
Our saviour will stand in our place.
We can not work our way to heaven or earn it by works.
Only Jesus can pay our debt.

Will Jesus save everyone?
Will everyone be saved?

No ..the bible is clear that some are saved and some are not saved.
Jesus wants to save all and grace is given to all.

Judgement will come to all, and depending on what we do with the grace we are given each day, will determine our case.

Jesus will say "well done, debt is fully paid" or "i never knew you".

Justice and mercy meet at the cross.

Knowing Jesus is the key.
Of you love me keep my commandments. He said to obey because you love Him.

 

[TMS]

Mat 7:13
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Few are saved.

 

[Phoneman-777]

endure in what?

The saint must endure the devil's fiery darts of temptation which attempt to turn him back to a life of sin and iniquity which kills his agape love for God and his neighbor cold and dead leaving the saint unable to endure any longer and lost --- in contrast to the saint in verse 13 who by Christ's power endures to the end and winds up saved.

We know the "many" whose agape love turns cold and dead are in fact saints, not the wicked as our confused friend Posthuman claims, because God's agape love is demonstrated only by happily keeping God's commandments (1 John 5:2-3 KJV) but the wicked can't keep God's commandments even if they wanted to (Romans 8:7 KJV).

 

[Phoneman-777]

Thanks brother, I believe he meant well. He just got in over his head. And that's all many folks have to defend their position.

Can't understand why people don't abandon a doctrine when it's proven false to them. I had to when I found out "Sunday sacredness" is unBiblical and had to change to keeping the Sabbath.

OSAS stands irrefutably disproven by Matthew 24:12-13 KJV because the "many" whose agape love ends up cold and dead, leaving them lost are SAINTS, NOT THE WICKED, as proven by the fact that agape love is demonstrated only by happily keeping God's commandments (1 John 5:3 KJV), but the wicked can't keep them even if they wanted to (Romans 8:7 KJV).

Now, instead of being honest and admit they've been Satanically blinded and appreciate that God in His mercy has sent them the light of truth and asking the Conditional Salvation crowd "what must I do to be saved?" and hear the answer "Choose this day whom you will serve", they will stubbornly and simultaneously cling to a Christ of their own devising and their sin.

 

[Phoneman-777]

Oh..absolutely!!
And you probably share my problem, with how Grace is taught in the Christian community. Many denominations can tell you what Grace is...but they can not tell the believers....how Grace is obtained.
Jesus taught how we receive Grace in (John 14:21)...and Paul in (Romans 2:5-7). But false teachings, teachings from generation to generation, have cast these teachings aside. These teachings which attempt to make the word of God conform to the image of man...and not to the image of Christ.

The word they use is....."Works", the word which is feared by those who follow the False Doctrines. When Jesus and Paul both teach that we receive Grace...through our "Works"....through our obedience to the Lord Jesus. This is why many believers become unBelievers....they don't understand Grace and How wonderful life can be....if they only had Grace.

Ahh..but are we talking about the Ten Commandments?
Yes and No...as it pertains to the confusion caused by the word, Works.
Why?????
The Ten Commandments do not require us to do anything...so how can they be called.... Works??
Paul is not teaching against the Ten Commandments.....he is teaching against the Works of the Law of Moses. That part of the Law of Moses which required, Works!! The, do this, part of the Law, not the, don't do that, part of the Ten Commandments......not that keeping those Laws aren't part of receiving God Grace. Look at this passage...at something most people miss...knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
(Galatians 2:16)
As I hope this illustrates Paul is talking about the...Works...of the Law of Moses.
Now Jesus also has Laws which require "Works". Only these works are done out of Love. Jesus commands us to feed those who are hungry...cloth those who are cold...house those who need shelter. These Laws require us to do something, and since they are done out of Love....This is what makes them...Good Works!!
Spent more time on this than I meant to. Gotta go brother. God bless you!!

Brother, the OSAS crowd thinks if obedience is anything other than optional, it's a contemptible means to salvation, when what they need to understand is that works are mandatory but the performance of them is guaranteed by the indwelling power of Jesus. When temptation come, we simply pray "not my will, but Thine" and Jesus takes over from there. The OSAS crowd fights against this for either one of two reasons:

1) the lie that "nobody can keep the law" is so ingrained that when confronted with Biblical evidence that victory over every deliberate, habitual, known, presumptuous sin is guaranteed by the indwelling power of Jesus they become paralyzed with fear - like a crying child standing poolside too afraid to jump into his father's arms, or....

2) their love of sin makes the will of God take a backseat to the desires of the flesh, but hellfire makes them too cowardly to pull over and just let Him out the car

 

[Goliath]

Can't understand why people don't abandon a doctrine when it's proven false to them.
.

Satan...the great deceiver..... and many followers simply underestimate his ability to deceive them.
Take the Bible, you would have thought the printing of the Bible would have united us. But no, Satan has used it, the word of God, to divide us. That, all by itself, proves his ability to deceive. This is why I steer the followers back to the Holy Spirit...back to where they began. Thank God, I have had some success doing this very thing with a few folks on this site. Jesus gave the very same advice in ......
Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent and do the works as at first; or else I will come unto thee quickly and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, unless thou repent.
(Revelation 2:5)

 

[Goliath]

The OSAS crowd fights against this for either one of two reasons:

1) the lie that "nobody can keep the law" is so ingrained that when confronted with Biblical evidence that victory over every deliberate, habitual, known, presumptuous sin is guaranteed by the indwelling power of Jesus they become paralyzed with fear - like a crying child standing poolside too afraid to jump into his father's arms, or....

2) their love of sin makes the will of God take a backseat to the desires of the flesh, but hellfire makes them too cowardly to pull over and just let Him out the car

Well unless you can turn a well respected teacher, a teacher of the caliber of one like Billy Graham, it's impossible for us to change their minds. Look what Jesus had to do to convince Paul.
Gods Holy Spirit is the only way to change their minds...but in order for him to do this, they need to put their trust him. Like the song says. "Trust and obey...there is no other way..To be happy in Jesus...But to trust and Obey.

 

[Jackson123]

Please allow me to make this perfectly clear to you.

I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, they POSSESS eternal life. John 5:24 says this.
I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, the recipient SHALL NEVER perish. John 10:28 says this.

Why don't you believe the Bible and what Jesus says?


You are very confused. The verse about enduring to the end isn't even about salvation. If you lack spiritual discernment, you will not be able to understand any of this.


Not for salvation. That is the point.

If Jesus meant that "enduring to the end of your life for salvation", then He is the confused One. Because John 5:24 and 10:28 are His words, not mine.

But Jesus was and is NOT confused! YOU are. Very confused. I give you straight up biblical truth and you reject it. Or don't understand it.

1 John 5:19 - We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.
Rev 12:9 - The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

The devil has taken many believers down the path of deception. One of which is the nutty idea that God's salvation can be lost.

To make it simple let me ask you a question
When you accept Jesus, what happen, chose what you believe
1. Jesus dwell in you
2. Jesus can dwell in you or not it doesn't matter you still save

 

[Jackson123]

Please allow me to make this perfectly clear to you.

I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, they POSSESS eternal life. John 5:24 says this.
I believe that WHEN Jesus gives the gift of eternal life, the recipient SHALL NEVER perish. John 10:28 says this.

Why don't you believe the Bible and what Jesus says?


You are very confused. The verse about enduring to the end isn't even about salvation. If you lack spiritual discernment, you will not be able to understand any of this.


Not for salvation. That is the point.

If Jesus meant that "enduring to the end of your life for salvation", then He is the confused One. Because John 5:24 and 10:28 are His words, not mine.

But Jesus was and is NOT confused! YOU are. Very confused. I give you straight up biblical truth and you reject it. Or don't understand it.

1 John 5:19 - We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.
Rev 12:9 - The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

The devil has taken many believers down the path of deception. One of which is the nutty idea that God's salvation can be lost.

Matt 24:13
13 But he that shall aendure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

I do believe what Jesus say But ......endure to the end .....shall be save

The word save mean salvation and you change the Word to reward

I will respon more after church

 

[XavierJesusLovesIndia]

The list of Bible Verses showing that Perseverance after Justification is necessary for Eternal Salvation is practically endless. Great subject for a Bible Study, though. At least more of us will read the Bible for this reason. But we should read asking God to show us Truth.

Rom 2:

"4 Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?

5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism."

God Bless.