What does "the coming of the Lord" in the NT refer to?
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Jerusalem would be given to the gentiles until the fullness of their time, 70AD was just a start. Jesus didn’t jump straight to the day of the lord, because the disciples explicitly asked when will “not one stone left upon another” happen. There could be a double fulfillment, of course, but that doesn’t leave 70 AD out of the picture.
Coming of the Holy Spirit on the Pentecost was the indwelling (Acts 2:2-4), giving testimony of Jesus was the filling (Acts 4:8). In the Bible both 2:4 and 4:8 say “filling”, but obviously 2:4 was the initiation and the fulfillment of the Promised Helper (John 16:7). If you ask how that works from your perspective, nobody can answer that for you but yourself. Again, go figure.
FreeGrace2 said:
Can you explain the difference between the indwelling and fllling of the Spirit, and HOW TO be filled, since being filled is a command from the Lord?
I know how the Spirit works. That wasn't my question. Do you know the difference between the indwelling and filling?
And, do you know HOW to be filled with the Spirit?
This isn't the difference at all. The day of Pentecost was the FIRST time the indwelling Holy Spirit was given to saved people. Since then, believers receive the Holy Spirit WHEN they believe, per Eph 1:13. That's indwelling.
Of course I didn't ask about "my perspective". I asked about YOUR perspective.
Apparently you cannot explain HOW to obey the command to be filled with the Spirit. And you still haven't explained what the filling of the Spirit even is.
Don't feel too bad, though. You are in the VAST majority of evangelicals today.
Can you explain the difference between the indwelling and fllling of the Spirit, and HOW TO be filled, since being filled is a command from the Lord?
I know how the Spirit works. That wasn't my question. Do you know the difference between the indwelling and filling?
And, do you know HOW to be filled with the Spirit?
This isn't the difference at all. The day of Pentecost was the FIRST time the indwelling Holy Spirit was given to saved people. Since then, believers receive the Holy Spirit WHEN they believe, per Eph 1:13. That's indwelling.
Of course I didn't ask about "my perspective". I asked about YOUR perspective.
Apparently you cannot explain HOW to obey the command to be filled with the Spirit. And you still haven't explained what the filling of the Spirit even is.
Don't feel too bad, though. You are in the VAST majority of evangelicals today.
No you didn't. Your claim doesn't explain HOW you obey the command. It's just a claim, but no explanation of HOW.
And your examples of disciples are no different; just stating that they were filled. No explanation of HOW they were.
You can't even explain how you are filled. Are you filled all the time?
Why would you think I have a problem with that specific term? I am the one who brought up that specific term in the first place.
Are you just trying to change the subject, because you can't explain the HOW?
There IS a specific way to obey the command. If you are curious, let me know and I'll explain it. In the meantime, you might want to give a whole lot of thought about what it means to be filled with the Spirit, HOW to obey that command, and what grieving and quenching the Spirit means.
And your examples of disciples are no different; just stating that they were filled. No explanation of HOW they were.
You can't even explain how you are filled. Are you filled all the time?
Why would you think I have a problem with that specific term? I am the one who brought up that specific term in the first place.
Are you just trying to change the subject, because you can't explain the HOW?
There IS a specific way to obey the command. If you are curious, let me know and I'll explain it. In the meantime, you might want to give a whole lot of thought about what it means to be filled with the Spirit, HOW to obey that command, and what grieving and quenching the Spirit means.
"How" is the new birth. As the Holy Spirit comes and goes at will, that's not up for you and me to know, only God is in control of dispensing His Spirit. If anybody gets to know "how", then it will surely be abused, like what Simon the Sorcerer attempted to do. "The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Holy Spirit." That's the explanation from the Lord himself, go figure.
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At that time is not before the tribulation.
The great tribulation begins when my countries armed forces place the abomination of desolation in jerusalem.
It is at that time Daniels people are delivered, everyone found written including those who sleep in the dust. Those who have done good and those who have done bad. Daniel does not state there is 1000 years between those who have done good and those who have done bad. That's just you attempting to rewrite what he said.
Your problem is you have no clue who is resurrected during the resurection of Israel.
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The Gentiles have not arrived in Jerusalem yet. After they do they will occupy Jerusalem for 42 months. Then the beast attacks Jerusalem and kills my countries armed forces stationed there.
Things turn ugly quickly after that.
https://biblehub.com/revelation/11-2.htm
Things turn ugly quickly after that.
https://biblehub.com/revelation/11-2.htm
You know, if the "abomination of desolation" must be tied to the desecration of the "temple", then the meaning of it depends on your interpretation of "temple". Many believe that there will be a third temple built in modern day Israel and the Antichrist is gonna exalt himself as god in there, but based on the symbolic definition given in John 2:21 and 1 Cor 6:19, I'd say that "abomination of desolation" is referring to transhumanism, they're gonna mess with our genome, that' how the "image of the Beast" is made.
Jerusalem has never been fully controlled by Israel since 70 AD, that's a historic fact. You still got the Palestinians in the eastern side.
Jerusalem has never been fully controlled by Israel since 70 AD, that's a historic fact. You still got the Palestinians in the eastern side.
Well, it is. v.1 makes that very clear.
Maybe you have the problem with resurrection. The Bible teaches that there is just ONE resurrection of ALL believers, and that is "when He comes" which is the Second Advent.
1 Cor 15:23 -
But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
Purple words show that Jesus was the FIRST human to receive a glorified body.
Red words refer to the Second Advent.
Blue words refer to EVERY saved person from Adam on.
If you disagree, please prove my error by properly exegeting this verse.
Maybe you have the problem with resurrection. The Bible teaches that there is just ONE resurrection of ALL believers, and that is "when He comes" which is the Second Advent.
1 Cor 15:23 -
But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
Purple words show that Jesus was the FIRST human to receive a glorified body.
Red words refer to the Second Advent.
Blue words refer to EVERY saved person from Adam on.
If you disagree, please prove my error by properly exegeting this verse.
FreeGrace2 said:
No you didn't. Your claim doesn't explain HOW you obey the command. It's just a claim, but no explanation of HOW.
And your examples of disciples are no different; just stating that they were filled. No explanation of HOW they were.
You can't even explain how you are filled. Are you filled all the time?
This is your answer to HOW to obey the command to be filled with the Spirit???? Really now. That so.
So, you confuse the indwelling with filling. The new birth is WHEN the believer is indwelt with the Spirit. Being filled is a command that the believer must obey, and the new birth isn't the means of it.
So, basically, you believe that a person obeys a command by being born again. But, the Bible is clear that man doesn't choose the new birth. John 1:13. So you have a problem with your theology. A very big one.
More error here. When the Holy Spirit is given to a believer, it is a PERMANENT sealing.
Eph 1:13 - And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,
He wasn't even involved in the filling of the Holy Spirit. He was interested in the indwelling of the Spirit, which you are confused about.
You are just very confused.
When you decide to learn HOW to be filled with the Spirit, a command for EVERY believer to obey, let me know.
Until then, just know that your ignorance of HOW to be filled with the Spirit means you CAN'T BE filled with the Spirit.
Along with the majority of believers today. So very sad.
No you didn't. Your claim doesn't explain HOW you obey the command. It's just a claim, but no explanation of HOW.
And your examples of disciples are no different; just stating that they were filled. No explanation of HOW they were.
You can't even explain how you are filled. Are you filled all the time?
This is your answer to HOW to obey the command to be filled with the Spirit???? Really now. That so.
So, you confuse the indwelling with filling. The new birth is WHEN the believer is indwelt with the Spirit. Being filled is a command that the believer must obey, and the new birth isn't the means of it.
So, basically, you believe that a person obeys a command by being born again. But, the Bible is clear that man doesn't choose the new birth. John 1:13. So you have a problem with your theology. A very big one.
More error here. When the Holy Spirit is given to a believer, it is a PERMANENT sealing.
Eph 1:13 - And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,
He wasn't even involved in the filling of the Holy Spirit. He was interested in the indwelling of the Spirit, which you are confused about.
You are just very confused.
When you decide to learn HOW to be filled with the Spirit, a command for EVERY believer to obey, let me know.
Until then, just know that your ignorance of HOW to be filled with the Spirit means you CAN'T BE filled with the Spirit.
Along with the majority of believers today. So very sad.
You're the one who's arrogant and condescending. You don't know what Jesus was teaching in his conversation with Nicodemus. The whole point of this "birth" analogy is that you have NO contribution to your physical birth and NO control over it, physical life is given to you by your parents, and so is the Holy Spirit that is GIVEN. I've never said that anybody can "choose" to be born again by receiving the Holy Spirit through his own effort, nor have I ever suggested that the Holy Spirit can ever "depart" from a believer, that's not what "come and go" means in John 3:7-8. Rather, it comes and goes to where God wants you to be, and if you obey, you follow its lead.
FreeGrace2 said:
When you decide to learn HOW to be filled with the Spirit, a command for EVERY believer to obey, let me know.
The command to be filled is in 5:18. The question for the other poster was HOW to obey the command.
But he was confused and thought the indwelling and filling are the same.
When you decide to learn HOW to be filled with the Spirit, a command for EVERY believer to obey, let me know.
The command to be filled is in 5:18. The question for the other poster was HOW to obey the command.
But he was confused and thought the indwelling and filling are the same.
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Please quit being hypersensitive. I've shown neithere of these characteristics. It seems you just don't like when you are being proven wrong.
You don't know anything.
If you would have read my posts WITHOUT all that vitriol and angst and bias, you would have known that is exactly my point.
That is correct and I've never thought or said otherwise.
Your comment sure appeared to communicate that.
Can you explain HOW to be filled with the Spirit? Of course, that would require that you understand the difference between the indwelling and the filling. Are you there yet?
You don't know anything.
If you would have read my posts WITHOUT all that vitriol and angst and bias, you would have known that is exactly my point.
That is correct and I've never thought or said otherwise.
Your comment sure appeared to communicate that.
Can you explain HOW to be filled with the Spirit? Of course, that would require that you understand the difference between the indwelling and the filling. Are you there yet?