Where is God

[BeeThePeace]

By a human standard, yes.

I'm not Catholic.
So, it is by God's standards, that children are innocents. That's why when Herod ordered the slaughter of babies of a certain age hoping to kill Messiah of prophecy it is referred to as, the slaughter of the innocents.
Children , babies, are innocent. Which is why Jesus said unless we become like little children we shall not see the kingdom of God.

In many cases it is, but not in every case.

We can't state that with any certainty. What we know is God calls whom he will to his grace. And the names of those called into that were written in the Lamb's Book of Eternal Life.
All of John 3 is relevant.

We also cannot ignore what He tells us about us: We are ALL sinners.

Save for babies, children, and those who are saved from their sins and washed clean by the blood of Christ.

God is omnipresent. There's your biblically-consistent answer. Was there anything further?

When you equate God's omnipresence to being indifferent to homicide committed on innocent children ? No.
Biblically consistent? I guess you have a point don't you?
God slaughtered innocent first Borns in the old testament. Ordered the unborn to be ripped from the womb, drowned the world, burned to death all living in Sodom and Gomorrah save for one family who he deemed righteous even when the family patriarch offered his virgin daughters for gang rape to save angels from a sexually depraved crowd.

There's a lot else. Interestingly, God killed more people than did Satan, who Omniscience created. And then God sends those he didn't predestine for his grace to the Hell he first created to house Satan and his angels alone . But opened to receive condemned humans God elected not to save before the foundation of the world.

Anything else?

The problem of evil can be explained, but the acceptance of it cannot be imparted.

God is the evil and the good.
The darkness and the light. God is all things. Isaiah 45.

After all, you said his being present during this school massacre of adults and innocent childten was biically consistent. Isaiah 45 shows you are right. Nothing that exists is of anything other than the creator.
As you state below this sentence.

God is unlimited and sovereign.

Humans are very limited, and sinners. We can't see the whole picture. I trust that God is good, and that even this will be made right at the judgment. Whether you and others do is not up to me, though I hope you do the same.

Christians are the Saints of God. And sinners exist by God's will.

Getting your knickers in a twist with me over this is not going to do you any good. If you have an issue with God, take it up with Him.

You're confusing me with someone else. We've not debated this topic before.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Then the opposite is also true, it's a contradiction to imagine that Christians must concede to atheists, satanists, and Freemasons to teach their kids.

That's true. Which is why parochial school is that other option.

Meanwhile, being America is a free country, you have no control over the presence, existence, of those people living in America.

While Jesus told you the laws and the prophets hang on two great commands.
Love the Lord God with all your heart and mind. And, love your neighbor as yourself.

Those people may be your neighbors.

Now what?

You and Kayla may not like how America or the public school system works, being a melting pot, and diverse. But that's the way it is.

The world doesn't have to confirm to your ideal. When we have Jesus the world isn't part of us. God's holy spirit is.
Nothing threatens that. However, you all might consider this too.

Maybe the world is in a place you can't stand because God is testing us to see if we walk his talk.

Love your neighbor as yourself.

The second great command of God .

How are you two,you and Kaylagirl, doing in that regard in this world where God is sovereign and Satan is lord?

 

[Beckie]

AMENDMENT I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

AMENDMENT II

 

[Beckie]

There is no direct passage of Scripture that tells us all children/babies are saved as much as i wish to believe it is so. There just is not direct Scripture .

Psa_58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

 

[ZNP]

That's true. Which is why parochial school is that other option.

Meanwhile, being America is a free country, you have no control over the presence, existence, of those people living in America.

While Jesus told you the laws and the prophets hang on two great commands.
Love the Lord God with all your heart and mind. And, love your neighbor as yourself.

Those people may be your neighbors.

Now what?

You and Kayla may not like how America or the public school system works, being a melting pot, and diverse. But that's the way it is.

The world doesn't have to confirm to your ideal. When we have Jesus the world isn't part of us. God's holy spirit is.
Nothing threatens that. However, you all might consider this too.

Maybe the world is in a place you can't stand because God is testing us to see if we walk his talk.

Love your neighbor as yourself.

The second great command of God .

How are you two,you and Kaylagirl, doing in that regard in this world where God is sovereign and Satan is lord?

No, letting atheists, and Satanists and FreeMasons teach my children is not being obedient to the Lord's command to love your neighbor as yourself. What a twisted world you must live in.

If you would not hire the person to be a nanny to your baby then there is no reason you should allow them to teach your kindergartner or first grader, etc.

You are not violating the Lord's command to love your neighbor as yourself if you do not want a man dressed as a woman running story hour and pushing their LGBTQ agenda on your 6 year old.

Private school in this country is more expensive than public school. Everyone pays for public school whether or not you use it. That is a monopoly and it must stop. Yes, "those people are my neighbors" that doesn't mean I must pay them to teach my children nor does it mean that I must pay them even if they don't teach my children.

We have laws where the money the state spends on education per kid follows the kid. So if I want to go to a private school that same $14,000 on average will go to that private school. So then 10 kids going to a little school set up by a church would get $140,000 from the state (on average). You get two retired teachers and one person from the church staff to run this school. The parents also assist. Yes the kids are different ages and will require different lessons but you have computer programs that can teach a number of subjects, you have books on tape that kids can read along to and you have church programs like Choir and Karate that can be used to enhance the program.

If your state does not permit you to let the money follow the kid, then become politically active or move to a state that does.

The relevant Biblical command here is for Parents to teach their children. Parents are responsible for their kids education, not the state.

 

[BeeThePeace]

AMENDMENT I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

AMENDMENT II

Well done. The Establishment clause and attendant language often leads to the reference, Separation Clause. The separation of church and state.
https://www.mtsu.edu/first-amendment/article/885/establishment-clause-separation-of-church-and-state

Which is why no one religion is afforded primacy in our secular government ,laws,or American community as a whole

Look at Iran. That's an example of religion ruling a nation and a people.
Christianity would be no different. A history already exists that shows how bad it was when church and state were one.

Our founders insured that wasn't brought to this new world for a reason.

 

[kaylagrl]

There is no direct passage of Scripture that tells us all children/babies are saved as much as i wish to believe it is so. There just is not direct Scripture .

Psa_58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

No but their is an age of accountability. That's why evangelicals don't baptize babies, we christen them. When David lost his child he said he would go to be with him. Children who die before the age of accountability, or being able to understand salvation, right from wrong and consequences go to heaven. Those 19 children are in the arms of Jesus this day.

 

[BeeThePeace]

No, letting atheists, and Satanists and FreeMasons teach my children is not being obedient to the Lord's command to love your neighbor as yourself. What a twisted world you must live in.

If you would not hire the person to be a nanny to your baby then there is no reason you should allow them to teach your kindergartner or first grader, etc.

You are not violating the Lord's command to love your neighbor as yourself if you do not want a man dressed as a woman running story hour and pushing their LGBTQ agenda on your 6 year old.

Private school in this country is more expensive than public school. Everyone pays for public school whether or not you use it. That is a monopoly and it must stop. Yes, "those people are my neighbors" that doesn't mean I must pay them to teach my children nor does it mean that I must pay them even if they don't teach my children.

We have laws where the money the state spends on education per kid follows the kid. So if I want to go to a private school that same $14,000 on average will go to that private school. So then 10 kids going to a little school set up by a church would get $140,000 from the state (on average). You get two retired teachers and one person from the church staff to run this school. The parents also assist. Yes the kids are different ages and will require different lessons but you have computer programs that can teach a number of subjects, you have books on tape that kids can read along to and you have church programs like Choir and Karate that can be used to enhance the program.

If your state does not permit you to let the money follow the kid, then become politically active or move to a state that does.

The relevant Biblical command here is for Parents to teach their children. Parents are responsible for their kids education, not the state.

I didn't say you have to hire them as nanny's for your kids.

What you don't realize is, freemason's ,satanists,atheists, could be in your public school. You've no idea.

But when hate us part of your faith doctrine, that's obvious already.
Go ahead and abrogate Jesus' love command. What's he know?

I'll take my twisted world and Jesus word with it over yours all day long.

 

[ZNP]

I didn't say you have to hire them as nanny's for your kids.

What you don't realize is, freemason's ,satanists,atheists, could be in your public school. You've no idea.

But when hate us part of your faith doctrine, that's obvious already.
Go ahead and abrogate Jesus' love command. What's he know?

I'll take my twisted world and Jesus word with it over yours all day long.

Yes, that is the point, who is watching your kids? Even more to the point, who is teaching your kids, is it the parents?

When the DOJ wants to classify parents as domestic terrorists because they go to a school board meeting to complain about the curriculum then you have a real problem and these pathetic little platitudes of how loving your Satanist neighbor requires that you hate your own kids then you have gone off the deep end.

Parents were shut down from reading books in the library of their elementary school at these school board meetings because they were obscenely pornographic. Yet you think my objection to this is having "hate" in my doctrine? Yes, God hates sin. Anyone who tells you that we need to embrace sin and the flesh because God told us to love our neighbor is lying to you.

1Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

 

[BeeThePeace]

Yes, that is the point, who is watching your kids? Even more to the point, who is teaching your kids, is it the parents?

When the DOJ wants to classify parents as domestic terrorists because they go to a school board meeting to complain about the curriculum then you have a real problem and these pathetic little platitudes of how loving your Satanist neighbor requires that you hate your own kids then you have gone off the deep end.

Parents were shut down from reading books in the library of their elementary school at these school board meetings because they were obscenely pornographic. Yet you think my objection to this is having "hate" in my doctrine? Yes, God hates sin. Anyone who tells you that we need to embrace sin and the flesh because God told us to love our neighbor is lying to you.

1Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

Yeah, I have no idea what launched you into that screed but I'll just leave it alone. You should talk to somebody. Seriously.

 

[Dino246]

I'm not Catholic.

Neither am I, and I don't see the relevance.

So, it is by God's standards, that children are innocents. That's why when Herod ordered the slaughter of babies of a certain age hoping to kill Messiah of prophecy it is referred to as, the slaughter of the innocents.

Scripture doesn't call it that; commentators do.

Children , babies, are innocent. Which is why Jesus said unless we become like little children we shall not see the kingdom of God.

Respectfully, that is not what the Scripture says.

We can't state that with any certainty.

I can; I have observed it. You only need watch a few evangelistic outreaches at colleges to see it.

Save for babies, children, and those who are saved from their sins and washed clean by the blood of Christ.

Scripture says "All have sinned." Which part of that don't you understand? We aren't discussing whether God holds children accountable.

When you equate God's omnipresence to being indifferent to homicide committed on innocent children ? No.

"Indifferent" is your word, not mine.

Biblically consistent? I guess you have a point don't you?
God slaughtered innocent first Borns in the old testament. Ordered the unborn to be ripped from the womb, drowned the world, burned to death all living in Sodom and Gomorrah save for one family who he deemed righteous even when the family patriarch offered his virgin daughters for gang rape to save angels from a sexually depraved crowd.

Now you're being ridiculous, which indicates that you're operating from emotion rather than reason.

There's a lot else. Interestingly, God killed more people than did Satan, who Omniscience created. And then God sends those he didn't predestine for his grace to the Hell he first created to house Satan and his angels alone . But opened to receive condemned humans God elected not to save before the foundation of the world.

You're welcome to believe Calvinistic predestination; I don't.

You're confusing me with someone else. We've not debated this topic before.

I'm not confusing you with anyone else. You responded to my post in this thread. In turn, I have responded to you directly.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Neither am I, and I don't see the relevance.

You think infants and children are sinners so that doesn't surprise me.

Scripture doesn't call it that; commentators do.

A distinction without a difference.
There would be nothing to afford the comment had the slaughter of innocents not occurred.

God did the same thing well prior to Herod. When he sent his angel of death to kill the firstborn of every house in Egypt. Yet another plague upon Pharaoh so to make him let God's people go. When Pharaoh couldn't do that because God hardened Pharaoh's heart so he'd not comply with Moses-God's demand to let God's people go.

Respectfully, that is not what the Scripture says.

“Jesus invited a little child to stand among them. " I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven."

I can; I have observed it. You only need watch a few evangelistic outreaches at colleges to see it.

That's your opinion of what you witnessed. You've no idea what's in people's mind. And no one comes to Jesus unless the father draws them . Perhaps those you saw weren't led by God to God.
You don't know.

Scripture says "All have sinned." Which part of that don't you understand? We aren't discussing whether God holds children accountable.

Newborns don't sin. Innocent children don't sin when they have no knowledge of good or evil.

Deuteronomy 139
Joshua the son of Nun, who stands before you, he shall enter. Encourage him, for he shall cause Israel to inherit it. And as for your little ones, who you said would become a prey, and your children, who today have no knowledge of good or evil, they shall go in there. And to them I will give it, and they shall possess it. "
James 4:17So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

"Indifferent" is your word, not mine.

I put the word to your observation.

Now you're being ridiculous, which indicates that you're operating from emotion rather than reason.

Not at all. I compiled a list describing scripture that tells us ,per your observation of God being Omnipresent and Biblically consistent during the school massacre when innocents we're slaughtered before present God.

Please don't presume to criticize me as one responding from emotion thinking that invalidates an observation.I've read your posts.

You're welcome to believe Calvinistic predestination; I don't.

You're free to ignore scripture and label what it says as Calvinistic.
Predestination, foreordination, are scripture.

All prophetic scripture is evidence of God predetermining the future. That would include the Messiah prophecies in the OT.

I'm not confusing you with anyone else. You responded to my post in this thread. In turn, I have responded to you directly.

Telling me not to get my knickers in a twist is emotional, not rational .
And as I said, You've confused me with someone else. I replied to your post above and you for the first time in this thread.
If I addressed someone else who had replied to something you said, I'm speaking to them.

Your interjecting the knickers snark so to "respond to me directly" just to make that snarky comment tells me you spoil for conflict and controversy.

That's unfortunate for you.

 

[Beckie]

No but their is an age of accountability. That's why evangelicals don't baptize babies, we christen them. When David lost his child he said he would go to be with him. Children who die before the age of accountability, or being able to understand salvation, right from wrong and consequences go to heaven. Those 19 children are in the arms of Jesus this day.

Can you post a scripture for the age of accountability?

 

[Dino246]

You think infants and children are sinners so that doesn't surprise me.

Really? Trying to discredit me on the basis of your morals? Don't waste my time with such tripe.

A distinction without a difference.
There would be nothing to afford the comment had the slaughter of innocents not occurred.

The difference is simple: one is merely the word of man, while the other is the transcendent word of God.

God did the same thing well prior to Herod. When he sent his angel of death to kill the firstborn of every house in Egypt. Yet another plague upon Pharaoh so to make him let God's people go. When Pharaoh couldn't do that because God hardened Pharaoh's heart so he'd not comply with Moses-God's demand to let God's people go.

Talk to God about that. Pharaoh hardened his own heart first.

“Jesus invited a little child to stand among them. " I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven."

There is no hint of anything about moral innocence in that statement, which is what you are claiming.

That's your opinion of what you witnessed. You've no idea what's in people's mind. And no one comes to Jesus unless the father draws them . Perhaps those you saw weren't led by God to God.
You don't know.

You don't have a hot clue what I know, so don't waste your time arguing the point.

Newborns don't sin. Innocent children don't sin when they have no knowledge of good or evil.

All have sinned. Again, which part of this don't you understand?

Deuteronomy 139
Joshua the son of Nun, who stands before you, he shall enter. Encourage him, for he shall cause Israel to inherit it. And as for your little ones, who you said would become a prey, and your children, who today have no knowledge of good or evil, they shall go in there. And to them I will give it, and they shall possess it. "

Having no knowledge of good or evil does not excuse sin. Whether God holds them accountable is a separate issue.

James 4:17So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

That's not an all-encompassing definition of sin. Doing the wrong thing is sin, but so is failing to do the right thing. They are different categories.

I put the word to your observation.

I didn't use it, so I have no need to defend my use of it.

Not at all. I compiled a list describing scripture that tells us ,per your observation of God being Omnipresent and Biblically consistent during the school massacre when innocents we're slaughtered before present God.

Great! I hope you learned something from doing your homework.

Please don't presume to criticize me as one responding from emotion thinking that invalidates an observation.I've read your posts.

Emotionally-charged arguments may be valid, but yours isn't.

You're free to ignore scripture and label what it says as Calvinistic.
Predestination, foreordination, are scripture.

Your application of them is Calvinistic.

All prophetic scripture is evidence of God predetermining the future. That would include the Messiah prophecies in the OT.

No, not even remotely. God's intelligence far exceeds our own; He can assess the consequences of every choice and graciously tells us what will happen. That has nothing whatsoever to do with predetermination.

Telling me not to get my knickers in a twist is emotional, not rational .

Actually, it is a rational (though colourful) response to what I perceive as overly-emotional arguments.

Ultimately, your issue is not with me but with God, because you cannot comprehend that He can be good, omnipresent, and omnipotent, and yet did not stop the massacre. I trust Him, and I am confident that He will be vindicated.

 

[Magenta]

No, not even remotely. God's intelligence far exceeds our own; He can assess the consequences of every choice
and graciously tells us what will happen. That has nothing whatsoever to do with predetermination.

I wonder how it is that people fail to comprehend this

 

[Dino246]

I wonder how it is that people fail to comprehend this

Perhaps because predestination absolves them of responsibility.

 

[ZNP]

Fear not

 

[BeeThePeace]

Really? Trying to discredit me on the basis of your morals? Don't waste my time with such tripe.


The difference is simple: one is merely the word of man, while the other is the transcendent word of God.


Talk to God about that. Pharaoh hardened his own heart first.


There is no hint of anything about moral innocence in that statement, which is what you are claiming.


You don't have a hot clue what I know, so don't waste your time arguing the point.


All have sinned. Again, which part of this don't you understand?


Having no knowledge of good or evil does not excuse sin. Whether God holds them accountable is a separate issue.


That's not an all-encompassing definition of sin. Doing the wrong thing is sin, but so is failing to do the right thing. They are different categories.


I didn't use it, so I have no need to defend my use of it.


Great! I hope you learned something from doing your homework.


Emotionally-charged arguments may be valid, but yours isn't.


Your application of them is Calvinistic.


No, not even remotely. God's intelligence far exceeds our own; He can assess the consequences of every choice and graciously tells us what will happen. That has nothing whatsoever to do with predetermination.


Actually, it is a rational (though colourful) response to what I perceive as overly-emotional arguments.

Ultimately, your issue is not with me but with God, because you cannot comprehend that He can be good, omnipresent, and omnipotent, and yet did not stop the massacre. I trust Him, and I am confident that He will be vindicated.

My morals? Well, at least I have them.

Only a matter of time before your bloviating self-righteous lecturing condemning emotion over rationality showed itself.

My "tripe" is Biblical because I am a Christian and don't equate to God a satanic indifference to innocent children whom only the enemy makes into the damned the day they are born.

You are so wrong.
Yet it is true, blasphemous condemnation of God will be vindicated by God .

 

[soberxp]

Yet another school shooting in Texas.
WHERE WAS GOD???
Why didn't He stop the shooter?
Why did He let those innocents die?
I don't think I want to serve a God that let's evil like this happen.

Why do people focus on the result of death, rather than on why a person would do such a thing, and what the killer experienced to make these decisions, so as to better solve the problem, not everything depends on God.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Why do people focus on the result of death, rather than on why a person would do such a thing, and what the killer experienced to make these decisions, so as to better solve the problem, not everything depends on God.

When innocent children are slaughtered it's natural for the faithful to wonder where God was. How did he let it happen,etc...?

The why is easy, the shooter was a psycho. In Texas open carry and Castle doctrine are law. I'm disappointed he got as far as he did and got away before being stopped sfter accruing so many victims to his evil.

Why don't we go us on the victims and not the dev that took them?