The tree of the knowledge of good and evil, why was it created and placed on earth?

[Evmur]

why would they be dying without sin?
that proposition, that they were created in a perpetual state of death which needed to be constantly remedied by eating an 'antidote' tree, would contradict Romans 5:12 ((sin entered the world through Adam, and death through sin)) and it would blasphemously indicate that the breath of the Spirit of Life ((Genesis 7:22)) was not life at all, but only a deceitful, temporary illusion of life.

Everyone overlooks the deception .... the illusion the devil created was that man had freewill. He said "you will not die" .... you can do what you like.

This is still how the devil works today.

The doctrine of human freewill is mighty powerful ... even in the church.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Adam was not deceived. The tree they ate from was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, not the tree of the knowledge of right and wrong. Since Adam was not deceived, I would think he knew what he was doing was wrong, and why God held him to be responsible.

Yes. They both knew the consequence was death. Eve made an affirmative statement that she knew the one prohibition
God had given to Adam and that the consequence of breaking it had been explained to her.

Gen 3:1

Now the serpent was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You can’t eat from any tree in the garden’?”

2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God said, ‘You must not eat it or touch it, or you will die.’”

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

How do we know?

Jesus answered, ‘It is written: “Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.
Matt 4:4

He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord.
Duet 8:3

 

[BeeThePeace]

Jesus answered, ‘It is written: “Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.
Matt 4:4

He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord.
Duet 8:3

Jesus was referring to the old testament scrolls. Which is problematic for any Christian who claims any traditions held sacred now, such as rest and doing God's work on Sabbath, doesn't apply to us because it's old testament and therefore of the Jews.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Everyone overlooks the deception .... the illusion the devil created was that man had freewill. He said "you will not die" .... you can do what you like.

This is still how the devil works today.

The doctrine of human freewill is mighty powerful ... even in the church.

A false doctrine.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Yes. They both knew the consequence was death. Eve made an affirmative statement that she knew the one prohibition
God had given to Adam and that the consequence of breaking it had been explained to her.

Gen 3:1

Now the serpent was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You can’t eat from any tree in the garden’?”

2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God said, ‘You must not eat it or touch it, or you will die.’”

They were told the consequences was death. Vast difference when they knew not death or what it was because death did not yet exist in the world until sin entered the world from Heaven. Where it originated with Lucifer.

 

[BeeThePeace]

I think you missed the part where Satan's entire argument hinges on convincing her that God is evil.
In order for that to work she has to know the difference between good and evil.

I didnt miss a thing that's actually in Genesis. Your invention isn't scripture.

 

[kenallen]

It does mean they didnt know how to make an informed choice as pertains to obedience because they not conscious of the concepts relating to consequence , alternatives and consent.

Jesus was referring to the old testament scrolls. Which is problematic for any Christian who claims any traditions held sacred now, such as rest and doing God's work on Sabbath, doesn't apply to us because it's old testament and therefore of the Jews.

Are you trying to say that the Old Testament does not apply to Christians today? If you are what did Jesus mean every time He said "Have you not read it?" He was referring to the Old Testament.
Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ” That means from Genises1:1 to Revelation 22:21

 

[BeeThePeace]

Sounds like a loss of innocency before the Fall.

They were entirely innocent before the fall.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Scripture specifically states that Adam was not deceived.

Paul was obviously wrong. Because neither Adam or Eve knew right from wrong,good from evil. And Adam was with Eve when she encountered the serpent. If he wasnt innocent,he was, and wasn't deceived , you're hoping to convince us Adam knowingly ate so to let sin enter this world. Because Adam was blamed for that.

By one man sin entered the world.

And Adam, by that failure to lead Eve to a righteous choice, if we insist he too wasn't deceived by the serpent too, means the man failed as head of the wife in the beginning.

Now that sin is in the world due to that first man, it is difficult to make a valid argument that man is to be head of the wife today. When the first man doomed the world by failing in that capacity the first time he was challenged to exercise his authority as head of his wife Eve.

 

[posthuman]

I didnt miss a thing that's actually in Genesis. Your invention isn't scripture.

Then the serpent said to the woman,
“You will not surely die. For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God"
(Genesis 3:4-5)
​

clearly:
Satan calls God a liar, and tells Woman God has commanded her not to eat because she would benefit from doing so, becoming like Him.

so you tell me: what is the basis upon which this should persuade Woman?
how is this convincing? what is Satan appealing to? what is the situation he is portraying?
why does he use this exact argument with her?

 

[posthuman]

Paul was obviously wrong.

ah
ok.


if you don't believe the Bible, there is an entirely different conversation we should be having, rather than discussing the interpretation of scripture. we are not ready to discuss scripture while you reject it.

 

[BeeThePeace]

The bible canbe a compass. If we make it an idol as many do we're wrong. And doomed.TE="kenallen, post: 4844653, member: 315188"]Are you trying to say that the Old Testament does not apply to Christians today? If you are what did Jesus mean every time He said "Have you not read it?" He was referring to the Old Testament.
Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ” That means from Genises1:1 to Revelation 22:21[/QUOTE]
No, my post wouldn't lead anyone to think I said that.

There arf Christians who do bieve that though.

I said, when Jesus referred to what is written he was rrferring to the Jewish Bibld. And also to God. Because the word of God is actually God.

In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God.

This is why it behooves any believer to study the origin and history of today's bible.
The quagmire that is false doctrine eminates from false understanding and generations of edits to the book, biblos,bible.

This is why God tells us to be still and know he is God.

We commit grave error to think to believe God is limited by books written by men over the centuries. When he tells us he cannot be contained in structures built by human hands, pay attention.
God indwells us. He is the word.

 

[BeeThePeace]

ah
ok.


if you don't believe the Bible, there is an entirely different conversation we should be having, rather than discussing the interpretation of scripture. we are not ready to discuss scripture while you reject it.

Unfortunately you don't know the difference between inspiration and sentiment.

Therefore, it's true. We have nothing to discuss when you are errant in that basic understanding of scripture.

 

[Magenta]

Paul was obviously wrong. Because neither Adam or Eve knew right from wrong,good from evil.
And Adam was with Eve when she encountered the serpent. If he wasnt innocent,he was, and
wasn't deceived , you're hoping to convince us Adam knowingly ate so to let sin enter this world.
Because Adam was blamed for that.

By one man sin entered the world.

And Adam, by that failure to lead Eve to a righteous choice, if we insist he too wasn't
deceived by the serpent too, means the man failed as head of the wife in the beginning.

Now that sin is in the world due to that first man, it is difficult to make a valid argument that
man is to be head of the wife today. When the first man doomed the world by failing in that
capacity the first time he was challenged to exercise his authority as head of his wife Eve.

Interesting that you deny the validity of Scripture. Do you think James is wrong as well?

Each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. Then after
desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.

Clearly Adam's desire gave birth to sin and death.

And John?

For everything in the world--the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes,
and the pride of life--comes not from the Father but from the world.

Scripture alludes to the same when speaking of Eve's attraction to the forbidden tree:

When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food (lust of the flesh) and pleasing to the
eye (lust of the eyes), and also desirable for gaining wisdom (pride of life), she took some and ate it.

 

[crossnote]

They were entirely innocent before the fall.

Right and they lost it at the Fall.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Right and they lost it at the Fall.

amen they lost everything at the transgression and fall into sin and death

“And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭2:25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

before the transgression man was blessed , given dominion , made in Gods image , placed in the garden of Eden with God . Given freedom and blessing approval and all by the grace of Gods Will to create man in his image

but then they lost everything because they rejected what God had told them and accepted what Satan told them

“And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons. And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat? And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: and I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; in the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living. Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them. And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken. So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭3:4-11, 14-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

now thier access to the tree of life is taken away , thier blessing has become a curse of death and toil and struggle , they are driven out from where God places then in Eden they are ashamed and afraid of Gods presence and deemed sinners needing an atonement

they lost everything we mankind lost everything God had created us for. But Jesus Christ has come to restore it all to redeem us to life from death , to give us our name back as the sons of God , to freely offer entrance into the paradise of God and access to the tree of life to give us back dominion over the evil in the world to fill the kingdom God created with the people he is creating to remake us into the image of Jesus Christ the son of God

 

[BeeThePeace]

Right and they lost it at the Fall.

Yes. They were led by a higher intellect that knew God's ultimatum and plans to innocently yet again accepted as truth what they were led to believe,told was truth.

Do we really think, had they been fully conscious of the consequences that would befall the world for all time should they wilfully disobey God that they would have? Given that would have meant they would be the first to suffer?

They were wholly innocent. Which is why they did not feel shame for their nakedness until after their fall from God's grace.

The first Adam fell from God's grace. The second Adam sealed the new covenant with his flesh and blood to assure us that would never happen again.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Yes. They both knew the consequence was death. Eve made an affirmative statement that she knew the one prohibition
God had given to Adam and that the consequence of breaking it had been explained to her.

Gen 3:1

Now the serpent was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You can’t eat from any tree in the garden’?”

2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God said, ‘You must not eat it or touch it, or you will die.’”

Repeating what she was told is not the same as being fully condcious of its meaning, import.

She didn't know death it what it was. Because death only entered the world after the fall.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

why does God bring all the other living souls before Adam, knowing that none would be a suitable helper?

I explained earlier: to subdue the earth, have dominion over all animals. In one word, stewardship.