You need both water baptism and the Holy Ghost/Holy Spirit.
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I agree with you that we need the water baptism and what the baptism brings to us spiritually. But let's take a look at when the baptism started in the Bible. Let's go to 1 Corinthian 10: 1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 and were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 and did all eat the same spiritual meat; 4 and did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
So the baptism go as far as Moses. Why? Because God made Moses the intercessor, like today Jesus is the our intercessor to the Father. But guess what else we just leaned in these verses, Jesus Christ was back there in the days of Moses as God almighty. Yes! That was Jesus. Remember what Jesus says to the jews in John 8: 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, men and brethren, what shall we do? Then Peter said unto them, "repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." (Acts 2:38).
If we truly love God, then we will obey "Every word" that proceeds out of his mouth (Matthew 4:4). Baptism is one of those words. In order to be baptized, certain events must take place: You must give up a lifestyle where sin has dominion, (ruler ship) over you. Sin according to 1 John 3:4, Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression (breaking) of the law. You must be taught "The Word", before you can adhere to God's commandments (judgments\statues). These laws are found in the Holy Bible; beginning with Genesis and ending with Revelation. You must believe what the bible says and finally, you must confess that Jesus is Lord. Once this has been accomplished, you are qualified to be baptized in the name of Jesus.
"And he said unto them, go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." (Mark 16:15-16). Listen people! Baptism is a commandment or requirement for salvation.
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Precious friend, if water "isn't exactly salvific," then what do you do with:
"And all the people that heard him, and the publicans, justified God,
being baptized with the baptism of John. But the Pharisees and lawyers
rejected The Counsel Of God Against themselves, being not baptized of
him." (Luk_7-29-30) .-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.--.-.-.-.-.-.-.--.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. = ↑ water ↑,
Correct?
If the Jew under the law, in John's day, was not saved by obeying God's Command, then how could he "have a clean conscience toward God"?
Isn't that why all these Scriptures, under the law, can be:
Mar 1:4 "John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins."
Luk 3:3 "And he [John] came into all the country about Jordan, preaching
the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;"
Mar 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Act 2:38 "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
------------------------------------------------
Should we "avoid it"? Take a look at all the Confusion of the last
2000 years of those who did not avoid it, and their interpretations/
changes made to what God Plainly And Clearly Inspired, under law,
leading to misunderstanding/misrepresentation of the above
Written Word Of Truth:
Stressing water baptism Confusion
-------------------------------
Since "God Is not the author of confusion" (1Co_14:33), should we
not prayerfully and Carefully examine His Written Word Of Truth,
Rightly Divided, and find the Solution to "avoiding Confusion"? i.e.:
Yesterday, in prophecy and law, Scriptures shown above...
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
Today, Under God's Pure GRACE and Revelation of The Mystery,
There is Only ONE Baptism and, it is not water! Amen?
GRACE And Peace...
"And all the people that heard him, and the publicans, justified God,
being baptized with the baptism of John. But the Pharisees and lawyers
rejected The Counsel Of God Against themselves, being not baptized of
him." (Luk_7-29-30) .-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.--.-.-.-.-.-.-.--.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. = ↑ water ↑,
Correct?
If the Jew under the law, in John's day, was not saved by obeying God's Command, then how could he "have a clean conscience toward God"?
Isn't that why all these Scriptures, under the law, can be:
read Exactly As They Are Written?:
Mar 1:4 "John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins."
Luk 3:3 "And he [John] came into all the country about Jordan, preaching
the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;"
Mar 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Act 2:38 "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
------------------------------------------------
Should we "avoid it"? Take a look at all the Confusion of the last
2000 years of those who did not avoid it, and their interpretations/
changes made to what God Plainly And Clearly Inspired, under law,
leading to misunderstanding/misrepresentation of the above
Written Word Of Truth:
Stressing water baptism Confusion
-------------------------------
Since "God Is not the author of confusion" (1Co_14:33), should we
not prayerfully and Carefully examine His Written Word Of Truth,
Rightly Divided, and find the Solution to "avoiding Confusion"? i.e.:
Yesterday, in prophecy and law, Scriptures shown above...
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
Today, Under God's Pure GRACE and Revelation of The Mystery,
There is Only ONE Baptism and, it is not water! Amen?
GRACE And Peace...
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FreeGrace2 said:
Quit quoting only the part of a verse that deceptively agrees with you. The first part is "this literal water SYMBOLIZES the baptism that now saves.
It is highly deceptive and dishonest to continue to quote as you do.
I LOVE the ENTIRE verse, unlike your dishonest tactic of leaving out the words that refute you.
One must be IN THE LIGHT in order to see others in the light.
Show what? What are you talking about?
I've been showing you the words you keep ignoring and intentionally leaving out when you quote only part of 1 Pet 3:21.
The good news is that the more you do that, and I correct it, the more others will see your dishonesty and realize what the verse really says.
Which is the opposite of what you say.
Quit quoting only the part of a verse that deceptively agrees with you. The first part is "this literal water SYMBOLIZES the baptism that now saves.
It is highly deceptive and dishonest to continue to quote as you do.
I LOVE the ENTIRE verse, unlike your dishonest tactic of leaving out the words that refute you.
One must be IN THE LIGHT in order to see others in the light.
Show what? What are you talking about?
I've been showing you the words you keep ignoring and intentionally leaving out when you quote only part of 1 Pet 3:21.
The good news is that the more you do that, and I correct it, the more others will see your dishonesty and realize what the verse really says.
Which is the opposite of what you say.
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And what about the Gentile that already had the Holy Spirit that Peter went to visit and said "Since he already has the Holy Spirit how can we deny him a baptism?"
I'm not saying that we shouldn't get Baptized....far from it. I'm just not convinced that it's the "end all, be all" of Salvation....especially since it is a gift from God and not something decided by the function of man.
Precious friend, thank you for the honest and fair question. This event
occurred during God's Transition Period from law, which continued at
Pentecost, to Grace, Which began with Saul's salvation in Acts 9.
Thus, water, from the old economy of prophecy and law, was still
in effect, as Peter "was sent (in his commission with the 11), to
water baptize." So, he did as He Was Commanded By Christ, But "God
Interrupted" his message to the first Gentiles, so the order was now
Different than that of Acts 2:38, as to When "God Gave The Gift Of
The Holy Ghost," Correct?:
Acts 2:38 Holy Ghost Given After water baptism, Correct?
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
Acts 10:44-47 Holy Ghost Given Before water baptism, Correct?
So, what does this mean for you and I, today, Under GRACE?
Well, after Christ, from Heaven, Revealed to Paul, His (Hidden)
Mystery, we learn that "THE apostle to the Gentiles" (Rom 11:13),
has a Different commission than the Twelve. He says "Christ
sent me Not to baptize, but to preach the Gospel." (1Co 1:17)
And, God's Truth To Paul Was, That There Is Now Only ONE Baptism
(Ephesians 4:5), and That ONE Is Spiritual (1 Corinthians 12:13), for
God's Salvation And Induction Into The Spiritual Body Of Christ,
Seated In The Heavenlies! Amen?
Hopes this helps, and there is more on God's Two Different
programs, here: God's Approval/Two Different Gospels!
and here: "Distinctions" In God's prophecy vs Mystery!
GRACE And Peace...
occurred during God's Transition Period from law, which continued at
Pentecost, to Grace, Which began with Saul's salvation in Acts 9.
Thus, water, from the old economy of prophecy and law, was still
in effect, as Peter "was sent (in his commission with the 11), to
water baptize." So, he did as He Was Commanded By Christ, But "God
Interrupted" his message to the first Gentiles, so the order was now
Different than that of Acts 2:38, as to When "God Gave The Gift Of
The Holy Ghost," Correct?:
Acts 2:38 Holy Ghost Given After water baptism, Correct?
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
Acts 10:44-47 Holy Ghost Given Before water baptism, Correct?
So, what does this mean for you and I, today, Under GRACE?
Well, after Christ, from Heaven, Revealed to Paul, His (Hidden)
Mystery, we learn that "THE apostle to the Gentiles" (Rom 11:13),
has a Different commission than the Twelve. He says "Christ
sent me Not to baptize, but to preach the Gospel." (1Co 1:17)
And, God's Truth To Paul Was, That There Is Now Only ONE Baptism
(Ephesians 4:5), and That ONE Is Spiritual (1 Corinthians 12:13), for
God's Salvation And Induction Into The Spiritual Body Of Christ,
Seated In The Heavenlies! Amen?
Hopes this helps, and there is more on God's Two Different
programs, here: God's Approval/Two Different Gospels!
and here: "Distinctions" In God's prophecy vs Mystery!
GRACE And Peace...
The what does these scriptures mean;' (one at a time please....so we can all learn)(start with John 3;5)
Baptism is Required
Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...
John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.
KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.
Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.
John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth
.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.
Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.
Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.
Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.
Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
Baptism is Required
Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...
John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.
KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.
Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.
John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth
.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.
Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.
Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.
Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.
Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
Then you will have no problem by answering the following...starting with John 3;5...please; (one at a time)
Baptism is Required
Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...
John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.
KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.
Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.
John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth
.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.
Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.
Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.
Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.
Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
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Please..are you saying that the rest of Christianity rejects the following controlling scriptures that says baptism is required? No way.
Baptism is Required
Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...
John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.
KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.
Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.
John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth
.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.
Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.
Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.
Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.
Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
Please may I ask...where did you get this notion?
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