when will the most evil doctrin in the world get banned on this site.

[Phoneman-777]

I was hoping you would make it clear and I had a feeling your motive was one of well meaning towards salvation, it's a not always easy to not Judge a person's motive tho, with out coming across that you are,. Especially in this topic. I'm glad tho you have explained,

All tho it may be that some people are teaching in error with blindness, and it's good to point that out, at the same time you keep pointing that out and they keep insinuating something else, then there may well be a motive of perhaps an underlying issue as to why OSAS is preached with an agenda, that keeps preaching there saved and someone else is not. But generally OSAS when preached with an agenda of pride generally accuses a Christians salvation of not being right, which is behaving like the false accuser notion of presumptuous sin, and they get away with it everytime,. I'm sure anti Christians and atheists alike have noticed by now on Christian chat how easy it is to offend a Christian and get away with it whilst preaching OSAS,. So I wonder now with OSAS we should examine the motive,.

As well you know since I called for repentance befor but there has been even more presumptuous sins, and no matter what you say to prove you have good intentions, theses presumptuous people preaching OSAS keep attacking.

Brother, I appreciate your thoughts and efforts. It's my experience that the Conditional Salvation crowd - being spiritually mature - knows the way to deal with the tantrums of the OSAS License to Sin crowd is similar to how an adult deals with a rude, disrespectful, uncooperative child: PATIENCE. Anything less, and Satan will be right there to point the finger and encourage them in their error.

 

[Gideon300]

hey brother I believe it's enough to be told your saved, I don't think there's a need to preach over that, I don't believe growing has anything to do with remaining saved once you've been saved,. I don't find a need to preach your not saved if you don't believe the way I do. Which quite often OSAS has, that is one of the many errors, in OSAS, which lets not for get is a doctrine. Secondly bro I really can't see why OSAS should feel the need to tell Christians this, over and over again of what they must not do to gain salvation. The irony is bro that OSAS is only a interpretation of a person own interpretation of salvation , and its a man made doctrine, the other irony is that anti OSAS is also preaching there own interpretation of Salvation, but I do not see a daily doctrine of works for salvation which OSAS suggest everyday here that there is. I only see Christians defending the law and works. It is the doctrine of OSAS that promotes the agenda that Christians are teaching works for salvation. And I see many people applauding each other for it and giving each other favour after insulting a Christian who is merely defending good works and the law.

Are you sure now that OSAS is now not a doctrine for anti Christians to insult Christians with,. Because that's all I ever see.
I know that Christians want to preach the gospel of being saved by salvation not cause someone a grudge over salvation

I've given it my best shot and you reject the truth still. I'm sorry for you. I'd hate to be checking myself out every moment to see if I've sinned and so lost my salvation. I lived like that for way too long. You will never know real peace until you know the true basis of salvation. You prefer to live in worry and fear. Your choice.

 

[Phoneman-777]

I see where wintersrain has joined me and the others on his "I ain't going to talk to you anymore.You offended me."

Try showing a little Christian character instead of reeing and screaming and insulting and then acting as if those who walk away are the problem...and if you can't be Christlike, try simply being a respectful adult.

 

[RichMan]

Please bare with this old man as I try to explain my belief.
I struggle to put into words my thoughts sometimes.
I will not take the time tonight to quote a lot of Scripture, because I type with two fingers and have limited knowledge and ability in the use of this chrome book.

I do not like labels. When labels are used like OSAS it is often for the purpose to condemn, demonize, and even question a person's standing before God.

John 3:16-18 makes it very clear. God loves all men. That love is so great that he gave His son to shed His sinless blood on a cross to pay my sin debt, that debt being eternal separation from God in a place called Hell.
For me to to receive this forgiveness of the debt I owe, I must believe that I am a sinner, worthy of Hell, and desire to turn from my sinful ways, and by faith trust in the promise that He will forgive.
When I by faith believe, I receive eternal life. If I do not believe, I am condemned to pay the debt by spending eternity in Hell.
There is nothing I can do to pay that debt. All my works are as filthy rags. As long as I dwell in this flesh, I will from time to time sin.
"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak"
Since I can do nothing to earn forgiveness, there is nothing I can do to keep myself forgiven.
My soul in now in the hand of the SON. The Father gave my soul to the SON, and no may can take me out of His hand.
Eternal means eternal. There are no if, and, or buts about it.

On July 27, 1962, I by faith believed and received eternal life.
It can not be lost or taken away or given back.

Some have accused me and others that believe as I do of believing that I have a licence to sin. That I believe there are no consequences when I sin.
I have never said that, nor do I know anyone that believes that or have posted that on this forum.
If it has been posted, show me.

The Father will chastise those who sin. If we do not confess and ask forgiveness, that chastisement can be severe and even death of the flesh.

The Father does not chastise those that are not His, so if a person sins, does not confess, and ask forgiveness and suffer no chastisement they are lost and were never saved regardless of what they claim.

Now if you choose to accuse me and other of believing I have a licence to sin because I have eternal life in Jesus, I will not be silent.
I will call it what it is, A LIE.
People how lie are liars, and God hates liars.

I will also call you out when you preach that eternal life, salvation, can be gained or lost by doing this or not doing that .

I'm done now.

 

[Phoneman-777]

I've given it my best shot and you reject the truth still. I'm sorry for you. I'd hate to be checking myself out every moment to see if I've sinned and so lost my salvation. I lived like that for way too long. You will never know real peace until you know the true basis of salvation. You prefer to live in worry and fear. Your choice.

Does a loving husband or wife have to "check themselves out" every five minutes to see if they're remaining faithful, or do they just automatically do?

So it is with the saint. Sure, learning what it means to be faithful to God may take some time, as the Holy Spirit leads us out of error and into truth -- the smoker learns to put away smokes, the drunkard his booze, the foul mouth his cursing, etc. -- but can we really expect that "teaching them all things whatsoever I have commanded you" comes without a learning curve?

 

[Phoneman-777]

Please bare with this old man as I try to explain my belief.
I struggle to put into words my thoughts sometimes.
I will not take the time tonight to quote a lot of Scripture, because I type with two fingers and have limited knowledge and ability in the use of this chrome book.

I do not like labels. When labels are used like OSAS it is often for the purpose to condemn, demonize, and even question a person's standing before God.

John 3:16-18 makes it very clear. God loves all men. That love is so great that he gave His son to shed His sinless blood on a cross to pay my sin debt, that debt being eternal separation from God in a place called Hell.
For me to to receive this forgiveness of the debt I owe, I must believe that I am a sinner, worthy of Hell, and desire to turn from my sinful ways, and by faith trust in the promise that He will forgive.
When I by faith believe, I receive eternal life. If I do not believe, I am condemned to pay the debt by spending eternity in Hell.
There is nothing I can do to pay that debt. All my works are as filthy rags. As long as I dwell in this flesh, I will from time to time sin.
"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak"
Since I can do nothing to earn forgiveness, there is nothing I can do to keep myself forgiven.
My soul in now in the hand of the SON. The Father gave my soul to the SON, and no may can take me out of His hand.
Eternal means eternal. There are no if, and, or buts about it.

On July 27, 1962, I by faith believed and received eternal life.
It can not be lost or taken away or given back.

Some have accused me and others that believe as I do of believing that I have a licence to sin. That I believe there are no consequences when I sin.
I have never said that, nor do I know anyone that believes that or have posted that on this forum.
If it has been posted, show me.

The Father will chastise those who sin. If we do not confess and ask forgiveness, that chastisement can be severe and even death of the flesh.

The Father does not chastise those that are not His, so if a person sins, does not confess, and ask forgiveness and suffer no chastisement they are lost and were never saved regardless of what they claim.

Now if you choose to accuse me and other of believing I have a licence to sin because I have eternal life in Jesus, I will not be silent.
I will call it what it is, A LIE.
People how lie are liars, and God hates liars.

I will also call you out when you preach that eternal life, salvation, can be gained or lost by doing this or not doing that .

I'm done now.

A lie is "deliberate misrepresentation of what one knows to be true". Therefore, if I said anything other than "OSAS is a License to Sin which claims we may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life"......you could say I was lying.

I don't like being accused of practicing salvation by works, but I know better than to call someone a liar for it because I give them the benefit of the doubt it's what they sincerely believe.

You've demonstrated yourself as spiritually immature and ill-equipped to handle the emotionally charged atmosphere of theological debate by the way you come at people with double-barrel rocksalt instead of thoughtful reason, and this pathetic attempt to justify your actions is further evidence of that immaturity. Have you ever heard of the concept of being agreeable when disagreeing?

 

[Gideon300]

Brother, I appreciate your thoughts and efforts. It's my experience that the Conditional Salvation crowd - being spiritually mature - knows the way to deal with the tantrums of the OSAS License to Sin crowd is similar to how an adult deals with a rude, disrespectful, uncooperative child: PATIENCE. Anything less, and Satan will be right there to point the finger and encourage them in their error.

Congratulations on total self deception. God will judge you as you judge others. You'd better hope that you don't die on a day that you sin. You go straight to hell. According to your theology anyway. I'm just glad that I'm saved by grace. And that is as true today as it was 50 years ago.

 

[Gideon300]

Does a loving husband or wife have to "check themselves out" every five minutes to see if they're remaining faithful, or do they just automatically do?

So it is with the saint. Sure, learning what it means to be faithful to God may take some time, as the Holy Spirit leads us out of error and into truth -- the smoker learns to put away smokes, the drunkard his booze, the foul mouth his cursing, etc. -- but can we really expect that "teaching them all things whatsoever I have commanded you" comes without a learning curve?

You have just contradicted yourself completely. OK, King David was a man after God's own heart. According to you, he's in hell. He was an adulterous murderer. Yet his psalms are still in God's word.

So tell me what a person needs to do to be unsaved? If murder and adultery are not enough, what is?

Your presumption that OSAS preaches a licence to sin is false. I'm OSAS. I do not live as if sin is of no account. I know the difference between being born again and the ongoing walk with Christ. If a person loves sin, then I doubt the reality of their supposed salvation. People need to to be convicted that they are sinners before they can be saved in the first place.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Brother, I appreciate your thoughts and efforts.

This is the same person who said in his OP -- CONTRARY TO SCRIPTURE --- "But the biggest most biggest most evil doctrine from hell is the one that says God allows evil to tempt or test people into sin, or God allows evil to test humans to see if they will sin." Since the book of Job (as just one example) refutes his foolish notion, what exactly do you appreciate? We should not be encouraging nonsense.

 

[Dino246]

Try showing a little Christian character instead of reeing and screaming and insulting and then acting as if those who walk away are the problem...and if you can't be Christlike, try simply being a respectful adult.

Now, Composthuman and his disciple Dino420

Uh huh. Nice Christian character there, Phoneman.

 

[Gideon300]

A lie is "deliberate misrepresentation of what one knows to be true". Therefore, if I said anything other than "OSAS is a License to Sin which claims we may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life"......you could say I was lying.

I don't like being accused of practicing salvation by works, but I know better than to call someone a liar for it because I give them the benefit of the doubt it's what they sincerely believe.

You've demonstrated yourself as spiritually immature and ill-equipped to handle the emotionally charged atmosphere of theological debate by the way you come at people with double-barrel rocksalt instead of thoughtful reason, and this pathetic attempt to justify your actions is further evidence of that immaturity. Have you ever heard of the concept of being agreeable when disagreeing?

WOW. You could try taking your own advice sometime. You have completely overreacted to RichMan's post.

 

[Gideon300]

This is the same person who said in his OP -- CONTRARY TO SCRIPTURE --- "But the biggest most biggest most evil doctrine from hell is the one that says God allows evil to tempt or test people into sin, or God allows evil to test humans to see if they will sin." Since the book of Job (as just one example) refutes his foolish notion, what exactly do you appreciate? We should not be encouraging nonsense.

James 1:
12Blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life that God has promised to those who love Him. 13When tempted, no one should say, “ God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed.…

 

[de-emerald]

You have just contradicted yourself completely. OK, King David was a man after God's own heart. According to you, he's in hell. He was an adulterous murderer. Yet his psalms are still in God's word.

So tell me what a person needs to do to be unsaved? If murder and adultery are not enough, what is?

Your presumption that OSAS preaches a licence to sin is false. I'm OSAS. I do not live as if sin is of no account. I know the difference between being born again and the ongoing walk with Christ. If a person loves sin, then I doubt the reality of their supposed salvation. People need to to be convicted that they are sinners before they can be saved in the first place.

and your promoting an enemy out of
@Phoneman-777 by appealing to a doctrine of OSAS, You know fine we'll OSAS is being preached by anti Christians and atheists as Christian do not preach OSAS with a happy blessing to send somebody to hell, Christians preach the gospel of Jesus to bring salvation with Gladness not a grudge,. Not everyone has the same understanding of OSAS, so how can you say that your OSAS and I don't do what you do. It's not the man made doctrine of OSAS that gives eternal security it is Jesus, so instead of appealing to a doctrine of OSAS why don't you appeal to Jesus,. Your intelligent surely you can see by appealing to OSAS to cast doubt on another brothers opinion which many favour here you will gain favour in promoting an enemy out of a christian, you don't want that do you ? Your a Christian aren't you,

the gift of salvation is not are decision to make we can't condemn anyone to hell, by condemning somebody to hell whilst preaching OSAS, which somebody has done in this thread because you create enemies with anti Christians Atheists and people of different faiths.,
In turn you then get athiests anti Christian and people of a different faith preaching OSAS along with narcists, and don't think it's not happening here at cc because it is,. I have already identified many legalist groups here, I have guarded the door in the welcome forum for months and watched many newcomers be banned and return under different names over and over again,

You understand OSAS is a doctrine and eternal security is from Jesus ?.

We have to realise that. OSAS is preaching and promoting a lisence to sin blindly by some and deliberately being used as a weapon to attack Christians with,

For that reason we must stand by Christian values that Christians welcome people to salvation not condemn people to hell. Any Christian who do that is not Christ like and promoting anger which is sin

@Phoneman-777 has all ready made his point and stance clear that Christian can make mistakes and be forgiven

 

[Rosemaryx]

I've given it my best shot and you reject the truth still. I'm sorry for you. I'd hate to be checking myself out every moment to see if I've sinned and so lost my salvation. I lived like that for way too long. You will never know real peace until you know the true basis of salvation. You prefer to live in worry and fear. Your choice.

I agree...
Their mind , their conscience must be in constant fear...
...xox...

 

[Phoneman-777]

Congratulations on total self deception. God will judge you as you judge others. You'd better hope that you don't die on a day that you sin. You go straight to hell. According to your theology anyway. I'm just glad that I'm saved by grace. And that is as true today as it was 50 years ago.

Annnnnnnnnnnnd, you've just proven my point. "Judge not" refers to motives and eternal destinies. However, "ye shall know them by their fruits" means we can inspect fruit all day long...and the fruit of most OSAS crowd members is disrespect, immaturity, rudeness, vitriol, spitefulness, etc.

 

[de-emerald]

I've given it my best shot and you reject the truth still. I'm sorry for you. I'd hate to be checking myself out every moment to see if I've sinned and so lost my salvation. I lived like that for way too long. You will never know real peace until you know the true basis of salvation. You prefer to live in worry and fear. Your choice.

hi friend I don't want to turn the gift of salvation into a debate between Christians, we have allready made our peace in a another thread, where we had a disagreement over football and baseball, remember we made our peace with each other, because, please friend I'm happy for you to keep talking with me about this and I even don't mind a disagreement. I do not live in fear, fear lives to cause fear, friend. Your completely in error about my personal character friend, i live in hope not fear. I will not promote a licence to preach an excuse to promote an argument about salvation. I have heard OSAS preach here it's ok to talk about keeping your salvation because we are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling, but does that mean we should try to work out somebody else's, which is what your doing with me here,

Personally speaking once you understand how your saved I don't think you need to work out salvation.

 

[Phoneman-777]

You have just contradicted yourself completely. OK, King David was a man after God's own heart. According to you, he's in hell.

Nah, Kind David ain't in heaven or hell, he's right where Peter said he is: the grave awaiting the resurrection, like where Job himself said he'd wait.

So tell me what a person needs to do to be unsaved? If murder and adultery are not enough, what is?

When the saint chooses to love self more than God, he is no longer a saint, and if he dies without having repented as DAVID repented, he will wake up 1,000 years too late. Saints who do this are said to "fall away", become "entangled therein and overcome", "draw back", not "have compassion and pity on thy fellowservant", etc.

Your presumption that OSAS preaches a licence to sin is false. I'm OSAS. I do not live as if sin is of no account. I know the difference between being born again and the ongoing walk with Christ. If a person loves sin, then I doubt the reality of their supposed salvation. People need to to be convicted that they are sinners before they can be saved in the first place.

The Just Conditional Salvation Man falls seven times and rises up again. The Presumptuous OSAS Man's License to Sin is as fraudulent as a presumptuous Once Married, Always Married License to Cheat but since the Presumptuous OSAS Man is convinced he will remain a slave to sin perpetually, he needs that OSAS License which - as in the case of a driver's license, fishing license, hunting license, etc. - allows him to escape punishment for doing the exact same thing which will find the unlicensed man condemned in court.

 

[RichMan]

and your promoting an enemy out of
@Phoneman-777 by appealing to a doctrine of OSAS, You know fine we'll OSAS is being preached by anti Christians and atheists as Christian do not preach OSAS with a happy blessing to send somebody to hell, Christians preach the gospel of Jesus to bring salvation with Gladness not a grudge,. Not everyone has the same understanding of OSAS, so how can you say that your OSAS and I don't do what you do. It's not the man made doctrine of OSAS that gives eternal security it is Jesus, so instead of appealing to a doctrine of OSAS why don't you appeal to Jesus,. Your intelligent surely you can see by appealing to OSAS to cast doubt on another brothers opinion which many favour here you will gain favour in promoting an enemy out of a christian, you don't want that do you ? Your a Christian aren't you,

the gift of salvation is not are decision to make we can't condemn anyone to hell, by condemning somebody to hell whilst preaching OSAS, which somebody has done in this thread because you create enemies with anti Christians Atheists and people of different faiths.,
In turn you then get athiests anti Christian and people of a different faith preaching OSAS along with narcists, and don't think it's not happening here at cc because it is,. I have already identified many legalist groups here, I have guarded the door in the welcome forum for months and watched many newcomers be banned and return under different names over and over again,

You understand OSAS is a doctrine and eternal security is from Jesus ?.

We have to realise that. OSAS is preaching and promoting a lisence to sin blindly by some and deliberately being used as a weapon to attack Christians with,

For that reason we must stand by Christian values that Christians welcome people to salvation not condemn people to hell. Any Christian who do that is not Christ like and promoting anger which is sin

@Phoneman-777 has all ready made his point and stance clear that Christian can make mistakes and be forgiven

When will this person stop with his lies about those who teach eternal security of the believer.
Does he not realize what he is doing?

 

[RichMan]

Shake, shake, shake
It is time to move on.
Matthew 10:4

 

[Dino246]

Annnnnnnnnnnnd, you've just proven my point. "Judge not" refers to motives and eternal destinies. However, "ye shall know them by their fruits" means we can inspect fruit all day long...and the fruit of most OSAS crowd members is disrespect, immaturity, rudeness, vitriol, spitefulness, etc.

How would your fruit be distinguished from theirs?