Interpreting the Parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus: It's Really Good News!

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Feb 7, 2022
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Casting out the devil from a person
Because of your mistaken theology on the nature of Angels, you cannot hope to even to begin to understand what possession really is (not a physical entering, devils don't jump into people, devils are all physical beings as you or I (they have celestial bodies of flesh and bones), people watch too much Hollywood or listen to Roman Catholicism's skull duggery experiences) or what takes place, or even how to help someone who is. Possession is mind upon mind, Romans 6:16.
 

John146

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I'd watch the video, friend. You can FF to 8:30 up to this point, it's just him explaining why it can only be a parable by pointing out the many Biblical contradictions which arise if we make the passage literal - backed up with lotsa Scripture.

8:30 is where he begins to show how the Bible itself interprets the parable, which is better than I could explain it. That guys a professional evangelist, while I'm a professional sinner trying to be saved by grace :)
Imo, this guy is wrong on many levels. He talks like a replacement theology guy. The body of Christ has not replaced Israel. Second, the reason the Lord starts out in the story with, "a certain rich man" is because the man no longer has a name. He is in hell and his name blotted out of the book of life, therefore, depart from me, I never knew you comes into play. Abraham's bosom is not symbolic in the manner of it is a real place. It's also known as "paradise" where the Lord meet up with the thief on the cross.

I'll address more later from his video.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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The popular yet erroneous teaching about Rich Man and Lazarus has succeeded to both strike fear in the hearts of Christians and drive countless others to atheism, because those who refuse to recognize this passage in Luke 16 as the parable that it is use it to advance the false idea of Eternal Torment - a doctrine of devils - because they know then can't substantiate a doctrine on an uninterpreted parable. Here's the other side of the story:



If you believe this is a parable then please show where Jesus interpreted it.






JLB
 
Aug 3, 2019
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That would have Moses being raised before Jesus but Peter spoke about the importance of Jesus fulfilling these prophesies not Moses.

24God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it. 25For David says concerning him,


“‘I saw the Lord always before me,
for he is at my right hand that I may not be shaken;
26therefore my heart was glad, and my tongue rejoiced;
my flesh also will dwell in hope.
27For you will not abandon my soul to Hades,
or let your Holy One see corruption.
28You have made known to me the paths of life;
you will make me full of gladness with your presence.’
29“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day

So Peter's theological point about how David did not rise from the grave but rather Jesus did, would apply to Moses as well. It was not David, it was not Moses, it was Jesus that this text applies to.
I’m not getting your point.

I will reiterate that Moses could not have appeared to Jesus unless he was alive according to Solomon and Job, which means the dispute over Moses’ body had to be about resurrecting him.

Is not Solomon and Job authoritative on this issue? Job says a dead man is not able to return to his house, meaning his family, community, etc. Solomon says they have nothing to do with anything under the sun.

Now, are you saying a dead, unresurrected Moses returned to his house?

Are you saying a dead, unresurrected Moses had business to attend to on the Mount with Jesus which is under the sun?
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Imo, this guy is wrong on many levels. He talks like a replacement theology guy. The body of Christ has not replaced Israel. Second, the reason the Lord starts out in the story with, "a certain rich man" is because the man no longer has a name. He is in hell and his name blotted out of the book of life, therefore, depart from me, I never knew you comes into play. Abraham's bosom is not symbolic in the manner of it is a real place. It's also known as "paradise" where the Lord meet up with the thief on the cross.

I'll address more later from his video.
Let’s be clear - hell can’t be burning at the moment - Peter plainly says the wicked are not being punished yet TWICE. Jesus Himself said the wicked shall be burned as tares in the fire “at the END of the world”. We CANT disregard these two verses AND the others which teach the same, then insist Luke 16 is literal when it’s lumped in with a series of obvious parables, this parable being equally obvious as such considering all the problems which arise if we make the passage literal.

Again, if we insist the passage is literal, contradictions erupt. If we allow the passage to be a parable, we can see it for what it is: a warning to the Jews that if they don’t straighten up and fly right, the Gospel commission will be “taken from you and given to a nation (Gentiles) bringing forth the fruits thereof”.
 

John146

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Let’s be clear - hell can’t be burning at the moment - Peter plainly says the wicked are not being punished yet TWICE. Jesus Himself said the wicked shall be burned as tares in the fire “at the END of the world”. We CANT disregard these two verses AND the others which teach the same, then insist Luke 16 is literal when it’s lumped in with a series of obvious parables, this parable being equally obvious as such considering all the problems which arise if we make the passage literal.

Again, if we insist the passage is literal, contradictions erupt. If we allow the passage to be a parable, we can see it for what it is: a warning to the Jews that if they don’t straighten up and fly right, the Gospel commission will be “taken from you and given to a nation (Gentiles) bringing forth the fruits thereof”.
Hell is currently in the heart of the earth. It sets fire to the foundations of the mountains. See Jonah. He went there and suffered affliction and was brought up.

Deuteronomy 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
 

TheLearner

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Jesus is the God of both the OT and NT,
and it is HE Who inspired the OT and NT prophets which
"spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit".

Therefore, if the Rich Man and Lazarus is a literal passage, as you claim...

...and dead people can talk, Jesus lied. (Psalms 115:17 KJV, Psalms 88:11 KJV)
...and dead people know things, Jesus lied. (Ecclesiastes 9:5 KJV; Job 14:21 KJV)
...and dead people can plan things, Jesus lied. (Ecclesiastes 9:10 KJV)
...and dead people can see things, Jesus lied. (Psalms 88:12 KJV)
...and dead people can feel things, Jesus lied. (Ecclesiastes 9:6 KJV)
...and dead people can visit the land of the living, Jesus lied. (Job 7:10 KJV)
...and dead people can remember things, Jesus lied. (Ecclesiastes 9:5 KJV; Psalms 88:12 KJV)
...and dead people are in heaven praising God, Jesus lied. (Psalms 115:17 KJV; Psalms 6:5 KJV)
...and dead people are conscious of earthly affairs, Jesus lied. (Psalms 13:3 KJV; Job 14:21 KJV)
...and dead people get resurrection bodies before the resurrection, Jesus lied. (John 6:40, 44, 54 KJV)

However, if the passage is a parable (which it is), He told the truth.
Which about Him do you think is true?
Brother, I think what ever format or type our Lord uses he is telling the Truth.

John 8
Easy-to-Read Version
8 Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. 2 Early in the morning he went back to the Temple area. The people all came to him, and he sat and taught them.

3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought a woman they had caught in bed with a man who was not her husband. They forced her to stand in front of the people. 4 They said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5 The Law of Moses commands us to stone to death any such woman. What do you say we should do?”

6 They were saying this to trick Jesus. They wanted to catch him saying something wrong so that they could have a charge against him. But Jesus stooped down and started writing on the ground with his finger. 7 The Jewish leaders continued to ask him their question. So he stood up and said, “Anyone here who has never sinned should throw the first stone at her.” 8 Then Jesus stooped down again and wrote on the ground.

9 When they heard this, they began to leave one by one. The older men left first, and then the others. Jesus was left alone with the woman standing there in front of him. 10 He looked up again and said to her, “Where did they all go? Did no one judge you guilty?”

11 She answered, “No one, sir.”

Then Jesus said, “I don’t judge you either. You can go now, but don’t sin again.”[a]

Jesus Is the Light of the World
12 Later, Jesus talked to the people again. He said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never live in darkness. They will have the light that gives life.”

13 But the Pharisees said to Jesus, “When you talk about yourself, you are the only one to say that these things are true. So we cannot accept what you say.”

14 Jesus answered, “Yes, I am saying these things about myself. But people can believe what I say, because I know where I came from. And I know where I am going. But you don’t know where I came from or where I am going. 15 You judge me the way people judge other people. I don’t judge anyone. 16 But if I judge, my judging is true, because when I judge I am not alone. The Father who sent me is with me. 17 Your own law says that when two witnesses say the same thing, you must accept what they say. 18 I am one of the witnesses who speaks about myself. And the Father who sent me is my other witness.”

19 The people asked, “Where is your father?”

Jesus answered, “You don’t know me or my Father. But if you knew me, you would know my Father too.” 20 Jesus said these things while he was teaching in the Temple area, near the room where the Temple offerings were kept. But no one arrested him, because the right time for him had not yet come.

Some Jews Don’t Understand Jesus
21 Again, Jesus said to the people, “I will leave you. You will look for me, but you will die in your sin. You cannot come where I am going.”

22 So the Jewish leaders asked themselves, “Will he kill himself? Is that why he said, ‘You cannot come where I am going’?”

23 But Jesus said to them, “You people are from here below, but I am from above. You belong to this world, but I don’t belong to this world. 24 I told you that you would die in your sins. Yes, if you don’t believe that I Am, you will die in your sins.”

25 They asked, “Then who are you?”

Jesus answered, “I am what I have told you from the beginning. 26 I have much more I could say to judge you. But I tell people only what I have heard from the one who sent me, and he speaks the Truth.”

27 They did not understand who he was talking about. He was telling them about the Father. 28 So he said to them, “You will lift up[c] the Son of Man. Then you will know that I Am. You will know that whatever I do is not by my own authority. You will know that I say only what the Father has taught me. 29 The one who sent me is with me. I always do what pleases him. So he has not left me alone.” 30 While he was saying these things, many people believed in him.

Jesus Talks About Freedom From Sin
31 So Jesus said to the Jews who believed in him, “If you continue to accept and obey my teaching, you are really my followers. 32 You will know the Truth, and the Truth will make you free.”

33 They answered, “We are Abraham’s descendants. And we have never been slaves. So why do you say that we will be free?”

34 Jesus said, “The Truth is, everyone who sins is a slave—a slave to sin. 35 A slave does not stay with a family forever. But a son belongs to the family forever. 36 So if the Son makes you free, you are really free. 37 I know you are Abraham’s descendants. But you want to kill me, because you don’t want to accept my teaching. 38 I am telling you what my Father has shown me. But you do what your father has told you.”

39 They said, “Our father is Abraham.”

Jesus said, “If you were really Abraham’s descendants, you would do what Abraham did. 40 I am someone who has told you the Truth I heard from God. But you are trying to kill me. Abraham did nothing like that. 41 So you are doing what your own father did.”

But they said, “We are not like children who never knew who their father was. God is our Father. He is the only Father we have.”

42 Jesus said to them, “If God were really your Father, you would love me. I came from God, and now I am here. I did not come by my own authority. God sent me. 43 You don’t understand the things I say, because you cannot accept my teaching. 44 Your father is the devil. You belong to him. You want to do what he wants. He was a murderer from the beginning. He was always against the Truth. There is no Truth in him. He is like the lies he tells. Yes, the devil is a liar. He is the father of lies.

45 “I am telling you the Truth, and that’s why you don’t believe me. 46 Can any of you prove that I am guilty of sin? If I tell the Truth, why don’t you believe me? 47 Whoever belongs to God accepts what he says. But you don’t accept what God says, because you don’t belong to God.”

Jesus Talks About Himself and Abraham
48 The Jews there answered, “We say you are a Samaritan. We say a demon is making you crazy! Are we not right when we say this?”

49 Jesus answered, “I have no demon in me. I give honor to my Father, but you give no honor to me. 50 I am not trying to get honor for myself. There is one who wants this honor for me. He is the judge. 51 I promise you, whoever continues to obey my teaching will never die.”

52 The Jews said to Jesus, “Now we know that you have a demon in you! Even Abraham and the prophets died. But you say, ‘Whoever obeys my teaching will never die.’ 53 Do you think you are greater than our father Abraham? He died, and so did the prophets. Who do you think you are?”

54 Jesus answered, “If I give honor to myself, that honor is worth nothing. The one who gives me honor is my Father. And you say that he is your God. 55 But you don’t really know him. I know him. If I said I did not know him, I would be a liar like you. But I do know him, and I obey what he says. 56 Your father Abraham was very happy that he would see the day when I came. He saw that day and was happy.”

57 The Jews said to Jesus, “What? How can you say you have seen Abraham? You are not even 50 years old!”

58 Jesus answered, “The fact is, before Abraham was born, I Am.” 59 When he said this, they picked up stones to throw at him. But Jesus hid, and then he left the Temple area.

John 14:6
Jesus answered, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. The only way to the Father is through me.
 

TheLearner

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Titus 1:2
King James Version
2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Hebrews 6:18
King James Version
18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
 

TheLearner

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And by "spirit-soul", you make no distinction between the two. OK, let's see how that lines up with Scripture:

1) At His death, Jesus "soul" went down to the grave, but His "spirit" returned up to the Father.

2) Scripture says it can divide the "soul" from the "spirit" as surely as a blade can divide marrow from joints.

3) God's "spirit" traveled from heaven to Adam's body on Earth before Adam became a living soul, and only after the union of God's spirit and Adam's body occurred did Adam become a living soul.

4) Job asks, after the Spirit returns to God and the body to dust, "Where is he?" -- "he" meaning, "the Soul". Surely, Job should know "where he is" if the Soul continued to exist, but "where is he?" is proof positive that the Soul has CEASED to exist.


There are other examples in Scripture which make the Soul and the Spirit distinct one from the other, so after reading these verses, can we really continue expressing things like "soul-spirit" as if they are the same?


The Old Testament. The Hebrew word so rendered is nepes [v,p,n]. It appears 755 times in the Old Testament. The King James Version uses 42 different English terms to translate it. The two most common renderings are "soul" (428 times) and "life" (117 times). It is the synchronic use of nepes [v,p,n] that determines its meaning rather than the diachronic. Hebrew is inclined to use one and the same word for a variety of functions that are labeled with distinct words in English.

Nepes [v,p,n] in the Old Testament is never the "immortal soul" but simply the life principle or living being. Such is observable in Genesis 1:20, 21, 24, where the qualified (living) nepes [v,p,n] refers to animals and is rendered "living creatures." The same Hebrew term is then applied to the creation of humankind in Genesis 2:7, where dust is vitalized by the breath of God and becomes a "living being." Thus, human being shares soul with the animals. It is the breath of God that makes the lifeless dust a "living being" — person.

Frequently in the Old Testament nepes [v,p,n] designates the individual ( Lev 17:10 ; 23:30 ). In its plural form it indicates a number of individuals such as Abraham's party ( Gen 12:5 ), the remnant left behind in Judah ( Jer 43:6 ), and the offspring of Leah ( Gen 46:15 ).

Nepes [v,p,n] qualified by "dead" means a dead individual, a corpse ( Num 6:6 ). More significant here is that nepes [v,p,n] can mean the corpse of an individual even without the qualification "dead" ( Num 5:2 ; 6:11 ). Here nepes [v,p,n] is detached from the concept of life and refers to the corpse. Hebrew thought could not conceive of a disembodied nepes [v,p,n].

Frequently nepes [v,p,n] takes the place of a personal or reflexive pronoun ( Psalm 54:4 ; Prov 18:7 ). Admittedly this movement from the nominal to the pronominal is without an exact borderline. The Revised Standard Version reflects the above understanding of nepes [v,p,n] by replacing the King James Version "soul" with such translations as "being, " "one, " "self, " "I/me."

Nepes [v,p,n] is also used to designate parts of the body, primarily to stress their characteristics and functions. It can refer to the throat ( Isa 5:14 ; Hab 2:5 ), noting that it can be parched and dry ( Num 11:6 ; Jeremiah 31:12 Jeremiah 31:25 ), discerning ( Prov 16:23 ), hungry ( Num 21:5 ), and breathing ( Jer 2:24 ). Nepes [v,p,n] also can mean the neck, and the vital function that takes place there, noting that it can be ensnared ( 1 Sam 28:9 ; Psalm 105:18 ), humbled and endangered ( Prov 18:7 ), and bowed to the ground ( Psalm 44:25 ). Even while focusing on a single part of the body, by synecodoche the whole person is represented.

Nepes [v,p,n] is often used to express physical needs such as hunger ( Deut 12:20 ; 1 Sam 2:16 ) and thirst ( Prov 25:25 ). It can be used of excessive desires (gluttony Prov 23:2 ) and of unfulfilled desires (barrenness 1 Sam 1:15 ). Volitional/spiritual yearning is also assigned to nepes [v,p,n], such as the desire for God ( Psalm 42:1-2 ), justice ( Isa 26:8-9 ), evil ( Prov 21:10 ), and political power ( 2 Sam 3:21 ). Emotions are expressed by nepes [v,p,n] so that it feels hate (so used of Yahweh Isa 1:14 ), grief ( Jer 13:17 ), joy and exultation, disquietude ( Psalm 42:5 ), and unhappiness ( 1 Sam 1:15 ).

Clearly, then, in the Old Testament a mortal is a living soul rather than having a soul. Instead of splitting a person into two or three parts, Hebrew thought sees a unified being, but one that is profoundly complex, a psychophysical being.

The New Testament. The counterpart to nepes [v,p,n] in the New Testament is psyche [yuchv] (nepes [v,p,n] is translated as psyche [yuchv] six hundred times in the Septaugint). Compared to nepes [v,p,n] in the Old Testament, psyche [yuchv] appears relatively infrequently in the New Testament. This may be due to the fact that nepes [v,p,n] is used extensively in poetic literature, which is more prevalent in the Old Testament than the New Testament. The Pauline Epistles concentrate more on soma [sw'ma] (body) and pneuma [pneu'ma] (spirit) than psyche [yuchv].

This word has a range of meanings similar to nepes [v,p,n]. It frequently designates life: one can risk his life ( John 13:37 ; Acts 15:26 ; Rom 16:4 ; Php 2:30 ), give his life ( Matt 20:28 ), lay down his life ( John 10:15 John 10:17-18 ), forfeit his life ( Matt 16:26 ), hate his life ( Luke 14:26 ), and have his life demanded of him ( Luke 12:20 ).

Psyche, as its Old Testament counterpart, can indicate the person ( Acts 2:41 ; 27:37 ). It also serves as the reflexive pronoun designating the self ("I'll say to myself" Luke 12:19 ; "as my witness" 2 Cor 1:23 ; "share our lives" 1 Thess 2:8 ).

Psyche can express emotions such as grief ( Matt 26:38, ; Mark 14:34 ), anguish ( John 12:27 ), exultation ( Luke 1:46 ), and pleasure ( Matt 12:18 ).

The adjectival form "soulish" indicates a person governed by the sensuous nature with subjection to appetite and passion. Such a person is "natural/unspiritual" and cannot receive the gifts of God's Spirit because they make no sense to him ( 1 Cor 2:14-15 ). As in the Old Testament, the soul relates humans to the animal world ( 1 Cor 15:42-50 ) while it is the spirit of people that allows a dynamic relationship with God.

There are passages where psyche [yuchv] stands in contrast to the body, and there it seems to refer to an immortal part of man. "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell" ( Matt 10:28 ). While Scripture generally addresses humans as unitary beings, there are such passages that seem to allow divisibility within unity.

Carl Schultz

See also Person, Personhood; Spirit

Bibliography. W. Dryness, Themes in Old Testament Theology; R. H. Gundry, Somma in Biblical Theology; R. Jewett, Paul's Anthropological Terms; N. Snaith, The Distinctive Ideas of the Old Testament; H. W. Wolff, Anthropology of the Old Testament.

Baker's Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology. Edited by Walter A. Elwell
Copyright © 1996 by Walter A. Elwell. Published by Baker Books, a division of
Baker Book House Company, Grand Rapids, Michigan USA.
All rights reserved. Used by permission.
For usage information, please read the Baker Book House Copyright Statement.

[N] indicates this entry was also found in Nave's Topical Bible
Bibliography Information
Elwell, Walter A. "Entry for 'Soul'". "Evangelical Dictionary of

It is my impression from above that spirit is the life force of humans. Soul is their real being.
 

TheLearner

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The vital existence of a human being. The Hebrew word nephesh is a key Old Testament term (755 times) referring to human beings. In the New Testament, the term psyche retreats behind the ideas of body, flesh, spirit to characterize human existence. In the Bible, a person is a unity. Body and soul or spirit are not opposite terms, but rather terms which supplement one another to describe aspects of the inseparable whole person. See Anthropology; Humanity .
Such a holistic image of a person is maintained also in the New Testament even over against the Greek culture which, since Plato, sharply separated body and soul with an analytic exactness and which saw the soul as the valuable, immortal, undying part of human beings. In the Old Testament, the use and variety of the word is much greater while in the New Testament its theological meaning appears much stronger.

The soul designates the physical life. Vitality in all of its breadth and width of meaning is meant by the soul. The basic meaning of nephesh is throat. Thus, the Bible refers to the hungry, thirsty, satisfied, soul ( Psalm 107:5 ,Psalms 107:5,107:9; Proverbs 27:7; Jeremiah 31:12 ,Jeremiah 31:12,31:25 ). The soul means the entire human being in its physical life needing food and clothing (Matthew 6:25 ). The breathing organs and the breath blown out from them also express individual life in animals as well as human beings (Job 11:20; Job 41:21; Acts 20:10 ). At times, then, soul can be interchanged with life (Proverbs 7:23; Proverbs 8:35-36 ) and can be identical with blood (Deuteronomy 12:23 ). A person does not have a soul. A person is a living soul (Genesis 2:7 ). That means a living being that owes life itself to the Creator just as does the animal (Genesis 2:19 ). For this life or soul, one gives all one has (Job 2:4 ). Satan is permitted by God to take health, that is flesh and blood, but Satan cannot take the bare life of a person (Job 2:5-6 ).

Soul designates the feelings, the wishes, and the will of humans. The work of the throat, its hunger and appetite, stands for the desire and the longing of the human being after power and sex, after satisfaction, and after even the evil (Proverbs 21:10 ), but also after God (Psalm 42:2-3 ). The soul can be incited, embittered, confirmed, unsettled, or kept in suspense (Acts 14:2 ,Acts 14:2,14:22; Acts 15:24; John 10:24 ). The word mirrors the entire scale of feelings under the influence of the human being, even the psychological. The bitter soul of the childless, the sick, or the threatened (1 Samuel 1:10; 2 Kings 4:27; 2 Samuel 17:8 ) reminds us of the nephesh as the organ of taste that also stands for the entire embittered person.

The soul also knows positive emotions. The soul rejoices, praises, hopes, and is patient. Never in these cases is only one part of the human being meant. It is always the powerful soul as an expression of the entire personality (Psalm 33:20 ). In the command to love (Deuteronomy 6:5; Mark 12:30 ), the soul stands next to other expressions for the human being to emphasize the emotional energy and willpower of the human being all rolled into one.

The soul designates the human person. Soul is not only a synonym with life. One can also speak of the life of the soul (Proverbs 3:22 ). Every human soul (Acts 2:43; Romans 2:9 ) means each individual person. The popular expression used today “to save our souls” goes back to this biblical way of thinking (1 Peter 3:20 ). It means to save the entire person. In legal texts, the soul is the individual person with juristic responsibilities (Leviticus 17:10 , a blood-eating soul). Connected with a figure showing statistics or numbers of people, soul becomes an idea in the arena of the statistician (Genesis 46:26-27; Acts 2:41 ). At times, soul simply replaces a preposition such as the expression “let my soul live,” which means “let me live” (1 Kings 20:32 ). It is even possible for all the nuances of meaning to sound forth together in the same expression. For instance, in Psalm 103:1 , we read, “Bless, Yahweh, O my soul.” This includes the throat as the organ of life, the soul as the totality of capabilities; my own personal life which experiences the saving actions of Yahweh our God; my person; my own “I”; and the vital, emotional self.

Soul designates the essential life. Physical life is given and maintained by God (Matthew 6:25-34 ). Meaningful and fulfilled life comes only when it is free to give itself to God as a disciple of Jesus Christ. Life is the highest good when it is lived according to God's intentions and not used up in search for material and cultural goods (Mark 8:34-37 ). This life is stronger than death and cannot be destroyed by human beings (Matthew 10:28 ). The soul does not, however, represent a divine, immortal, undying part of the human being after death as the Greeks often thought. Paul, thus, avoids the word soul in connection with eternal life. There is a continuity between the earthly and the resurrected life that does not lie in the capabilities or nature of mortal humans. It lies alone in the power of the Spirit of God (1 Corinthians 15:44 ). According to the Bible, a human being exists as a whole unit and remains also as a whole person in the hand of God after death. A person is not at any time viewed as a bodiless soul.
 

TheLearner

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I'd watch the video, friend. You can FF to 8:30 up to this point, it's just him explaining why it can only be a parable by pointing out the many Biblical contradictions which arise if we make the passage literal - backed up with lotsa Scripture.

8:30 is where he begins to show how the Bible itself interprets the parable, which is better than I could explain it. That guys a professional evangelist, while I'm a professional sinner trying to be saved by grace :)
I do not have speakers.
 

TheLearner

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New Advent is a Roman Catholic website, set up in part by Kevin Knight. I use it frequently to refute Catholics. For instance, on the state of the dead, that site says:

"...is the doctrine of spirituality. ... Dualism ... Plato ... Platonic Dualism ... " [Roman Catholic Online Encyclopedia; "S", "Soul"] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Soul - http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14153a.htm

"... For positive evidence, however, that the soul will continue after death in the possession of a conscious life, we must appeal to teleology and the consideration of the character of the universe as a whole. ..." [Roman Catholic Online Encyclopedia; "I"; "Immortality"] - CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Immortality -http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07687a.htm

You might have modern Jewish background (which is Talmudic Rabbinic Kabbalism - mostly, a few 'Torah only' types) but that doesn't mean you are in harmony with the OT, NT statements, who all disagree with an immortal soul/spirit position.
articles posted in upcoming posts for context.
 

TheLearner

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Jan 14, 2019
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Again, psychology shows that our volitions are free, and that the activity of free volition cannot be exerted by a material agent, or be intrinsically dependent on matter. If volition were thus intrinsically dependent on matter, all our acts of choice would be inexorably bound up with and predetermined by the physical changes in the organism. The soul is thus a simple or indivisible, substantial principle, intrinsically independent of matter. Not being composite, it is not liable to perish by corruption or internal dissolution nor by the destruction of the material principle with which it is united, since it is not intrinsically dependent on this latter being. If it perish at all, this must be by simple annihilation. But annihilation, like creation, pertains to God alone, for, as shown in natural theology, it can be effected only by the withdrawal of the Divine activity, through which all creatures are immediately conserved in existence. God could of course, by an exercise of His absolute power, reduce the soul to nothingness; but the nature of the soul is such that it cannot be destroyed by a finite being. For positive evidence, however, that the soul will continue after death in the possession of a conscious life, we must appeal to teleology and the consideration of the character of the universe as a whole. All science proceeds on the assumption that the universe is rational, that it is governed by reason, law, and uniformity throughout. Theistic philosophy explains, justifies, and confirms this postulate in establishing the government of the universe by the providence of an infinitely wise and just Creator. But the consideration of certain characteristics of the human mind reveals a purpose which can be realized only by the soul's continuing in the possession of a conscious life after death. Firstly, there is in the mind of man, as distinguished from all the lower animals, the capacity to look back to the indefinite past and forward to the distant future, the impulse to project itself in imagination beyond the limits of space and time, to rise to the conception of endless duration. There is an ever-increasing yearning for knowledge, a craving for an ever fuller possession of truth, which expands and grows with every advance of science. There is the character of unfinishedness in our mental life and development—the contrast between the capabilities of the human intellect and its present destiny, "between the immensity of man's outlook and the limitations of his actual horizon, between the splendour of his ideals and the insignificance of his attainments" (Marshall), which all demand a future existence unless the human mind is to be a wasteful failure.
https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07687a.htm


The question of the reality of the soul and its distinction from the body is among the most important problems of philosophy, for with it is bound up the doctrine of a future life. Various theories as to the nature of the soul have claimed to be reconcilable with the tenet of immortality, but it is a sure instinct that leads us to suspect every attack on the substantiality or spirituality of the soul as an assault on the belief in existence after death. The soul may be defined as the ultimate internal principle by which we think, feel, and will, and by which our bodies are animated. The term "mind" usually denotes this principle as the subject of our conscious states, while "soul" denotes the source of our vegetative activities as well. That our vital activities proceed from a principle capable of subsisting in itself, is the thesis of the substantiality of the soul: that this principle is not itself composite, extended, corporeal, or essentially and intrinsically dependent on the body, is the doctrine of spirituality. If there be a life after death, clearly the agent or subject of our vital activities must be capable of an existence separate from the body. The belief in an animating principle in some sense distinct from the body is an almost inevitable inference from the observed facts of life. Even uncivilized peoples arrive at the concept of the soul almost without reflection, certainly without any severe mental effort. The mysteries of birth and death, the lapse of conscious life during sleep and in swooning, even the commonest operations of imagination and memory, which abstract a man from his bodily presence even while awake—all such facts invincibly suggest the existence of something besides the visible organism, internal to it, but to a large extent independent of it, and leading a life of its own. In the rude psychology of the primitive nations, the soul is often represented as actually

https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14153a.htm
 
Feb 7, 2022
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Brother, I am still waiting for where Jesus explains Luke 16
Isaiah 28:10,13.

There are several places that Jesus gives a parable and does not immediately explain it to those he gave it to. The point was to "Mat 9:13: "But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance."
 
Aug 3, 2019
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Hell is currently in the heart of the earth. It sets fire to the foundations of the mountains. See Jonah. He went there and suffered affliction and was brought up.

Deuteronomy 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
Words mean things.

"Shall burn" and "shall consume" indicates a future event, specifically a fire that will burn up the Earth. That's why Jesus said "at the end of the world".

BTW, "our God is a consuming fire". The "fire of His anger" is kindled, but it's not burning the Earth yet. Do you know when it will?

"And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them " at the end of time, not right now.
 

John146

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Jan 13, 2016
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Words mean things.

"Shall burn" and "shall consume" indicates a future event, specifically a fire that will burn up the Earth. That's why Jesus said "at the end of the world".

BTW, "our God is a consuming fire". The "fire of His anger" is kindled, but it's not burning the Earth yet. Do you know when it will?

"And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them " at the end of time, not right now.
When you don’t take the bible literally, you can make it say anything you want.