Doctrine of Unconditional Election
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I don't see that interpretation as being a logical possibility from that verse. I think the verse is telling us that through Christ's successful offering (to include Calvary), amongst other things, God the Father gives faith to those whom He has chosen -- from, and because of that, is our faith given
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Calvinist talking point only.
You guys have a real knack for making up stuff.
Just think about all the different things you believe to be true. Now, how many of these things did you "have to manufacture belief" for them?
No one "manufactures" belief.
Belief comes in 2 ways. One way is by experience. If a parent tells their child that a red stove top is HOT, and the child doesn't trust what the parent says, and touches it themself, THEN they BELIEVE that the red stove top is HOT because they have experienced it.
However, if another parent tells their child that a red stove top is HOT and they have trust in their parent, they believe the red stove top is HOT because of their faith in their parent.
Yet, in NEITHER case does the child "have to manufacture belief". It comes NATURALLY, either by experience or trust/faith in what they were told.
So please quit making up so much stuff which isn't true.
You guys have a real knack for making up stuff.
Just think about all the different things you believe to be true. Now, how many of these things did you "have to manufacture belief" for them?
No one "manufactures" belief.
Belief comes in 2 ways. One way is by experience. If a parent tells their child that a red stove top is HOT, and the child doesn't trust what the parent says, and touches it themself, THEN they BELIEVE that the red stove top is HOT because they have experienced it.
However, if another parent tells their child that a red stove top is HOT and they have trust in their parent, they believe the red stove top is HOT because of their faith in their parent.
Yet, in NEITHER case does the child "have to manufacture belief". It comes NATURALLY, either by experience or trust/faith in what they were told.
So please quit making up so much stuff which isn't true.
-
1
- Show all
FreeGrace2 said:
You have a very unique way of comprehending things. The verse says that salvation is the gift, not God.
[Eph 2:8 KJV] 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
Well, that's NOT what you had said. But glad you're on board now.
No, you are very confused. The indwelling Holy Spirit is NOT "salvation". His indwelling is only for the saved to begin with.
Read and memorize Eph 1:13,14. You are conflating salvation with things that accompany salvation.
You have a very unique way of comprehending things. The verse says that salvation is the gift, not God.
[Eph 2:8 KJV] 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
Well, that's NOT what you had said. But glad you're on board now.
No, you are very confused. The indwelling Holy Spirit is NOT "salvation". His indwelling is only for the saved to begin with.
Read and memorize Eph 1:13,14. You are conflating salvation with things that accompany salvation.
-
1
- Show all
FreeGrace2 said:
justpassinthrough said:
If it’s not in scripture then where does it come from?
This illustrates how one who does NOT HAVE supportive Scripture answers. If the poster had supporting Scripture, this would have been the perfect opportunity to prove his claims.
What a dodge and smokescreen.
I challenged you to prove YOUR claim with evidence from Scripture. And all you can do is dodge the challenge. Which I figured you would do.
Otherwise, you would have easily showed any evidence you have.
justpassinthrough said:
If it’s not in scripture then where does it come from?
This illustrates how one who does NOT HAVE supportive Scripture answers. If the poster had supporting Scripture, this would have been the perfect opportunity to prove his claims.
What a dodge and smokescreen.
I challenged you to prove YOUR claim with evidence from Scripture. And all you can do is dodge the challenge. Which I figured you would do.
Otherwise, you would have easily showed any evidence you have.
It is just amazing how calvinists like to make up stuff; like "manufacturing faith by ourselves".
If your thoughts don't come from your own skull, where do your thoughts come from? Can you tell me?
If calvinists could understand Rom 2:14,15 and the function of the conscience, they wouldn't have to keep making up stuff.
Would you like to comment on these verses?
Matt 9:2 - Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”
Matt 9:22 - Jesus turned and saw her. “Take heart, daughter,” he said, “your faith has healed you.” And the woman was healed at that moment.
Matt 9:29 - Then he touched their eyes and said, “According to your faith let it be done to you”;
Mark 5:34 - He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be freed from your suffering.”
Mark 10:52 - “Go,” said Jesus, “your faith has healed you.” Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus along the road.
If your thoughts don't come from your own skull, where do your thoughts come from? Can you tell me?
If calvinists could understand Rom 2:14,15 and the function of the conscience, they wouldn't have to keep making up stuff.
Would you like to comment on these verses?
Matt 9:2 - Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”
Matt 9:22 - Jesus turned and saw her. “Take heart, daughter,” he said, “your faith has healed you.” And the woman was healed at that moment.
Matt 9:29 - Then he touched their eyes and said, “According to your faith let it be done to you”;
Mark 5:34 - He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be freed from your suffering.”
Mark 10:52 - “Go,” said Jesus, “your faith has healed you.” Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus along the road.
Yes, I can. Upon becoming born-again, with it, we are given a renewed mind. However, our faith is not the faith that saves us, Christ's faith is
[Eph 4:21-23 KJV]
21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; \
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
[Eph 4:21-23 KJV]
21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; \
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Our faith in Christ make us the children of God Gal. 3:26. The Colossian believers have their faith in Christ Jesus Col. 1:4. The pattern according to Paul in obtaining this mercy and grace should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting 1 tim.1:16. Whose faith is that Paul speaking of? Yes, all those who will believe.
-
1
- Show all
FreeGrace2 said:
If your thoughts don't come from your own skull, where do your thoughts come from? Can you tell me?
Doesn't address my question. I asked where your thoughts come from if NOT from your own skull. You didn't address that.
Whether born again or not, all people have thoughts. If not from within your skull, where do they come from?
Isn't related to my question.
If your thoughts don't come from your own skull, where do your thoughts come from? Can you tell me?
Doesn't address my question. I asked where your thoughts come from if NOT from your own skull. You didn't address that.
Whether born again or not, all people have thoughts. If not from within your skull, where do they come from?
Isn't related to my question.
-
1
- Show all
Actually, it is not "hearing the word of God", it is "hearing BY the word of God". Nevertheless, what is significant is not that it is our faith saves, instead, it is Christ's faith alone that saves.
[Mat 13:15-16 KJV]
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and [their] ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with [their] eyes, and hear with [their] ears, and should understand with [their] heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed [are] your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
[Mat 13:15-16 KJV]
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and [their] ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with [their] eyes, and hear with [their] ears, and should understand with [their] heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed [are] your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.