The False Teaching (& Truth) of what happens at the Rapture.

[TheLordIsMyRedeemer]

FreeGrace2 said:

I’’m still waiting for a verse showing Jesus taking glorified believers to heaven.

You believe He will, but you haven't YET provided a verse that shows this.

Rev 12:5 -
English Standard Version
She gave birth to a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne,

You got all that from just this verse? Well, quite an imagination, at least.

The verse speaks of Jesus Christ, who WILL rule of the nations with a rod of iron. Being "caught up to God" is a reference to His own ascension.

The child does NOT "represent living believers" at all. He is Jesus Christ.

You are terribly misunderstanding "but her child was caught up to God and to His throne". A mother's child can be 33 yrs old. The verse notes Jesus' ascension. Nothing more.

It’s my view that the vision of Revelation 12 speaks of a future event as John hears is Rev. 4:1 "Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this." I don’t see it as referring to the Lord’s ascension which was a gradual ascending into a cloud, not a forcible ‘catching away.’

“And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, so that when she bore her child (‘teknon’) he might devour it. She gave birth to a male child (“huios arsen”), one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child (‘teknon’) was caught up to God and to His throne.”

The ‘child’ or ‘teknon’ is the one who is caught up. The ‘huios arsen,” is Jesus the Son who is not ‘caught up.’

The word ‘but’ demonstrates the fact these are two different entities. The ‘huios arsen’ is layered over the ‘teknon’ because they are also meant to be thought of as one entity.

The 24 Elders act as priests by offering ‘golden bowls’ which are the prayers of saints on earth (Rev 5:6-10). Jesus is “in the midst” of His people and exists in unity with believers. We are joint heirs who are qualified to rule as kings with Him and to act on His behalf as priests before God.

One of the reasons for the rapture is so the believers can assist Christ in his Priestly duties so He can take the scroll and begin His judgment on earth.

 

[kleronomos]

IT IS WRITTEN

Genesis 2:16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.


Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman,

Yea, hath God said, (AND HERE COMES THE TWIST)

Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

ITS KINDA THE SAME IT

EVEN ALMOST SOUNDS THE SAME

IF YOU WEREN'T REALLY GIVING IT MUCH THOUGHT, IT MIGHT GO OVER YOUR HEAD THAT IT HAD BEEN CHANGED.


SO WHAT HAVE WE LEARNED? WHAT IS THE VERY FIRST LESSON GOD TEACHES US?

WHEN WE CHANGE WHAT IS WRITTEN TO OUR OWN WORDS TO MAKE THEM FIT OUR OWN AGENDA

WE ARE DOING EXACTLY WHAT SATAN DOES WITH THE WORDS OF GOD.


When asked TIME AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN FOR WHERE 'IT IS WRITTEN' and IT IS NEVER PRODUCED, BUT instead is met with more of pushing of the same agenda

take note.

and when what is given is OBVIOUSLY not even close to what is claimed.

HEED THE FIRST WARNING CHRIST GAVE US FOR THE END TIMES DO NOT BE DECEIVED


HERE IS WHAT GOD SAYS ABOUT all this
GOD SPEAKS AGAINST THOSE WHO PROPHESY OUT OF THEIR OWN selves

6 They have seen vanity and lying divination, saying, The LORD saith: and the LORD hath not sent them: and they have made others to hope that they would confirm the word.

7 Have ye not seen a vain vision, and have ye not spoken a lying divination whereas

YE SAY THE LORD SAITH IT

albeit I have not spoken?

8 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because ye have spoken vanity, and seen lies, therefore, behold, I am against you, saith the Lord GOD.

9 And mine hand shall be upon the prophets that see vanity, and that divine lies: they shall not be in the assembly of my people, neither shall they be written in the writing of the house of Israel, neither shall they enter into the land of Israel; and ye shall know that I am the Lord GOD.

WHEN A DOCTRINE NOT ONLY STARTS OFF WITH 'HATH GOD SAID' AND THEN IS FOLLOWED UP WITH WORDS OF THEIR OWN MAKING AND BACKING IT UP WITH LACK OF 'IT IS WRITTEN'

MARK THAT DOCTINE AS NOT OF GOD BECAUSE AS YOU CAN SEE HERE, THAT IS EXACTLY HOW SATAN HANDLES THE WORDS OF GOD. NO RESPECT FOR WHAT IS WRITTEN.

Genesis 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

Genesis 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

WHEN A DOCTRINE CALLS ITSELF 'APOSTASY', run AND TAKE THAT AS TRUTH.

WHAT CHRISTIAN COULD BE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT?


EXAMPLES OF WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE IN OUR DAY? THESE ARE SOME VERSES GIVEN FOR 'PRE TRIB'

IT IS WRITTEN
Acts 3:18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.

Acts 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

Acts 3:20 And He shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you

Acts 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

HATH GOD SAID?
AND SO I TAKE MY CHURCH TO HEAVEN FOR 7 YEARS PREVIOUS TO THE END OF THE RACE? NOT EVEN IN THE BALL PARK


AGAIN,
1Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him.

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

1Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

HATH GOD SAID? AND THEN I WILL TAKE YOU TO HEAVEN? ONCE AGAIN NOT EVEN IN THE BALL PARK. A CLASSIC EXAMPLE OF TOSSING OUT WHAT IS WRITTEN FOR HATH GOD SAID? ASSIGNING WHAT FITS THEIR OWN AGENDA WITH COMPLETE DISREGARD TO GODS.



WHAT ABOUT WHEN ALL COMMON SENSE SCREAMS AT YOU 'GOD WOULD NEVER DO THAT'?

Revelation 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

WATCH CLOSELY THIS WE'VE BEEN TOLD IS THE CHOICE 4 'THE BRIDE OF HIS SON'
WITHOUT ANY SORT OF PROVING AT ALL RIGHT AFTER THE ASSESSMENT

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Revelation 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

(BUT WITHOUT ALL OF THAT PART ONLY SOME)

Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

NOT THE OVERCOMING AS CHRIST DID, JUST THE SIT ON THE THRONE PART.

Revelation 3:22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

DON'T BELIEVE IT.

IF ANYONE SAYS TO YOU LO THERE IS CHRIST AND THEY SAY HE IS COMING TO GATHER YOU TO TAKE YOU TO HEAVEN AND THEN BRING YOU BACK

ASK TO SEE WHERE IT IS WRITTEN IF THEY DON'T PRODUCE A CHAPTER AND A VERSE OR TWO, THEN KNOW IT IS A LIE. AND TELL EVERYONE YOU KNOW IT IS A LIE SO IT WILL QUIT BEING PUT FORTH AS GODS TRUTH WHEN IT IS NOT.

HOW DID JESUS CONTEND WITH SATAN? THIS IS A GREAT EXAMPLE FOR US ALL. BUT YOU WILL SEE 'SATAN' IS INFINITELY MORE WISE.


Matthew 4:3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.

Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Matthew 4:5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

Matthew 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Matthew 4:7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

Matthew 4:9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

Matthew 4:10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

Matthew 4:11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.


DID YOU CATCH THE LIE?

 

[kleronomos]

“And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, so that when she bore her child (‘teknon’) he might devour it. She gave birth to a male child (“huios arsen”), one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child (‘teknon’) was caught up to God and to His throne.”

The ‘child’ or ‘teknon’ is the one who is caught up. The ‘huios arsen,” is Jesus the Son who is not ‘caught up.’

The word ‘but’ demonstrates the fact these are two different entities. The ‘huios arsen’ is layered over the ‘teknon’ because they are also meant to be thought of as one entity.

First I went to the Greek to see what order and words they used there, then I checked out the interlinear and checked out what they had to say there and then the lexicon and not one of those used this word you are saying MAKES ALL THE DIFFERENCE. Could you please explain how we are seeing two completely different things here?

As in NO BUT just ands and so none of them have this separation you are pointing out. Where are you getting your information from, if I might ask?

And she brought forth a son, male who is about to rule all the nations with a rod of iron and was caught up the child of her to God and to the throne of Him.

and they all have 'caught up'


5207. huios ►
Strong's Concordance
huios: a son
Original Word: υἱός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: huios
Phonetic Spelling: (hwee-os')
Definition: a son
Usage: a son, descendent.
HELPS Word-studies
5207 hyiós – properly, a son (by birth or adoption); (figuratively) anyone sharing the same nature as their Father. For the believer, becoming a son of God begins with being reborn (adopted) by the heavenly Father – through Christ (the work of the eternal Son). In the NT, 5207 /hyiós ("son") equally refers to female believers (Gal 3:28).

5207 /hyiós ("son") emphasizes likeness of the believer to the heavenly Father, i.e. resembling His character more and more by living in faith ("God's inwrought persuasons," see 4102 /pístis).

5207 /hyiós ("son") highlights the (legal) right to the Father's inheritance, i.e. as the believer lives in conformity with the Father's nature (purpose).


730. arrén ►
Strong's Concordance
arrén: male, man.
Original Word: ἄρσην, ενος, εν
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: arrén
Phonetic Spelling: (ar'-hrane)
Definition: male, man
Usage: male.


726. harpazó ►
Strong's Concordance
harpazó: to seize, catch up, snatch away
Original Word: ἁρπάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: harpazó
Phonetic Spelling: (har-pad'-zo)
Definition: to seize, catch up, snatch away
Usage: I seize, snatch, obtain by robbery.
HELPS Word-studies
726 harpázō – properly, seize by force; snatch up, suddenly and decisively – like someone seizing bounty (spoil, a prize); to take by an open display of force (i.e. not covertly or secretly).


5043. teknon ►
Strong's Concordance
teknon: a child (of either sex)
Original Word: τέκνον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: teknon
Phonetic Spelling: (tek'-non)
Definition: a child (of either sex)
Usage: a child, descendent, inhabitant.
HELPS Word-studies
5043 téknon – properly, a child; (figuratively) anyone living in full dependence on the heavenly Father, i.e. fully (willingly) relying upon the Lord in glad submission. This prompts God to transform them into His likeness.

5043 /téknon ("a child living in willing dependence") illustrates how we must all live in utter dependence upon the Lord (moment-by-moment), drawing guidance (care, nurture) from our heavenly Father. 5043 (téknon) emphasizes the childlike (not childish) attitude of heart that willingly (gladly) submits to the Father's plan. We profoundly learn this as we are receptive to Christ speaking His rhēma-word within to impart faith (cf. Ro 8:16,17 with Ro 10:17, Gk text).

I really like that

 

[kleronomos]

So it is that when the Lord Jesus is sent from heaven to gather His Body they are caught away to the third heaven where they will rule on the Lord`s own throne. (1 Thess. 4: 11 - 17, Rev. 3: 21)

Pure imagination as none of those verses even come close to speaking on what you are divining them to say.

 

[Absolutely]

IN POST #2,124

YOU WROTE THE ABOVE

"I have no idea how you can not recognize the 144k IN HEAVEN DURING THE TRIB., and not ask " how did they get there"?

SO I AM ASKING YOU

HOW DID THEY GET THERE?

A few possibilities would be a rapture
Or a martyrdom/Resurrection and rapture.

I just read what is there. We can speculate on the omissions.

 

[Absolutely]

kleronomos said:
Is this an accurate description of how JESUS sees the Bride?


thou hast left thy first love do the first works or else I will come unto thee quickly and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate Repent or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication and she repented not Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds And I will kill her children with death and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked

Absolutely answers with
nope.
The parable of the virgins.
Try it

Don't magnify it in omission.
That is deception.

and with when restated asking 'do you see the disconnect'? RECEIVE

Lol
You asked a yes or no question.
I said " nope"

Then you start chastising.


I'll do no more. Have a good life.

You can not go toe to toe.

That is the issue.
I been around a lot longer than you, been in the bible longer and places in it you never heard of

 

[Marilyn]

Pure imagination as none of those verses even come close to speaking on what you are divining them to say.

Easy to say but harder to prove from scripture. We have to work to rightly divide the word of God.

`Be diligent to present yourself approved of God, a worker who doe not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of God. But shun profane and vain babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness.` (2 Tim. 2: 14 & 15)

 

[Marilyn]

FreeGrace2 said:
Bottom line: 1 Cor 15:23 shows that "those who belong to Him" will be resurrected "when He comes".

What does this verse say to you?

So then, you limit the phrase as only referring to living believers when the Second Advent occurs? I'm not clear. All the believers already in heaven are also 'eagerly waiting for Him' to give them glorified bodies as well. If you are leaving them out of the equation, why? If you do include them, then you are agreeing with me that the phrase "those who belong to Him" refer to all believers throughout the ages. Right?


I don't what you point is in the first sentence. The second sentence simply refers to the Millennial reign. iow, at the end of the Millennial reign, per Rev 20, Satan is released to deceive the nations again, and then Jesus destroys them all at once, with Satan being cast into the LoF, to join the beast and FP who were cast in there at the end of the battle of Armageddon.

So v.25 has no bearing on who the ones referred to in the phrase "those who belong to Him" are.

Yes those who belong to the Lord when He comes (with those asleep in Him) are all who go to His own throne. (Rev.3: 21) Others who turn to God during the trib, and millennium have a different inheritance - the earth. (Rev. 21: 24)

 

[Marilyn]

FreeGrace2 said:
Doesn't help. You added "over time" in your 'reding' of v.23. But that's not what the verse says.

It says plainly that "when He comes" THEN "those who belong to Him".

So, ALL believers from all time (Adam on) will be resurrrected "when He comes".

I asked in my previous response, how many times do you think Jesus "comes"?

How do you know there will be "those who belong to Him" during the Millennium? iow, where does the Bible indicate that there will be people coming to faith during the Millennium?Jesus comes to the air, then later He comes to the earth. That makes twice.
Nope. He comes once more. His First Advent was as a baby, to become the Suffering Servant. His Second Advent is when He comes back as King of kings and Lord of lords.

Fact: many OT leaders thought there were 2 Messiahs, from their reading of Scripture. A "lesser" and a "greater" Messiah. The lesser was the suffering servant who served the greater Messiah, the King of the Jews. Obviously they were sadly mistaken. What they were reading was about Jesus' TWO Advents.

So, there are only 2 "comings" of the Lord. One has already occurred and there will be ONE more, at the Second Advent.

Here's a verse that supports this:

Acts 3:21 -
New International Version
Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

The previous edition of the NIV says "He must remain in heaven until the time comes..."

Here are some more translations:

New Living Translation
For he must remain in heaven until the time for the final restoration of all things, as God promised long ago through his holy prophets.
Berean Study Bible
Heaven must take Him in until the time comes for the restoration of all things, which God announced long ago through His holy prophets.
Amplified Bible
whom heaven must keep until the time for the [complete] restoration of all things about which God promised through the mouth of His holy prophets from ancient time.
Contemporary English Version
But Jesus must stay in heaven until God makes all things new, just as his holy prophets promised long ago
Good News Translation
He must remain in heaven until the time comes for all things to be made new, as God announced through his holy prophets of long ago.
International Standard Version
He must remain in heaven until the time of universal restitution, which God announced long ago through the voice of his holy prophets.

Yes, I know many of these are paraphrased translations. However, in my lexicon, the Greek word for "receive" means "to retain, contain", so "remain" is a legitimate translation.

So, heaven will retain and contain Jesus "until the time comes for God to restore all things".

This verse prevents any notion of a pretrib trip to "the clouds" to gather believers, give them glorified bodies and take them all back to heaven.

Just saying.

God`s hand is not so short that he cannot save people in the millennium. Look at the prophet Micah. Many nations will go up to Jerusalem and learn the ways of the Lord. (Micah 4: 1 - 4)

Scripture does NOT say that all people from Adam will get resurrected when He comes. Those OT saints in Heb. 11 are waiting for the city. That is their inheritance. When the city comes down then they will receive what God has promised. And that is NHNE.

And those great scriptures you quoted Acts 3: 20 & 21 reveal the timing of when the Lord comes and why. It is the beginning of the restoration that the OT prophets talked about. And what was that?

The kingpriest position in the angelic realm became vacant when Lucifer (appointed kingpriest) was cast out. There has never been another kingpriest in the angelic realm. We know that Jesus is on His Father`s throne at the moment. However when the Father sends Jesus then it is time for that rulership in the angelic realm.

`I have set my king on my holy hill of Mount Zion.` (Ps. 2: 6)
`You have come to Mount Zion...angels,....God.....Jesus...` (Heb. 12: 22 - 24)

And with the Lord Jesus is His Body. That is who He comes for when the Father sends Him. Together the glorified Lord and His Body will rule and reign over all of God`s great kingdom, under the Father.

 

[Marilyn]

Pure imagination as none of those verses even come close to speaking on what you are divining them to say.

Again easy to say but harder to prove by rightly dividing the word of truth as we are asked to do. (2 Tim. : 15 & 16)

 

[Absolutely]

IN POST #2,124

YOU WROTE THE ABOVE

"I have no idea how you can not recognize the 144k IN HEAVEN DURING THE TRIB., and not ask " how did they get there"?

SO I AM ASKING YOU

HOW DID THEY GET THERE?

I asked you how they got there.

Your reply is " how did they get there?"

Playing little games huh?

 

[Absolutely]

kleronomos said:
Is this an accurate description of how JESUS sees the Bride?


thou hast left thy first love do the first works or else I will come unto thee quickly and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate Repent or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication and she repented not Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds And I will kill her children with death and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked

Absolutely answers with
nope.
The parable of the virgins.
Try it

Don't magnify it in omission.
That is deception.

and with when restated asking 'do you see the disconnect'? RECEIVE

Lol
You asked a yes or no question.
I said " nope"

Then you start chastising.


I'll do no more. Have a good life.

"""I'll do no more."""

you never did address any verses i posted in context or intelligently.

comical

 

[Absolutely]

The Process of the Lord putting down all Rebellious Rulership - rule, authority and power.

`Then come the END.....` (Gk. `telos` meaning to set out for a definite point or goal).

`For He must reign TILL.. He has put all enemies under His feet.` (all rule and authority and power) (1 Cor. 15: 24 & 25)

Thus we see that it is over a period of time as the Lord puts down all rebellious rulership. Let`s have a look at this in detail.

The Lord takes up His executive authority and begins judgment of all rule, authority and power opposed to Him.

1.Judgment of the northern armies. (Ez. 38: 4, 15 & 16, 22)

2.Further Judgment of Satan and fallen angels. (Rev. 12: 9)

3.Judgment of religious Babylon. (Rev. 17: 16 & 17)

4.Judgment of economic Babylon. (Rev. 18: 8)

5. Judgment of the World`s cities. (Rev. 16: 17 & 18)

6.Judgment of the world`s armies & further judgment of Satan. (Rev. 19: 15 & 20, 20: 1 - 3)

7.Judgment of the nations. (Matt. 25: 31 - 46)

8.Judgment of the nations not going up to Jerusalem. (Zech. 14: 18)

9.Judgment of those nations surrounding Jerusalem & the devil. (Rev. 20: 9)

10.The Great White Throne Judgment of those from the grave. (Rev.20: 11 - 15)

i would say so.

 

[Absolutely]

Why don't you just knock off your childish condescension if you really want to discuss anything.


Sure. So what? I think any reasonable and rational person would easily agree. It was your ridiculous question that I wasn't going to try to answer.


What is clear to me is that since there was a meal at Simon's home, reasonable and rational people would understand that he had been healed by Jesus before that dinner. But so what? That is obvious.

Where is the "obvious evidence" that Jesus takes glorified believers to heaven?

I'm guessing you must think that since Simon was obviously heals of leprosy before the dinner is somehow equal to the supposed "obvious fact" that Jesus takes glorified believers to heaven.

Sorry, that doesn't fly.

You're trying to connect that dots that aren't there. kinda like seeing spots before your eyes. Your eyes have a problem if you do see spots floating around.

The sad fact is that you are so self convinced by a theory that you believe it IN SPITE of the lack of evidence. So you grab at straws.

I think what he is pointing out is that the obvious is absent in your "reasoning" elsewhere.

"""Show me where any resurrected believers are taken to heaven"""

We show you....to no avail.
Waste if time

 

[Absolutely]

There is an artful quality of thinking aligned to the mideastern mindset required to understand Scripture. Deduction is an inevitable part of it. So is detecting forms and detecting patterns. And much much more.....

Unfortunately, you don't have it. That's why you don't get it.
You - just - don't - get - it.....

.....and apparently does not care.

One thing he does know is that he hates the pretrib rapture doctrine.

 

[Absolutely]

Wow. Some real honesty here. Yes, indeed. Omission IS your friend and you DO USE IT all.

Oh yeah.
Omitting false assertions is definitely my friend.
Here is the context, you.....of course omitted... In my unpacking the virgins parable lol;

""""Lets take a REASONABLE view of it.
Since you are omission centered, lets look at what is omitted.
1) no destroyed earth
2) no slaughter of the earths inhabitants
3) no mark of the beast on any virgins or eben mentioned
4) no horse for the groom
5) no antichrist army
6)) no return to earth (the dwelling of the virgins).
7) Jesus takes them, NOT INTO BATTLE, BUT DIRECTLY TO THR MARRIAGE CHAMBER AND SHUTS THE DOOR.""""

Again postrib error is omitting truth.
I omit what you erroneously NEED to reframe the Word of God to fit your doctrine.

Acts one1
"Like manner"

Another example of the things YOU must ADD to it , to make it fit the white horses coming.

Of course omitting your false mess is my friend

 

[Absolutely]

kleronomos said:
How about trying to teach just one thing

Oh wow. Great! How about a verse showing Jesus taking glorified believers to heaven?

Can you post a clear or VERY clear verse that shows this?

Plain ignorant.
Stuck on Simon the leper huh?

"""C'mon, show me he wasnt still a leper"""
Nah, if you think he still was, then go for it.

SMH

 

[Absolutely]

so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.



Are you saying that SATAN IS COMING AND CLAIMING TO BE SATAN?

He is here now.

The ac is not.
Or at least if he is , he is not revealed.

Get it?

Get what "revealed" means?

 

[Absolutely]

Doesn't help. You added "over time" in your 'reding' of v.23. But that's not what the verse says.

It says plainly that "when He comes" THEN "those who belong to Him".

So, ALL believers from all time (Adam on) will be resurrrected "when He comes".

I asked in my previous response, how many times do you think Jesus "comes"?

You were already shown 3 comings.

More stuff for you to omit huh?

 

[Absolutely]

FreeGrace2 said:
Bottom line: 1 Cor 15:23 shows that "those who belong to Him" will be resurrected "when He comes".

What does this verse say to you?

OK.



The words "over time" do not occur in the text, and aren't even in the concept of the text. So you're adding to what the Word says.

I was interested in what v.23 says to you. The verse plainly says makes the point that "when He comes" THEN "those who belong to Him" will be resurrected.

Do you think that Jesus comes to earth "over time"?

Good point.
The earth's gathering will take time.

Once again, a pretrib rapture power point.
Pointed out by a omission centered person.
Ironic.