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kaylagrl
Guest
Olive, your ascertation that Jews think that Jesus was a prophet is plain wrong. The Jews of Jesus time thought that Jesus was a fraud/liar/blasphemer/charlatan. In no way did they think of Him as a prophet. And today's Jews have the same viewpoints about Jesus. Jews don't believe that Jesus was a prophet.
Jews knew to be looking for The MESSIAH at the right time. https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/eastman_mark/messiah/sfm_06.cfm
Pretty sure they pieced It together after JESUS told them their City was going to be destroyed.
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kaylagrl
Guest
That's not entirely true. Some of the Jews didn't believe Jesus was who He said he was, mainly the high priests. But Jesus first followers were Jews.
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kaylagrl
Guest
It is true that Jesus' first followers were Jews, Jesus Himself was a Jew and practiced the Jewish religion and it's traditions. But the Jews who followed Jesus saw their religious beliefs fulfilled and became Christian. Gentiles would follow suit. But, in fact,, most Jews of Jesus' time did not become Christian and those that didn't were massacred or dispersed by the Romans in the year 70AD, The great majority of Jews at that time didn't believe in Jesus as God or prophet, only as a faker and evil man.
The reasons that the Jewish hierarch hated Jesus were because they thought He was a blasphemer, and they were afraid of losing their secular and religious power over the Jewish people. And they were jealous of Jesus.
In fact, at the time of Jesus' crucifixion there were very few who supported Jesus as Messiah or prophet. At the crucifixion, the Jews abandoned Jesus enmasse. It was the Jewish crowds that demanded His death. And the Jewish mob cried out to let His blood be on us and on our children.
Today, the Muslims hold a higher esteem for Jesus than today's Jews do. The Muslims view Jesus as a holy prophet from God while today's Jews still think of Jesus as an evil fraud and deceiver. And granted, there a very small % of Messianic Jews today who do follow Jesus and believe He is the Messiah.
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kaylagrl
Guest
The first followers of Jesus were Jews, that was my point. Yes, some turned away at the cross, and others remained faithful.
The Muslims believe Jesus was a prophet. They are lost as can be. Jews are blinded for a time. Neither are saved.
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Oblio
Guest
Despite the fact that I've said that more Jews have come to Christ in the past 20 years that in the 2,000 years prior to that, people keep insisting that the Jews continue to reject Christ.
As I said before, anti-semitism is alive and well in the church. Why do people continue to make excuses not to love this group of people? Instead of rejoicing at the salvations, I hear about things like the Talmud. I hear it on a half-dozen forums too!
Historically, the church has had a large anti-Jew sentiment. Many Christians follow Shepherd's Chapel, even though they teach that the Jews in today's Israel were fathered by Satan. Then there's the C.I. groups. I'm just appalled that so many Christians can still be racist.
As I said before, anti-semitism is alive and well in the church. Why do people continue to make excuses not to love this group of people? Instead of rejoicing at the salvations, I hear about things like the Talmud. I hear it on a half-dozen forums too!
Historically, the church has had a large anti-Jew sentiment. Many Christians follow Shepherd's Chapel, even though they teach that the Jews in today's Israel were fathered by Satan. Then there's the C.I. groups. I'm just appalled that so many Christians can still be racist.
2 Corinthians 3 12-18: Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
Blindness is cured by faith in Christ.....
Remember when Paul was to be converted he was stricken blind. Its an example.....a man that waged war against Christianity changed by faith in Christ.
Blindness is cured by faith in Christ.....
Remember when Paul was to be converted he was stricken blind. Its an example.....a man that waged war against Christianity changed by faith in Christ.
Sadly this blindness is compounded by the false teaching of the talmud and the massive athiest population in Israel among the Jews. But only god knows what degree the heart of the unbeliever is hardened. Like I said a few days ago they need the gospel today.
Romans 1 16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Wow, I see that you are judging and even damning other, both Jews and Muslims. Step back and let Jesus do the judging and damning. For, if in fact you are judging and damning others you are surely judging yourself.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Every single one of us was lost in sin until we came to faith in Christ. I'm not "judging" either, they are lost until they come to faith. That's what the Word says. I did not say they eternally lost. My sister made a trip to the mission fields and she said missionaries are seeing Muslims coming out of that false religion because they are having dreams about Christ and they are seeking the truth. The same is happening for the Jews on a limited scale until God lifts their blindness from them. Please ask for further explanation before you jump to conclusions.
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kaylagrl
Guest
I haven't heard of either of these groups, but I agree it is appalling that there is so much racism/ antisemitism in the church, of all places. It grieves the heart of God.
In fact, the Talmud is part of the Torah, the Jewish Holy Scriptures. The Talmud is part of the Torah today. Ant the Talmud teaches the following about Jesus:
- The Talmud teaches that Jesus Christ was illegitimate, conceived during menstruation.
- It calls the son of God a fool and insane, a conjurer and seducer.
- It says that he was crucified and thrown in a dirt heap like a dog and that he was set up as an idol by his followers.
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Oblio
Guest
We're to love all people, right? Many Jews still believe that the messiah is coming, but more and more say, "He is here, in my heart!"
This puts a smile on my face.
This puts a smile on my face.
It sure does.
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Oblio
Guest
The Torah is the Pentateuch, the first 5 books of the bible. The Talmud is not the bible, though there is scripture in it.
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Oblio
Guest
We have a Messianic Jewish Rabbi as a member here on Christian Chat. I enjoy his teaching. This is his latest:
A look at Isaiah 6:1-7:6; and Matt 27:1-28:20
A look at Isaiah 6:1-7:6; and Matt 27:1-28:20
The Jewish belief is that Moses received the Torah as a written text alongside a commentary: the Talmud. The Talmud is considered the oral traditions that coincide with the Torah. It is a depiction of the primary codification of the Jewish decrees. It explains the written texts of the Torah so that people know how to apply it to their lives.
Oblio, you are correct when you say that the Talmud is not part of the Torah. Yet the Jewish faith considers both to be scriptural.