How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

[Charlie24]

The rain is NOT the beginning of Trouble - this is ignorance of Scripture

Genesis tells us exactly when the Beginning of Trouble/Tribulation Began.

Genesis tells us it Began in the Garden.

Genesis also tells us when the great tribulation specifically began for Noah and the world.

One of the problems I have pointed out in the post-trib theory is that the one resurrection does not provide for the repopulation during the 1000 year reign of Christ. Not much has been said of this!

I want to now show why this mistake is made. This view, the post-trib view, does not recognize the separation of the Church and Israel in God's plan. God sent Christ to the Jews, they were chosen to bring the world (Gentiles) to Christ. Of course God knew they would fail and reject their Messiah, so He had already made plans from before the foundation of the world to put His chosen (Israel) on the back burner so to speak, and make His second choice for the Church to bring Christ to the world.

What we are failing to see here is that the Church is SECOND CHOICE! Paul plainly told us that God has not repented of choosing Israel and He will make His promises good to Abraham through his descendants in Christ.

So the plan of God is laid out! The rapture of the Church is the taking out of the way of those who have been brought to Christ. And now God is dealing directly with Israel, to bring them to Christ during the tribulation. As God deals with Israel during this time, He also deals with the rest of the world who are in the same place as Israel, unbelief.

When we come to the point of realizing this we can see that one resurrection in the end is in no way going fulfill God's plan for both the Church and Israel.

 

[DavidTree]

One of the problems I have pointed out in the post-trib theory is that the one resurrection does not provide for the repopulation during the 1000 year reign of Christ. Not much has been said of this!

I want to now show why this mistake is made. This view, the post-trib view, does not recognize the separation of the Church and Israel in God's plan. God sent Christ to the Jews, they were chosen to bring the world (Gentiles) to Christ. Of course God knew they would fail and reject their Messiah, so He had already made plans from before the foundation of the world to put His chosen (Israel) on the back burner so to speak, and make His second choice for the Church to bring Christ to the world.

What we are failing to see here is that the Church is SECOND CHOICE! Paul plainly told us that God has not repented of choosing Israel and He will make His promises good to Abraham through his descendants in Christ.

So the plan of God is laid out! The rapture of the Church is the taking out of the way of those who have been brought to Christ. And now God is dealing directly with Israel, to bring them to Christ during the tribulation. As God deals with Israel during this time, He also deals with the rest of the world who are in the same place as Israel, unbelief.

When we come to the point of realizing this we can see that one resurrection in the end is in no way going fulfill God's plan for both the Church and Israel.

Separating Jew from Gentile is sin, Dear Brother, stay far away from that sin for God hates it.
“For I hate divorce!” says the LORD, the God of Israel.

It is Written: "What God has joined together let no man separate"

Do not add to His words with 'pre-trib' lies Dear Brother.

i warn everyone that 'pre-trib rapture' is a lie - for it never came out of the Mouth of God.

This is why i offer a $1,000 Reward for anyone to find where God said: "I will pre-trib rapture My Church/Elect/Saints".

Instead of the error of "pre-trib" we SEE Christ saying: "Immediately AFTER the Tribulation..........I COME" - Matt ch24

As Children of God we must receive these words of our LORD and embrace them and hide them in our heart.

WARNING: the error of pre-trib is a cascade of lies that does not stop - reject it.

 

[Charlie24]

Separating Jew from Gentile is sin, Dear Brother, stay far away from that sin for God hates it.
“For I hate divorce!” says the LORD, the God of Israel.

It is Written: "What God has joined together let no man separate"

Do not add to His words with 'pre-trib' lies Dear Brother.

i warn everyone that 'pre-trib rapture' is a lie - for it never came out of the Mouth of God.

This is why i offer a $1,000 Reward for anyone to find where God said: "I will pre-trib rapture My Church/Elect/Saints".

Instead of the error of "pre-trib" we SEE Christ saying: "Immediately AFTER the Tribulation..........I COME" - Matt ch24

As Children of God we must receive these words of our LORD and embrace them and hide them in our heart.

WARNING: the error of pre-trib is a cascade of lies that do not stop - reject it.

No now David, you are taking what said on the wrong path!

The separation of Israel and Church is obviously seen in scripture as to the way He is dealing with them vs. the Church.

Now, let's not take the wrong the path with this!

 

[Rondonmon]

The rain is NOT the beginning of Trouble - this is ignorance of Scripture

Genesis tells us exactly when the Beginning of Trouble/Tribulation Began.

Genesis tells us it Began in the Garden.

Genesis also tells us when the great tribulation specifically began for Noah and the world.

Oh brother, this one exactly zero change of ever understanding ANY METAPHOR, LOL. I give up, you have no hope of comprehending anything. Continue on down your rabbit hole.

WE ALL KNOW WHEN SIN CAME INTOTHE WORLD..........Geezzzzzeeeeee

The RAIN is he TROUBLES when compared to Jesus' point that he is making unto the DISCIPLES !!!!!!!!! Good grief man wake up and drunk some coffee, a 2nd grade can get this stuff. Jesus is comparing the END TIMES with the FLOOD, thus I..............ME..................I am telling you what the FLOOD MEANS in his lesson, it meant WRATH, the Rain that came was not the WRATH but the TROUBLES as in when that rain came all of those people were in TROUBLE but just didn't know it yet, because the WRATH would come a few days later via a Flood, LIKEWISE.........GET THAT? Likewise, when the Rapture happens and you miss the Rapture, you WILL BE in God's Wrath..........BUT..........that Wrath only comes LATER ON, 3.5 years later to be exact.

Man you can't even comprehend these simple points, what's up dude? You need t start all over and get in a good bible study somewhere and let God reteach you, something is amiss brother.

 

[DavidTree]

No now David, you are taking what said on the wrong path!

The separation of Israel and Church is obviously seen in scripture as to the way He is dealing with them vs. the Church.

Now, let's not take the wrong the path with this!

His Church?Elect/Saints are the TRUE Israel of God.

I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.

But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect.
For they are not all Israel who are of Israel,
nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham;
but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.”
That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God;
but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.

Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now.

 

[Charlie24]

His Church?Elect/Saints are the TRUE Israel of God.

I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.

But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect.
For they are not all Israel who are of Israel,
nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham;
but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.”
That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God;
but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.

Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now.

Concentrate on the plan of God, David! That is the focus here that I have brought to attention.

 

[DavidTree]

Oh brother, this one exactly zero change of ever understanding ANY METAPHOR, LOL. I give up, you have no hope of comprehending anything. Continue on down your rabbit hole.

WE ALL KNOW WHEN SIN CAME INTOTHE WORLD..........Geezzzzzeeeeee

The RAIN is he TROUBLES when compared to Jesus' point that he is making unto the DISCIPLES !!!!!!!!! Good grief man wake up and drunk some coffee, a 2nd grade can get this stuff. Jesus is comparing the END TIMES with the FLOOD, thus I..............ME..................I am telling you what the FLOOD MEANS in his lesson, it meant WRATH, the Rain that came was not the WRATH but the TROUBLES as in when that rain came all of those people were in TROUBLE but just didn't know it yet, because the WRATH would come a few days later via a Flood, LIKEWISE.........GET THAT? Likewise, when the Rapture happens and you miss the Rapture, you WILL BE in God's Wrath..........BUT..........that Wrath only comes LATER ON, 3.5 years later to be exact.

Man you can't even comprehend these simple points, what's up dude? You need t start all over and get in a good bible study somewhere and let God reteach you, something is amiss brother.

OH BROTHER of self-inflicted error - how will you ever SEE the Truth that is right in front of you???

i KNOW - get rid of the idol that blinds you.............

In Noah's Day, the Rain is the WRATH of God falling upon the earth for the very FIRST Time in World History.

Genesis clearly describes when the Trouble came for the world even prior to Noah.

REPENT

 

[DavidTree]

Concentrate on the plan of God, David! That is the focus here that I have brought to attention.

AMEN -AMEN AMEN

#1. the PLAN does not include separating Jew from Gentile in the Body of Christ
#2. the PLAN was for the earthly seed of Abraham to receive their Messiah = PLAN Succeeded
#3. the PLAN is for Jew & Gentile in the Body of Christ to never be separated from each other.
#4. the PLAN is His Second Coming = the RESURRECTION
#5. the PLAN is Zechariah ch14 and Matthew 23:37

Stay with the PLAN God has set forth, where we are at TODAY and will be FOREVER.

 

[Charlie24]

AMEN -AMEN AMEN

#1. the PLAN does not include separating Jew from Gentile in the Body of Christ
#2. the PLAN was for the earthly seed of Abraham to receive their Messiah = PLAN Succeeded
#3. the PLAN is for Jew & Gentile in the Body of Christ to never be separated from each other.
#4. the PLAN is His Second Coming = the RESURRECTION
#5. the PLAN is Zechariah ch14 and Matthew 23:37

Stay with the PLAN God has set forth, where we are at TODAY and will be FOREVER.

This is exactly my point! The post-trib view comes from the misunderstanding of the role of Israel in God's plan.

Israel is ignored, only the Church is in view of the post-trib theory, this is wrong David!

The point I made of "the Church being God's second choice" is my focus.

As long as you can't see the plan of God for Israel in all of this, you will hold the post-trib view!

This is what we need to discuss, God's plan for Israel, not the Church. Then the light will begin to shine forth!

 

[DavidTree]

This is exactly my point! The post-trib view comes from the misunderstanding of the role of Israel in God's plan.

Israel is ignored, only the Church is in view of the post-trib theory, this is wrong David!

The point I made of "the Church being God's second choice" is my focus.

As long as you can't see the plan of God for Israel in all of this, you will hold the post-trib view!

This is what we need to discuss, God's plan for Israel, not the Church. Then the light will begin to shine forth!

Well let us get the Order right first, which is:

#1 God's Plan began before the foundation of the world = Ephesians 1:4
#2 God's Plan for His Church = the Israel of God = the Body of Christ
#3 God' Plan for the nations including the nation Israel

 

[Charlie24]

Well let us get the Order right first, which is:

#1 God's Plan began before the foundation of the world = Ephesians 1:4
#2 God's Plan for His Church = the Israel of God = the Body of Christ
#3 God' Plan for the nations including the nation Israel

On that I agree! But it's much, much deeper that this, David!

God gave His chosen people Law when the rest of the world had none.

God prepared Israel as the womb for the Saviour of the world.

This is the beginning of God's plan before the Church ever comes into view!

 

[DavidTree]

On that I agree! But it's much, much deeper that this, David!

God gave His chosen people Law when the rest of the world had none.

God prepared Israel as the womb for the Savior of the world.

This is the beginning of God's plan before the Church ever comes into view!

God gave the World His Law in the Garden and is BEFORE the Mosaic Law given to the Jews.

Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. So they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts either accusing or defending them on the day when God will judge men’s secrets through Christ Jesus, as proclaimed by my gospel.
Romans ch2

Read thru Romans Ephesians Galatians

 

[Charlie24]

God gave the World His Law in the Garden and is BEFORE the Mosaic Law given to the Jews.

Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. So they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts either accusing or defending them on the day when God will judge men’s secrets through Christ Jesus, as proclaimed by my gospel.
Romans ch2

Read thru Romans Ephesians Galatians

Paul is proving God did not leave out the Gentiles from the very beginning, as the Jews believed.

The Jews believed only a Jew could be saved, this occasioned Paul's writing here.

The proof is when the Gentile woman came to Christ for her child to be healed, Jesus ignored her!

But she wouldn't give up! Finally Jesus turned to her and said, "it's not fit to throw to the dogs the children's bread."

Jesus called her a dog, because she was a Gentile! But what did the woman reply?

"Even the dogs desire the food from the Mater's table." Jesus said, great is thy faith, as you wish it shall be done.

Her child was immediately healed and she was saved by grace through faith.

Christ never turned down the faith of a Gentile, but He came to bring the Kingdom to the Jews, and they in return were to evangelize the world.

This is my point, the post-trib view is ignoring the great role in God's plan for the Jews, and giving the Church the spotlight.

As I said, God is not finished with Israel by a long shot. They will accomplish in the 1000 year reign of Christ what they failed to accomplish in His first advent.

It is vital that we see God's plan for Israel! The entire end of times prophesy is based on the return of Israel to God and His Christ.

 

[DavidTree]

Paul is proving God did not leave out the Gentiles from the very beginning, as the Jews believed.

The Jews believed only a Jew could be saved, this occasioned Paul's writing here.

The proof is when the Gentile woman came to Christ for her child to be healed, Jesus ignored her!

But she wouldn't give up! Finally Jesus turned to her and said, "it's not fit to throw to the dogs the children's bread."

Jesus called her a dog, because she was a Gentile! But what did the woman reply?

"Even the dogs desire the food from the Mater's table." Jesus said, great is thy faith, as you wish it shall be done.

Her child was immediately healed and she was saved by grace through faith.

Christ never turned down the faith of a Gentile, but He came to bring the Kingdom to the Jews, and they in return were to evangelize the world.

This is my point, the post-trib view is ignoring the great role in God's plan for the Jews, and giving the Church the spotlight.

As I said, God is not finished with Israel by a long shot. They will accomplish in the 1000 year reign of Christ what they failed to accomplish in His first advent.

It is vital that we see God's plan for Israel! The entire end of times prophesy is based on the return of Israel to God and His Christ.

#1. The LORD did not call her a dog because she was a Gentile - He used that word because of the pagan practices she was involved in that led to her daughter being demon possesed.

#2. The disciples wanted the LORD to send her away but HE DID NOT.
"And His disciples came and urged Him, saying, “Send her away, for she cries out after us.”
But He answered and said, “I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”"

#3. The LORD received her petition because it is the Law of God: "My House shall be a House pf prayer to all nations."

#4. Do you SEE what transpired here???


Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life and may enter the city by its gates. 15But outside are the dogs, the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.
Revelation 22:14-15

 

[Charlie24]

#1. The LORD did not call her a dog because she was a Gentile - He used that word because of the pagan practices she was involved in that led to her daughter being demon possesed.

#2. The disciples wanted the LORD to send her away but HE DID NOT.
"And His disciples came and urged Him, saying, “Send her away, for she cries out after us.”
But He answered and said, “I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”"

#3. The LORD received her petition because it is the Law of God: "My House shall be a House pf prayer to all nations."

#4. Do you SEE what transpired here???


Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life and may enter the city by its gates. 15But outside are the dogs, the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.
Revelation 22:14-15

Ok, I see I'm wasting my time! I'll leave you alone to your beliefs!

 

[Runningman]

You guys are trying the read to much into this! It just simply means what it says.

It's not even a new earth as in brand new, it's refurbished.

"Passed away" in the Greek is "parerchomai" and means to pass from one condition to another.

It never means annihilation. So when Peter said the earth burned up, he was referring to a refurbishing.

What source are you using for "pass away?" Because what I am seeing doesn't match what you're saying.

I'm using Bible Hub's Strong's concordance and it basically means to perish. The earth and heavens be destroyed per 2 Peter 3:10.

Here's a link to what I'm seeing:

https://biblehub.com/greek/3928.htm

 

[Charlie24]

What source are you using for "pass away?" Because what I am seeing doesn't match what you're saying.

I'm using Bible Hub's Strong's concordance and it basically means to perish. The earth and heavens be destroyed per 2 Peter 3:10.

Here's a link to what I'm seeing:

https://biblehub.com/greek/3928.htm

I have a large collection of commentaries collected over the years, read them quite often.

The definition I gave you was the first to come to mind, actually I had to take a quick look to see which one it was.

I have found the commentary online from the Swaggart commentaries, read the right hand column.

There are several points he makes to this effect. You may agree, but I doubt it!

 

[Charlie24]

I have a large collection of commentaries collected over the years, read them quite often.

The definition I gave you was the first to come to mind, actually I had to take a quick look to see which one it was.

I have found the commentary online from the Swaggart commentaries, read the right hand column.

There are several points he makes to this effect. You may agree, but I doubt it!

I think it may help if I provided this, lol.

https://books.google.com/books?id=C... change from one condition to another&f=false

 

[DavidTree]

Ok, I see I'm wasting my time! I'll leave you alone to your beliefs!

But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice.’ For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.”

the LORD is not a 'pre-tribr' therefore the Scriptures do not bend for 'pre-trib' doctrine to be injected into it.

Ask yourself these questions:
Why does the Lord never mention a pre-trib rapture?
Why do the Apostles never mention a pre-trib rapture?
Why do the Prophets never mention a pre-trib rapture?

 

[Runningman]

I think it may help if I provided this, lol.

https://books.google.com/books?id=CyBMEAAAQBAJ&pg=PA468&lpg=PA468&dq=greek+"pass+away"+to+change+from+one+condition+to+another&source=bl&ots=1AKbXrLCGN&sig=ACfU3U3u00DdSnSuB2XH_z_U-gywXQNgdg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwij94eq89T0AhX2rHIEHR7HD-cQ6AF6BAgTEAM#v=onepage&q=greek "pass away" to change from one condition to another&f=false

I see his commentary, but that isn't consistent with the textbook definition of parerchomai. Bible commentaries, while can be very useful and insightful, are not gospel and do contain errors. Just look up parerchomai in the Strong's or will Google translate.