S
THE WOMEN OF THE CHURCH
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Please enlighten me. Can deacons have more than one wife? Can a deacon have a husband? Which one?
S
SophieT
Guest
so suddenly you like the word deacon?
wonder who pointed you in that direction since you avoided it like the plague just yesterday
wonder who pointed you in that direction since you avoided it like the plague just yesterday
S
SophieT
Guest
again, not to bore anyone, the problem lies in translations
you do not have to know Greek to believe in Jesus...you do have to understand and receive the gospel which leads to salvation
however, some studying (again not to bore anyone but it seems some points have to be hammered in
) ESPECIALLY if one claims to be a teacher (claims for teacher and prophet are the favorites it seems) is in order...necessary in fact. some English translations use the word 'wives' in I Timothy 3:11, as in 'their wives', BUT the original Greek does not use the word 'their'...so, the word wives does not follow if the translators have done a proper translation
rather, the translators in the case of using the words 'their wives', actually illustrates an incorrect translation and some liberty taken in doing so which does not render a correct understanding of what is being said by Paul in his letter to Timothy
in fact, the word in Greek that is used can be translated as either wives or women, so to speculate that it is one over the other, is just that...speculation. BUT a careful reading/rendering of the passage in question will reveal that Paul refers to DEACONS and not women.
If he had used the pronoun 'their' which again is NOT in the original Greek, we could safely say that the wives of deacons was a correct translation.
Therefore, it is safe to conclude that Paul intended the reference to mean women as deacons.
you do not have to know Greek to believe in Jesus...you do have to understand and receive the gospel which leads to salvation
however, some studying (again not to bore anyone but it seems some points have to be hammered in
) ESPECIALLY if one claims to be a teacher (claims for teacher and prophet are the favorites it seems) is in order...necessary in fact. some English translations use the word 'wives' in I Timothy 3:11, as in 'their wives', BUT the original Greek does not use the word 'their'...so, the word wives does not follow if the translators have done a proper translationrather, the translators in the case of using the words 'their wives', actually illustrates an incorrect translation and some liberty taken in doing so which does not render a correct understanding of what is being said by Paul in his letter to Timothy
in fact, the word in Greek that is used can be translated as either wives or women, so to speculate that it is one over the other, is just that...speculation. BUT a careful reading/rendering of the passage in question will reveal that Paul refers to DEACONS and not women.
If he had used the pronoun 'their' which again is NOT in the original Greek, we could safely say that the wives of deacons was a correct translation.
Therefore, it is safe to conclude that Paul intended the reference to mean women as deacons.
That is completely false. Deacons serve the church as stewards handling the temporal affairs of the church, but they are not elders who are responsibly for preaching and teaching. But Phoebe was serving the church in other ways. Possibly she was a wealthy business woman who came to to the financial aid of indigent Christians, including Paul. That would fit the context.
In Jewish history the position of deacon is called shammash
Romans 16
Complete Jewish Bible
16 I am introducing to you our sister Phoebe, shammash of the congregation at Cenchrea
Shammash is a Hebrew word that means servant. In the Jewish community, shammash (also spelled “shammas”) commonly refers to the sexton—the person who manages the synagogue facilities and keeps things running smoothly. In the Middle Ages the term referenced a more prestigious position. The shammash helped to conduct prayer, lead the worship services and even carry out and enforce the judgments of the Jewish community leadership.
Ephesus 3:7
Orthodox Jewish Bible
7 Of which I became a keli kodesh (minister) according to the matnat Hashem of the Chen v’Chesed of G-d having been bestowed upon me, according to the working of His gevurah (power).
Colossae 4:7
Orthodox Jewish Bible
7 Tychicus will tell you all the news about me; he is a beloved Ach b’Moshiach and a keli kodesh who is ne’eman (faithful), a chaver and fellow eved in Adoneinu.
Keli kodesh translates to deakonos. Both Paul and Jesus was considered deakonos and both were single men. Both taught as teachers while serving others. Paul must of forgot to eliminate himself as he was not a man of one spouse and so was Jesus. He must of used the wrong word when ministering to the recipients of the letter who he was also teaching.
You claim it was Aquila. I have asked for Biblical proof of this. You have provided none.
How about all the passages pertaining to the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the church? I would say they both had a part, but the husband was the lead.
If a husband allows his wife to give correction, she is usurping no authority from him.
You still give no verses.
S
SophieT
Guest
is the truth in you?
24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.
26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly. Acts 18
there it is in the KJ they they they they they etc...BOTH of them
but you know what the KJ says. you just can't stand it though
We are not dealing with Jewish history but Christian New Testament truth. Jewish men cover their heads for worship but Christian men are told to keep their heads uncovered. So what applied in synagogues does not apply to Christian churches.
Jesus and many of the apostles were Jewish so to study Jewish culture it may she'd let on what was being implied. It is the same concept for reading Matthew that is rich in Jewish culture and traditions. Knowing more about the culture can she'd deeper truths on events and words that we're spoken.
That was only half of my post,
Both Paul and Jesus was considered deakonos and both were single men. Both taught as teachers while serving others. Paul must of forgot to eliminate himself as he was not a man of one spouse and so was Jesus. He must of used the wrong word when ministering to the recipients of the letter who he was also teaching.
Here is Paul saying he became a deacon of the gospel. Same word as deacon is translated as servant as well.
Ephesians 3:7
New International Version
7 I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God’s grace given me through the working of his power.
is the truth in you?
24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.
26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly. Acts 18
there it is in the KJ they they they they they etc...BOTH of them
but you know what the KJ says. you just can't stand it though
I‘ll repeat my statement...
“I would say they both had a part, but the husband was the lead.”
That‘s biblical.
Again, the office of a deacon is different than a servant. Jesus nor Paul held the office of a deacon. They were both servants.
Of course a female deacon can have a husband, and at that time, a man might have had more than one wife. It’s really not that difficult.
We need to focus on THE OFFICE of the deacon. As we see in the NT there were two offices in the churches: (a) elders and (b) deacons, and only men could be appointed to them. Which means that these men were appointed in an official capacity to serve the churches. The elders were in fact pastors/elders/bishops required to lead and feed the flock ("the ministry of the Word"), while watching over the spiritual wellbeing of the Christians. But the function of deacons was to minister to the physical needs of the Christians (food, clothes, shelter, transportation). We see this in Acts 6:1-4.
However we need to look at 1 Timothy 3:8-13, where Paul speaks not once, but twice about "the office of a deacon": 8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre; 9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience. 10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless. 11Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things. 12Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. 13For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.
So it should be clear that there were no deaconesses in the NT churches. But women served in many capacities and were honored for their service.
Where is this distinction spelled out in Scripture? Where, for that matter, are the qualifications and duties of a “servant” spelled out?Again, the office of a deacon is different than a servant. Jesus nor Paul held the office of a deacon. They were both servants.
Hint: the pastoral epistles.