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Nov 23, 2021
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Ok, the reason why the church is historically on Sunday has to do with the Resurrection :)
Actually it was historically , not to be contrary , was because it was changed to Sunday by a Pope. Got to go now but will talk later . CS1
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Ok, the reason why the church is historically on Sunday has to do with the Resurrection :)
Can people say unequivocally that Jesus' resurrection was Sunday morning and not late Saturday night? :unsure:

It is not even universally agreed which day Jesus was crucified :geek:
 

unelie

Active member
Nov 28, 2021
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Hum, the specific answers to these questions have been given back in 2011, and I think I mostly agree with everything said back then :)
I said that in reference to these questions :

Ok Your Sabbath when do you celebrate or keep the sabbath?

What are your views on the Nature and relationship of God, Jesus and the Holy spiri

Are you a cessationist or continuationis

Do you believe in Dispensationalis

What are your views on premillenialis

What particular Doctrine or Bible do you preach fro

Heres a few to start nice meeting you
 

unelie

Active member
Nov 28, 2021
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What is this verse mean

Mat 25
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Well, it means that the punishment inflected is forever, you don't get out of it. This is eternal death : no way out, for ever and ever they will be punished by death.
By the way, this text opposes life to punishment, which supports the fact that the wicked will not have eternal life. They won't keep suffering forever, but they will be punished by fire and die from it, once and for ever.

Some other texts that support that :

Ezé 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine:
the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Versus :
Eze 18:9 [But he that] hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord GOD.
 

unelie

Active member
Nov 28, 2021
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Can people say unequivocally that Jesus' resurrection was Sunday morning and not late Saturday night? :unsure:

It is not even universally agreed which day Jesus was crucified :geek:
Short version : yes as SDA we believe Jesus resurrected on Sunday morning.
(I can dig on the day of crucifixion if you will, you can just ask :) )


Longer version :
The earthquake and the rolling of the stone closing the tomb happened clearly on Sunday morning, a little bit before dawn.

Mat 28:1-2 KJV 1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre. 2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.

Not only that, but Jesus did not ascend to heaven to see his father before later that morning. Indeed, he met Mary and told her :
Jea 20:17
Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

So, from the Bible, it would be pretty far fetched to assume Jesus was resurrected many hours before all that. On the contrary, the most reasonable (and accepted) understanding is Jesus resurrection on Sunday morning.

Now I agree that I don't know of any text that say specifically and literally that he resurrected on Sunday morning, but because of the many indirect evidence we have of that, I don't think any other hypothesis would be Bible based.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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Well, it means that the punishment inflected is forever, you don't get out of it. This is eternal death : no way out, for ever and ever they will be punished by death.
By the way, this text opposes life to punishment, which supports the fact that the wicked will not have eternal life. They won't keep suffering forever, but they will be punished by fire and die from it, once and for ever.

Some other texts that support that :

Ezé 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine:
the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Versus :
Eze 18:9 [But he that] hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord GOD.
That is what I think
Everlasting mean eternal or forever
Punishment is the infliction or imposition of a penalty as retribution for an offense.

So everlasting punishment mean never ending punihment you can punisht the death
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
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Mat 19:4-8
And He answered and said to them, Have you not read that He who made [them] at the beginning made them male and female,
5 and said, For this cause a man shall leave father and mother and shall cling to his wife, and the two of them shall be one flesh? 6 Therefore they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.
7 They said to Him, Why did Moses then command to give a bill of divorce and to put her away?
8 He said to them, Because of your hard-heartedness Moses allowed you to put away your wives; but from the beginning it was not so.

That was about marriage not diet. There is no teaching by Christ to go back to any certain diet.
 

unelie

Active member
Nov 28, 2021
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That was about marriage not diet. There is no teaching by Christ to go back to any certain diet.
Sorry, I realize that what I said was not clear.
Yes, this passage is about marriage and not primarily about diet. Sorry for not saying that clearly.

The point I make is about the principles upon which Jesus teach here. If we apply these principles to diet, it should lead us to plant based diet.
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
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Sorry, I realize that what I said was not clear.
Yes, this passage is about marriage and not primarily about diet. Sorry for not saying that clearly.

The point I make is about the principles upon which Jesus teach here. If we apply these principles to diet, it should lead us to plant based diet.

There are no principles laid out there for things like diet or jobs. If that was what we should do, then everyone should be a farmer like Adam. Not to mention Adam and Eve are pretty much the worse people to imitate based on their tendency to disobey God and curse humanity. Besides, there is zero evidence people did not eat meat in the earliest of days. Dominion over fish does not mean using them to farm, or having as pets. That type of dominion is to catch and eat them. Humans have always had a mix of teeth for Carnivore eating and plant based eating.
 
Nov 29, 2021
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What did Jesus mean when He said "My Father is working until now, and I am working" John 5:17?
If God has been working "until now", then He has not yet rested and His creation is still not complete. The Sabbath we are commanded to keep is the 1000 year millennial reign which will start after Jesus' return. We can join Him in His rest by following Jesus now.
Blessings and peace to you all.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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Australia
There are no principles laid out there for things like diet or jobs. If that was what we should do, then everyone should be a farmer like Adam. Not to mention Adam and Eve are pretty much the worse people to imitate based on their tendency to disobey God and curse humanity. Besides, there is zero evidence people did not eat meat in the earliest of days. Dominion over fish does not mean using them to farm, or having as pets. That type of dominion is to catch and eat them. Humans have always had a mix of teeth for Carnivore eating and plant based eating.
Eat what ever you want..... it is your choice.

If you would like to trust science and the findings of men you'll see that they are slowly coming into line with the SDA teachings. Their health principles have not changed for years and science is starting to catch up.

What the Church taught 100 years ago about diet and lifestyle is being accepted today more and more by science. Vegetarians were laughed at years ago, but evidence shows that the vegetarian diet causes a longer and happier life.

God created us and knows what is best for us. Research the bible and see what God told His people not to eat and you can be sure it was for their good. Food has not changed and we are even weaker today, so i say listen to the SDA advice because they do live longer then most people on average.
 

ewq1938

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Oct 18, 2018
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Eat what ever you want..... it is your choice.
And it's a biblically based choice as well:

1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
 
Nov 29, 2021
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Well, it means that the punishment inflected is forever, you don't get out of it. This is eternal death : no way out, for ever and ever they will be punished by death.
By the way, this text opposes life to punishment, which supports the fact that the wicked will not have eternal life. They won't keep suffering forever, but they will be punished by fire and die from it, once and for ever.

Some other texts that support that :

Ezé 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine:
the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Versus :
Eze 18:9 [But he that] hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord GOD.
So what did Paul mean when he said "As in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive"?
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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Can people say unequivocally that Jesus' resurrection was Sunday morning and not late Saturday night? :unsure:

It is not even universally agreed which day Jesus was crucified :geek:
I agree with your estimation. Jesus was first recorded as seen on Sunday morning but that is not the same has having rose from the dead on Sunday. It could very well be that Jesus rose Saturday night.
 

ewq1938

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Oct 18, 2018
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I agree with your estimation. Jesus was first recorded as seen on Sunday morning but that is not the same has having rose from the dead on Sunday. It could very well be that Jesus rose Saturday night.

Which IS rising on Sunday.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Which IS rising on Sunday.
That salient fact sometimes escapes me in the differing timelines given in the gospels, one according to our
way of counting days, and others according to the Jewish fashion of counting a day as starting at sunset
:geek:
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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Which IS rising on Sunday.
That would be true unless Jesus rose from the dead before sundown on Saturday. After sundown, it would be as you said, on Sunday. If Jesus was dead for 3 days or 72 hours, ascertaining the time of death is key to determine the day the Jesus rose from the dead.
 

ewq1938

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Oct 18, 2018
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That would be true unless Jesus rose from the dead before sundown on Saturday.

That would contradict scripture:

Mar_16:9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Early on the first day of the week means Saturday night which is the beginning part of a Sunday.

Counting three days back means he was buried on Wednesday night, what we call Early Thursday.
 

unelie

Active member
Nov 28, 2021
113
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There are no principles laid out there for things like diet or jobs. If that was what we should do, then everyone should be a farmer like Adam. Not to mention Adam and Eve are pretty much the worse people to imitate based on their tendency to disobey God and curse humanity. Besides, there is zero evidence people did not eat meat in the earliest of days. Dominion over fish does not mean using them to farm, or having as pets. That type of dominion is to catch and eat them. Humans have always had a mix of teeth for Carnivore eating and plant based eating.
I see no question here 🤔
Still, this is a thread to ask questions to Adventists. If you have stuff to say, there are other threads out there 👀