If The Kingdom isn't here yet then what is JESUS CHRIST a King of?

[DavidTree]

How are you not seeing that physical rule is the opposite of what JESUS offers?

JESUS is my KING Right NOW, question what you believe if you can't say the same thing.

AMEN Brother - HE is my KING right Now and forevermore as well - AMEN

Dear Brother it is BOTH - we are now ruling and reigning with Him - now - but only in the Spirit for now.
Now we are kings and priest unto God and we are being prepared for MORE = 1 Thess 4:13-18 , 1 John 3:1-3

For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ, and being ready to punish all disobedience when your obedience is fulfilled.

Do you SEE the king and priest ruling in Christ here in 2 Corinthians 10:4-6

Satan has had 2,000 years to attack the Truth and create division in the Body of Christ through 'ism' (see Post 551)

This is why anyone who wants to know the TRUTH of Scripture must abide in Christ when approaching Scripture.

Scripture is not for us to play around with and dice up for ourselves with self seeking.

Scripture is for us to grow by and live by and die by - John 6:63 , Acts ch7 , Revelation 12:11 ,
It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
When they heard these things they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed at him with their teeth.
But Stephen, being full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God,
and said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!”
Then they cried out with a loud voice, stopped their ears, and ran at him with one accord; and they cast him out of the city and stoned him.

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.

 

[DavidTree]

How are you not seeing that physical rule is the opposite of what JESUS offers?

JESUS is my KING Right NOW, question what you believe if you can't say the same thing.

AMEN Brother - HE is my KING right Now and forevermore as well - AMEN

Dear Brother it is BOTH - we are now ruling and reigning with Him - now - but only in the Spirit for now.
Now we are kings and priest unto God and we are being prepared MORE = 1 Thess 4:13-18 , 1 John 3:1-3

For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ, and being ready to punish all disobedience when your obedience is fulfilled.

Do you SEE the king and priest ruling in Christ here in 2 Corinthians 10:4-6

Satan has had 2,000 years to attack the Truth and create division in the Body of Christ through 'ism' (see Post 551)

This is why anyone who wants to know the TRUTH of Scripture must abide in Christ when approaching Scripture.

Scripture is not for us to play around with and dice up for ourselves with self seeking.

Scripture is for us to grow by and live by and die by - John 6:63 , Acts ch7 , Revelation 12:11 ,

It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
When they heard these things they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed at him with their teeth.
But Stephen, being full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God,
and said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!”
Then they cried out with a loud voice, stopped their ears, and ran at him with one accord; and they cast him out of the city and stoned him.

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

If JESUS' Kingdom is not of this world ...why are you guys trying to force one for a thousand years before the New Earth?

John 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.


Do you think JESUS is going to setup a Kingdom for a thousand years and then let satan wreck it?

You want there to be two regenerations of earth.

 

[ewq1938]

Do you think JESUS is going to setup a Kingdom for a thousand years and then let satan wreck it?

Satan isn't able to wreck it. His army fails to succeed and so does he. Have you never read Revelation 20?

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Where is this "wrecking" you mentioned?

 

[pittsburghjoe]

You don't get to have a physical Kingdom of CHRIST with Citizens that can be deceived.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

You are saying JESUS is not Leading and Shepherding us now because that happens through The Kingdom.

What are you Reborn into?

 

[HatedForNoReason]

You don't get to have a physical Kingdom of CHRIST with Citizens that can be deceived.

A 1000 year physical kingdom makes no sense because God is going to burn down the old heaven and old earth. Than make a new heaven and new earth.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

Is JESUS The Anointed One, The MESSIAH yet or do we have to wait for this 1000 years to give Him that Title?

 

[ewq1938]

A 1000 year physical kingdom makes no sense because God is going to burn down the old heaven and old earth. Than make a new heaven and new earth.

First there is no "1000 year kingdom". It's a 1000 year rule with a rod of iron. The kingdom is eternal. Second, the 1000 year rule happens BEFORE the NHNE.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

We inherit The Kingdom for Infinity on the New Earth, not a thousand years. We become Citizens now.


Sounds like The Kingdom of The Body of CHRIST:
Ephesians 2:19-22
Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.


2 Corinthians 5:17,19,20
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

amen the kingdom is made of faith not sight

and faith comes from hearing the gospel and believing what we can’t yet see , but is certain beyond the veil

it’s mystifying to me that more folk don’t realize how much the Bible is about after we part this world of flesh that we see with our flesh eyes but faith is where the kingdom is found

and we walk by what God told us , not by what we see in this dying world. The kingdom is to hear and believe the king and by the spirit were with him and he with us

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Is JESUS The Anointed One, The MESSIAH yet or do we have to wait for this 1000 years to give Him that Title?

I’d say from this point on the kingdom and king is exalted

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:18-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the king is sovereign always was and is , in his kingdom his words are his decrees and define the borders of his kingdom for all his people and citizens of his kingdom .

should be little doubt who’s exalted and seated on the throne

“Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭2:9-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

he won’t some day be lord but he is Lord of lords and Kings of kings and we’re the kings …..

“And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭1:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

believers of the gospel who receive the Holy Spirit are receiving the priesthood of Christ in the order of
Melchezidek so our priesthood is of the order of eternity on both heaven and earth

kingdom indeed is spread abroad it’s just that it takes this to see it

“So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we walk by that faith and know the kingdom is ever present as the spirit is ever present

 

[Nehemiah6]

First there is no "1000 year kingdom". It's a 1000 year rule with a rod of iron.

Yes, but since Christ is King of kings and Lord of lords during that time, it is correctly called the Millennial Kingdom.

 

[ewq1938]

Yes, but since Christ is King of kings and Lord of lords during that time, it is correctly called the Millennial Kingdom.

That is an incorrect term because it implies the kingdom ends after a thousand years which isn't true. The kingdom is forever, the rod of iron rule is only a thousand years.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

We work for the King right now:

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

JESUS is a KING Today:
John 18:37
Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

What do you think Scripture is saying when this happens? LORD ....KING:

Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭2:9-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus is NOT reigning over His enemies now - according to Scripture

To reign means to rule over people and have complete control. Look around at the world. ISIS is murdering Christians and harming the growth of the gospel. The world is full is false gods and religions and evil practices.

It is clear someone else reigns this wicked, morally corrupt world currently:

Joh 14:29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe.
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

Prince here doesn't mean second in command or something like we think in modern English, it means the ruler, the first in rank or power:

G758
a?´????
archo¯n
ar'-khone
Present participle of G757; a first (in rank or power): - chief (ruler), magistrate, prince, ruler.


G758
a?´????
archo¯n
Thayer Definition:
1) a ruler, commander, chief, leader
Part of Speech: noun masculine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: present participle of G757
Citing in TDNT: 1:488, 81

According to Christ, the ruler of this world was to come after Christ left. We know from Rev 12 that after He ascended there was a war in heaven and satan was cast to the Earth just as Christ said would happen. According to Jesus Christ himself, the one reigning/ruling the world after His ascension would be satan!

So when would Christ reign over his enemies on the Earth?

Mat 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?


Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.


Luk 20:42 And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Luk 20:43 Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.


Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Act 2:35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.


Psa 110:1 A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Psa 110:2 The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
Psa 110:3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
Psa 110:4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
Psa 110:5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
Psa 110:6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.
Psa 110:7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

So when does Christ leave the right hand of God in heaven and come to the Earth to defeat his enemies and rule in the midst of those enemies? The second coming of course. We also see this depicted in Rev 19.


Amill asks, "Isn't Christ's kingdom reigning on the Earth now?"

No.


His reign here begins when the 7th trump sounds.


Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

This is the first time when Christ reigns literally over all kings and their kingdoms.

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1Ti 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;

His times would be specifically "the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ" at the 7th trump! That is when he is actively and defacto King of Kings reigning over all Earthly kingdoms and reigning over his enemies with a rod of iron.

Here is what we know:

1. Christ said satan is the ruler of the world.
2. Christ's reign will begin when he leaves the right hand of God in heaven and comes to the Earth.
2a. That is the second coming at the 7th trump.


John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Christ knew his kingdom and reign here starts when he returned at the 7th trump.



Joh_10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

Does this mean Christ died and resurrected himself right at this moment or was that a future thing he had authority to do?

It is the same with ruling. He has the authority now but is not yet excercising that authority because he is waiting for the right time.


Rev_2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

So in comparison he received the knowledge that in the future he and his saints would rule over the nations with a rod of iron.
That particular reign did not start when John had this vision, which was somewhere around Ad 93 or so. Even AD 70, which I disagree with, is still many decades after the cross. If Christ is reigning now with a rod of iron why the decades of delay after the cross? That makes no logical sense.

But understand both of the things he said he received from the Father were related to the future, everything makes logical and scriptural sense and matches perfectly with each other.


Heb_2:8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.


This was written long after the cross and even at that time not all things were put under Him. That doesn't happen until the second coming.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

First there is no "1000 year kingdom". It's a 1000 year rule with a rod of iron. The kingdom is eternal. Second, the 1000 year rule happens BEFORE the NHNE.

JESUS physically Rules with a rod of iron ...but His Thousand Year Reign doesn't involve His Kingdom? WHAT???? The Body of CHRIST is directly connected to The Kingdom.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

Jesus is NOT reigning over His enemies now - according to Scripture

To reign means to rule over people and have complete control. Look around at the world. ISIS is murdering Christians and harming the growth of the gospel. The world is full is false gods and religions and evil practices.

It is clear someone else reigns this wicked, morally corrupt world currently:

Joh 14:29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe.
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

Prince here doesn't mean second in command or something like we think in modern English, it means the ruler, the first in rank or power:

G758
a?´????
archo¯n
ar'-khone
Present participle of G757; a first (in rank or power): - chief (ruler), magistrate, prince, ruler.


G758
a?´????
archo¯n
Thayer Definition:
1) a ruler, commander, chief, leader
Part of Speech: noun masculine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: present participle of G757
Citing in TDNT: 1:488, 81

According to Christ, the ruler of this world was to come after Christ left. We know from Rev 12 that after He ascended there was a war in heaven and satan was cast to the Earth just as Christ said would happen. According to Jesus Christ himself, the one reigning/ruling the world after His ascension would be satan!

So when would Christ reign over his enemies on the Earth?

Mat 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?


Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.


Luk 20:42 And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Luk 20:43 Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.


Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Act 2:35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.


Psa 110:1 A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Psa 110:2 The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
Psa 110:3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
Psa 110:4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.
Psa 110:5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
Psa 110:6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.
Psa 110:7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.

So when does Christ leave the right hand of God in heaven and come to the Earth to defeat his enemies and rule in the midst of those enemies? The second coming of course. We also see this depicted in Rev 19.


Amill asks, "Isn't Christ's kingdom reigning on the Earth now?"

No.


His reign here begins when the 7th trump sounds.


Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

This is the first time when Christ reigns literally over all kings and their kingdoms.

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1Ti 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;

His times would be specifically "the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ" at the 7th trump! That is when he is actively and defacto King of Kings reigning over all Earthly kingdoms and reigning over his enemies with a rod of iron.

Here is what we know:

1. Christ said satan is the ruler of the world.
2. Christ's reign will begin when he leaves the right hand of God in heaven and comes to the Earth.
2a. That is the second coming at the 7th trump.


John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Christ knew his kingdom and reign here starts when he returned at the 7th trump.



Joh_10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

Does this mean Christ died and resurrected himself right at this moment or was that a future thing he had authority to do?

It is the same with ruling. He has the authority now but is not yet excercising that authority because he is waiting for the right time.


Rev_2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

So in comparison he received the knowledge that in the future he and his saints would rule over the nations with a rod of iron.
That particular reign did not start when John had this vision, which was somewhere around Ad 93 or so. Even AD 70, which I disagree with, is still many decades after the cross. If Christ is reigning now with a rod of iron why the decades of delay after the cross? That makes no logical sense.

But understand both of the things he said he received from the Father were related to the future, everything makes logical and scriptural sense and matches perfectly with each other.


Heb_2:8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.


This was written long after the cross and even at that time not all things were put under Him. That doesn't happen until the second coming.

You are wanting the same thing as the pharisees.

 

[ewq1938]

JESUS physically Rules with a rod of iron ...but His Thousand Year Reign doesn't involve His Kingdom? WHAT???? The Body of CHRIST is directly connected to The Kingdom.

That's called a strawman fallacy.

 

[ewq1938]

How many times do we have to tell you that you are wanting the same thing as the pharisees?

That's false. That's just a childish Ad Hominem.

A physical kingdom is real and true. The Pharisees just expected it to happen when the Messiah first came. They were not wrong that a physical kingdom would eventually happen. Even Amill believes in a physical kingdom eventually, just not during the thousand years.

 

[HatedForNoReason]

That is an incorrect term because it implies the kingdom ends after a thousand years which isn't true. The kingdom is forever, the rod of iron rule is only a thousand years.

Amillennialism: the kingdom of heaven is at hand!