Documentary—7 Pretrib Problems and the Prewrath Rapture
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In the Gospel of John Jesus said ALL TIME on this earth is tribulation. We are in the Church Age tribulation now. After the Church is raptured we will be in the 70th-week tribulation. But, there is also a 3.5 year period that sees FAR WORSE TROUBLES than there has ever been before or since. God bring Wrath AND the Anti-Christ goes forth conquering at that exact same time, the reason he waits is it takes out a 1/3 of the world for him, and this is also just after the Gog and Magog war, so God takes out Russia, Turkey, and Irans Armies also. So, of course, he bides his time and waits for this asteroid to take out 1/3 of the world then he goes forth conquering amidst this chaos.
So, I usually call it the 70th week, because ALL TIME are troubles on this earth according to Jesus. Thus those seen in Rev. 7:9-17 came out of the 2000 some odd year Church Age Troubles, not the 70th-week troubles. You can't be raptured after the 70th week starts. You are judged in Rev. 20:4 AFTER Jesus' return.
The Feasts were Holy Convocations (Dress Rehearsals), in the 7 Feasts, God gave us the whole history of the world.
Spring Feasts Jesus fulfilled
1.) Feast of Passover ( Jesus is our Passover, Amen)
2.) Feast of Unleavened Bread (Jesus was without Sin)
3.) Feast of First-fruits (Jesus was the first-fruits of the Grave)
The Summer Harvest is now being fulfilled via the Church Age Harvest of souls
4.) Feast of Weeks/Harvest/Church Age/Pentecost ( This was on the Calendar all unto itself, like the Gentile Church Age. There were always two harvests, the spring harvest, and the summer harvest. Thus Israel had their Harvest moment in birthing Faith in the one true God and birthing Jesus Christ THE SEED and Redeemer of God the Father, he is God the son/redeemer. The Last Trump always ENDED the Harvest. Thus the Feast of Trumps, which follows the Feast of Weeks, actually meant something unto Paul, he was speaking of a factual event, not a Revelation Trumpet Judgment. Paul said at the LAST TRUMP, the Church would be called home. Well, at the real Last Trump, the Harvest ended, the Church Age is the Summer Harvest. When the Feast of Trumps started and then ended, it ended with 100 Shofar/Trumpet blasts, they had 9 GROUPS of 11 blasts, thus 99 Trumpet blasts, then at the LAST TRUMP it blew LOUDER & LONGER than all of the other Trumpet blasts and thus not only did the Harvest (Church Age) end but they announced that the Feats of Atonement and Tabernacle were nigh at hand.
Fall Feasts which Jesus will soon fulfill
5.) Feast of Trumps (I think I already explained this in-depth above in order to tie it in with the Summer Harvest. This ENDED the Harvest (Church Age) and announced that Atonement and Tabernacle were nigh at hand. Thus the Rev. 4:1 COME UP HERE by Jesus now gives us an understanding of the timing of the Rapture, just after the Rv. 2 and 3 Church Age.
6.) Feast of Atonement (Who does Dan. 9:24-27 say MUST ATONE before the Judgment against them can come to an end via the 70th week Judgment? Israel that's who !! So, do they repent? YES, Zechariah 13:8-9 says that 1/3 of the Jews repent (3-5 million Jews) and that 2/3 refuse to repent and will thus perish, then the very next verse, Zechariah 14:1 says the Day of the Lord has ARRIVED. Thus the Jews REPENT before the Anti-Christ comes to power, this is how they know to flee Judea when they see the AoD.
7.) Feast of Tabernacles (The word TABERNACLE means to Dwell with God. Where does Jesus reign from for 1000 years? Jerusalem, in Israel, so after the Jews REPENT, Jesus sets up his kingdom in Jerusalem for a 1000 year reign. Amen.) He TABERNACLES with Israel.
Thus, in spite of all the soothsayers, the Jews were doing DRESS REHEARSALS of every plan God ever had, even though they may not have understood what they were doing way back at the time. God showed us the whole history of Israel and the World in His 7 Feasts
So, I usually call it the 70th week, because ALL TIME are troubles on this earth according to Jesus. Thus those seen in Rev. 7:9-17 came out of the 2000 some odd year Church Age Troubles, not the 70th-week troubles. You can't be raptured after the 70th week starts. You are judged in Rev. 20:4 AFTER Jesus' return.
The Feasts were Holy Convocations (Dress Rehearsals), in the 7 Feasts, God gave us the whole history of the world.
Spring Feasts Jesus fulfilled
1.) Feast of Passover ( Jesus is our Passover, Amen)
2.) Feast of Unleavened Bread (Jesus was without Sin)
3.) Feast of First-fruits (Jesus was the first-fruits of the Grave)
The Summer Harvest is now being fulfilled via the Church Age Harvest of souls
4.) Feast of Weeks/Harvest/Church Age/Pentecost ( This was on the Calendar all unto itself, like the Gentile Church Age. There were always two harvests, the spring harvest, and the summer harvest. Thus Israel had their Harvest moment in birthing Faith in the one true God and birthing Jesus Christ THE SEED and Redeemer of God the Father, he is God the son/redeemer. The Last Trump always ENDED the Harvest. Thus the Feast of Trumps, which follows the Feast of Weeks, actually meant something unto Paul, he was speaking of a factual event, not a Revelation Trumpet Judgment. Paul said at the LAST TRUMP, the Church would be called home. Well, at the real Last Trump, the Harvest ended, the Church Age is the Summer Harvest. When the Feast of Trumps started and then ended, it ended with 100 Shofar/Trumpet blasts, they had 9 GROUPS of 11 blasts, thus 99 Trumpet blasts, then at the LAST TRUMP it blew LOUDER & LONGER than all of the other Trumpet blasts and thus not only did the Harvest (Church Age) end but they announced that the Feats of Atonement and Tabernacle were nigh at hand.
Fall Feasts which Jesus will soon fulfill
5.) Feast of Trumps (I think I already explained this in-depth above in order to tie it in with the Summer Harvest. This ENDED the Harvest (Church Age) and announced that Atonement and Tabernacle were nigh at hand. Thus the Rev. 4:1 COME UP HERE by Jesus now gives us an understanding of the timing of the Rapture, just after the Rv. 2 and 3 Church Age.
6.) Feast of Atonement (Who does Dan. 9:24-27 say MUST ATONE before the Judgment against them can come to an end via the 70th week Judgment? Israel that's who !! So, do they repent? YES, Zechariah 13:8-9 says that 1/3 of the Jews repent (3-5 million Jews) and that 2/3 refuse to repent and will thus perish, then the very next verse, Zechariah 14:1 says the Day of the Lord has ARRIVED. Thus the Jews REPENT before the Anti-Christ comes to power, this is how they know to flee Judea when they see the AoD.
7.) Feast of Tabernacles (The word TABERNACLE means to Dwell with God. Where does Jesus reign from for 1000 years? Jerusalem, in Israel, so after the Jews REPENT, Jesus sets up his kingdom in Jerusalem for a 1000 year reign. Amen.) He TABERNACLES with Israel.
Thus, in spite of all the soothsayers, the Jews were doing DRESS REHEARSALS of every plan God ever had, even though they may not have understood what they were doing way back at the time. God showed us the whole history of Israel and the World in His 7 Feasts
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This is an excellent documentary on the rapture. It's a little long (2 hours 16 min.), but it's worth watching. It's a very professional production with graphics and illustrations throughout. It takes the pre-wrath position and does a very thorough job of comparing that with pre-trib. Enjoy! 
Someone posted a challenge a few weeks ago or so, asking pre-tribbers to post a Bible verse that plainly states Jesus comes back before the great tribulation.
The challenge was to not use any opinion, commentary, or any other source besides the Bible.
I watched that thread for activity and as far as I know no one responded to it yet.
Why would pre-tribbers miss a golden opportunity to push their agenda? There is not a single Bible verse or passage that plainly states the rapture is pre-trib.
It requires extensive fiddling with the scriptures to produce the pre-trib doctrine. It cannot be taught using just a handful of plain scripture like the post-trib rapture can.
So no pre-tribber will accept this challenge.
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I'm saying you misunderstood my point due to an oversight and that's okay. I'm simply correcting it. Saying something can happen is not an accusation.
An accusation is state of being accused with a charge of wrongdoing or error. Someone who can commit apostasy has not committed an error, but someone who will commit apostasy is going to commit an error as a forgone conclusion.
I understand the nuances between can and will are subtle, but they are important. I do my best to not mince any words. I hope that helps.
An accusation is state of being accused with a charge of wrongdoing or error. Someone who can commit apostasy has not committed an error, but someone who will commit apostasy is going to commit an error as a forgone conclusion.
I understand the nuances between can and will are subtle, but they are important. I do my best to not mince any words. I hope that helps.
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Pre-tribulation rapture theologians are looking for Jesus to return before the great tribulation.
Someone will show up working signs, miracles, and wonders, but it won't be Jesus; it will be the devil himself. I believe it's possible that pre-tribbers are genuinely looking for Jesus to arrive first and could possibly fall into apostasy by placing their faith in the power of Satan, when someone shows up doing miracles.
2 Thessalonians 2:9-10
9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
Revelation 13:11-15
11And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
Someone will show up working signs, miracles, and wonders, but it won't be Jesus; it will be the devil himself. I believe it's possible that pre-tribbers are genuinely looking for Jesus to arrive first and could possibly fall into apostasy by placing their faith in the power of Satan, when someone shows up doing miracles.
2 Thessalonians 2:9-10
9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
Revelation 13:11-15
11And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
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Yes it's possible for a Spirit-filled believer to be deceived. Jesus warns His disciples in Matthew 24 to not be deceived and says it's possible the elect can be deceived.
Matthew 24:4
4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Matthew 24:24-25
24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25Behold, I have told you before.
Paul also says it's possible that the Spirit-filled believers of Thessaloniki to be deceived and, like Jesus, expounds on the truth in order to avoid deception.
2 Thessalonians 2:3
3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
The devil loves Christians who think they can't be deceived. Avoiding deception is the whole reason we have the Bible.
Matthew 24:4
4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Matthew 24:24-25
24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25Behold, I have told you before.
Paul also says it's possible that the Spirit-filled believers of Thessaloniki to be deceived and, like Jesus, expounds on the truth in order to avoid deception.
2 Thessalonians 2:3
3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
The devil loves Christians who think they can't be deceived. Avoiding deception is the whole reason we have the Bible.
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I've never stated my position, actually. I'm not pre-trib, mid-trib or post-trib. I frankly don't care. All positions can be supported with Scripture depended on how your interpret it. So.. again... total waste of time. You aren't going to change anyone's mind and if you're being honest, you aren't actually concerned with saving anyone. You're doing this for your own self-satisfaction.
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