If any man is in Christ he is a new creature…
When did you become a new creature?
When I was born again. The principle of light was placed within me. A little spark awaiting the fanning action of the Word of God.
PS what I meant to say is gap of time between regeneration and hearing. Of course there is often a gap between hearing and regeneration. That was very true in my life. But I do not see a scriptural basis for a gap between regeneration and hearing, as if you can be regenerated without the Word.
I am pretty much saying the same position as the article I posted a few minutes ago
I came to this position through study of the Word, but when you basically said what I was saying is synergism I checked your claim
No, my argument is a form of monergism as the article shows.
Pretty much we just need to agree to disagree
Here’s the article again if you missed it.
https://www.monergism.com/thethreshold/articles/onsite/reg_word.html
Take care, sir.
From this article are gleamed the Following:
"To clarify, the word of God does not work "ex opere operato," rather, it is the work of the Holy Spirit Himself sovereignly dispensing grace,..."
"Obviously, the word does not have this regenerative affect on every person and some may even be in the presence of the word for years
before the Holy Spirit determines that He will quicken, open and change the disposition of his/her fallen heart. The word will never be heard by some who has no spiritual ears."
"Even our will to be cleansed comes to us through the infusion and working of the Holy Spirit. The desire for faith does not belong to us by nature but is a gift of grace, that is, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit amending our will and turning it from unbelief to faith and from godlessness to godliness."
These are all points that I have made in our discussion. The second paragraph, disqualifies any notion that the Gospel has some kind of regenerative effect.
However, just keep in mind, this is another man's opinion. Just like you and I. If you like others opinions then how about these men:
Albert Barnes - on John 3:8
By some mighty agent, than when we see the trees moved, or the waters of the ocean piled on heaps, or feet the cooling effects of a summer’s breeze. In those cases we attribute it to the “wind,” though we see it not, and though we do not understand its operations. We may learn, hence:
1. That the proper evidence of conversion is the effect on the life.
2.
That we are not too curiously to search for the cause or manner of the change.
3. That God has power over the most hardened sinner to change him, as he has power over the loftiest oak, to bring it down by a sweeping blast.
4. That there may be great variety in the modes of the operation of the Spirit. As the “wind” sometimes sweeps with a tempest, and prostrates all before it, and sometimes breathes upon us in a mild evening zephyr, so it is with the operations of the Spirit. The sinner sometimes trembles and is prostrate before the truth, and sometimes is sweetly and gently drawn to the cross of Jesus.
Where it listeth - Where it “wills” or “pleases.”
So is every one ... - Everyone that is born of the Spirit is, in some respects, like the effects of the wind. You see it not, you cannot discern its laws, but you see its effects,” and you know therefore that it does exist and operate. Nicodemus’ objection was, that he could not “see” this change, or perceive “how” it could be. Jesus tells him that he should not reject a doctrine merely because he could not understand it. Neither could the “wind” be seen, but its effects were well known, and no one doubted the existence or the power of the agent. Compare Ecc_11:5.
John Gill
ye must be born again; in "four" of Beza's copies, it is read "we"; but as Christ was not begotten in a carnal way, or descended not from Adam in the ordinary way of generation, he was not carnal and corrupt, nor in the least tainted with sin; and so stood in no need of regeneration; wherefore such a reading must be rejected. There is a necessity of the regeneration of those, who are the chosen of God, and the redeemed of the Lamb; and of them only can the words be understood; for as for others, they neither can, nor will, nor must be born again: but the people of God "must"; partly because it is the will of God; it is his purpose and resolution, that they shall be regenerated; he has chosen them, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto salvation by Christ: this is the way and method of saving sinners he has fixed upon, namely, not to save them by works of righteousness, but by grace, and according to abundant mercy, through the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Ghost: and partly, because of the case and condition of men, which requires it;
for whereas the chosen people of God, are predestinated to the adoption of children, and are taken into the family of God, and are heirs to an inheritance, it is necessary they should have a nature, temper, and disposition of mind, suitable to the inheritance they are to enjoy; which they have not in their natural estate, and which is conveyed to them in regeneration: besides, their carnal minds are enmity to God, and it is necessary that they should be friendly to him, which cannot be without regeneration; nor can they, till they are born again, please God, or do those things which are pleasing to him: to which may be added, which Christ has before suggested, and which shows the necessity of it, that without it, no man can either see, or enter into the kingdom of God. To take off the surprise of Nicodemus, our Lord instances in a common natural case, and to which this affair of regeneration may be compared, and by it illustrated.
he cannot enter into the kingdom of God; and unless a man has this work of his wrought on his soul, as he will never understand divine and spiritual things, so he can have no right to Gospel ordinances, or things appertaining to the kingdom of God; nor can he be thought to have passed from death to life, and to have entered into an open state of grace, and the kingdom of it; or that living and dying so, he shall ever enter into the kingdom of heaven; for unless a man is regenerated, he is not born heir apparent to it; and without internal holiness, shall not enter into it, enjoy it, or see God.
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