Biblical Eternal Security vs 'Calvinistic Eternal Security' -by Gregg Jackson
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1 John 5:11-12
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
John 5:40
40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
Coming to Christ is to have eternal life (regeneration). Life is in the Son. so, you must come to possess or have the Son to have life
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
John 5:40
40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
Coming to Christ is to have eternal life (regeneration). Life is in the Son. so, you must come to possess or have the Son to have life
lol. I've given you lots of Scripture that refute your talking points.
You have no Scripture that supports your talking points. Titus 2:11 is a very STRONG refutation of your theory.
You believe God CAUSES (FORCES) people to believe.
The verse says the grace of God OFFERS salvation to everyone.
Huge difference.
Obviously, the alternate "facts" are yours.
I've aleady explained that it's not, but you just keep on not listening.
There's no reason to keep discussing with someone who either can't focus or just doesn't want to.
I have all the scriptre I need to know that, yes, God causes people to believe, but HE doesn't use physical force as you're suggesting. You're a NIV paraphraser, so no wonder you're not getting the full counsel of God's word. God's offer of grace is what gifts some with persevering faith, as HE did with me. Thank you Lord. ❤
See? Here you claim what the Bible does NOT teach. So why do you believe it?
To CAUSE someone or something to DO something, does require FORCE. I'm not speaking about thousands of pounds of force, as you seem to be confused about. But the simple fact is that to CAUSE something/someone to DO something means force IS used.
I suggest that you educate yourself on the different translations and which ones actually are paraphrases. To call the NIV a paraphrase is worse than uneducated.
Why don't you just exegete Titus 2:11 then?
Just tell us what Paul meant by that verse.
Yes FG, I thought this is a Bible Discussion Forum. It's good that parties centers discussion on the Bible. If others don't do that, then that's the big problem and it seems you are engaging to others with a non-biblical view.
The Bible indeed teaches faith is a gift of God's grace and God uses HIS grace offer to cause dead souls to respond. I've proven it with scripture, you can disagree all you want, it won't make you right.
So, it's not brute force as you suggested before. More like coaxing, gently nudging, is that what you're saying now. Pffft. You are a real wizz-bang.
God brings dead people to life. How? By force? Try opening your eyes: it's by the power of the Holy Spirit. Power? Must be some awesome power to be able to raise the dead. But, then again, you deny that God's omnipotence includes HIS ability to cause the dead to come alive. And you call yourself a believer? Weird.
Just because you say it, or its publishers say its a literal translation, NIV is a paraphrase, and you're in denial again.
Titus 2:11-12. "11 For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to everyone. 12 It instructs us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live sensible, upright, and godly lives"
Grace saves everyone of the called, the elect and instructs us, the called, the elect. How does grace instruct? By and thorough the gift of persevering faith. Eph. 2:8.
I am educated (Doctorate), and I continue to pursue truth and learn from some of the best, both those still here and those with the Lord. And luckily for me, I also get to learn how not to interpret and believe from the likes of those like yourself who advocate unbiblical positions, and hold to unbiblical antinomian and hypergrace views. So, thank you.
Wow, what a perversion of the Word. Where do you get the idea that a "grace offer is used to CAUSE (make that FORCE) a dead soul to respond". All you've got are very tired Calvinist talking points. None of which are found in Scripture.
What would make you right is to provide the Scripture that proves your claims. Which you haven't, and saying you have repeatedly doesn't make it right.
Now your twisting and perverting my words as well. I NEVER EVER said "brute force". Please quit being so dishonest.
To CAUSE something means to FORCE it. There's no way around it.
An OFFER is the OPPOSITE of using FORCE.
I wasn't talking about regeneration. Of course that is God's action directly. Why do you keep wanting to change the subject?
The issue is believing. The Bible says man believes from his heart. Jerry says man believes because God CAUSES him to. That's FORCE, any way you want to slice it.
Again, you don't know what you are talking about. Prove your claim that the NIV is a paraphrase.
Grace OFFERS salvation to everyone. Calvinism denies that clear fact.
It doesn't show, with all your false claims and dishonest insinuations, and total failure to prove anything you say from Scripture.
And please, prove your ridiculous claim that the NIV is a paraphrase.
What you obviously don't know is that true translations are 1 of 2 kinds; formal and dynamic. But since you claim to be educated, I'll let you do the research for yourself. And while you're at it, find the proof that the NIV is a paraphrase.
You're trapped in wrong antinomian hypergrace theology. I'll pray for you. Bye bye
Then please explain why you believe God CAUSES people to believe when not only there are no verses that say that, but Titus 2;11 says "the grace of God OFFERS salvation to everyone".
Explain why you can't understand that claiming that God CAUSES people to believe or not is the same thing as puppetry.
Explain why you can't understand that "more" and "abundant" are not totally different words.
Explain why you think there is such a thing as too much grace, with your pejorative "hyper-grace".
First, I don't agree with any antinomian theology. But you are free to try to prove that I have.You're trapped in wrong antinomian hypergrace theology. I'll pray for you. Bye bye
Second, do you understand the reuirements for being on praying ground? The Bible is clear.
So, it's bye bye, huh.
Well, that lets you off the hook for any explations. Slick. You can't prove that the NIV is a paraphrase translation.
You can't prove any of your Calvinist talking points from Scripture.
So, taking the easy way out.
There is not an atom of proof in Bruce's story to show that the Holy Spirit did a work of grace in his heart, his "salvation" was wholly contrived by men.
The gospel command is to repent and believe. Not stand up and come to the altar. read a prayer ...