predestination vs freewill
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This concept of free will is the product of a human thought and not Scripture. Note: a few definitions of the word "free will":
noun
3. to exercise ones desires without constraint.
Man possesses the ability to exercise his/her desires BUT not without constraint and man cannot be said to be self determinate. Only God is self determinate. He does as He pleases and He is His own counsel. What God desires that He does. If man had a "free will", then man would be as god. We would not be subject to God's authority or constraints. Only God is self determinate.
Man's will is constrained in many ways:
1) By his own nature. The "will" cannot act contrary to ones own nature. Please read post #254 for more on this.
2) By providential constraints - such as weather, natural calamity, man-made calamity, and diseases. Ex... Your "will" cannot will you out of these types of constraints. You may choose another path of action because of these constraints but your original choice was altered by them. Only God is above these constraints. He would simply alter them to His will. This is why Scripture says: That God is in control of His Providential Government and we are subject too it.
3) By financial constraints - one cannot choose something that is above their means to purchase or obtain it. I may dream of having a Lear Jet but my "will" will not make it happen. I might determine to have this Jet but my lack of finances is the ultimate determiner. Therefore, my "will" is subject to the financial determiner and it would not make commonsense for me to choose this coarse of action knowing it cannot happen.
I hope you understand what I am getting at here. We as a creation are not self determinate. Ultimately, God is the only one "FREE" to carry out His desires and these desires were in the mind of God from the beginning.
Too believe in self determination - free will - is to make oneself as a god. To be equal with God. This is not only heresy of the worst kind but denies every precept of Holy Scripture. For Scripture says: Man's nature, apart from the "Regenerating" work of the Spirit, is "darkness' and his "will" is towards the things of darkness. Darkness does not choose light. (John 1:5 & 3:19; 2 Cor. 6:14; Col. 3:6,7).
Free-willest argue - that God would not force upon a person something he/she did not choose but yet they miss the point. The "will" of the believer WILL, at the appropriate time, CHOOSE Christ and indeed must do so in order to have Salvation. However, there must be a work of Grace in that ones heart in order to bring about this choice. God often and does alter a persons desires. The heart. The seat of man's desires.
Exo_10:20 But Jehovah hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he did not let the children of Israel go.
Deu_30:6 And Jehovah thy God will circumcise thy heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love Jehovah thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.
Pro 21:1 The king's heart is in the hand of Jehovah as the watercourses: He turns it whithersoever he will.
Isa 45:5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me;
Isa 45:6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else.
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create calamity. I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
Isa 45:8 Distil, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, that it may bring forth salvation, and let it cause righteousness to spring up together; I, Jehovah, have created it.
Isa 45:9 Woe unto him that strives with his Maker! a potsherd among the potsherds of the earth! Shall the clay say to him that fashions it, What are you making? or thy work, He has no hands?
Isa 45:10 Woe unto him that says unto a father, What are you begetting? or to a woman, With what are you travailing?
noun
- the power of acting without the constraint of necessity or fate; the ability to act at one's own discretion.
3. to exercise ones desires without constraint.
Man possesses the ability to exercise his/her desires BUT not without constraint and man cannot be said to be self determinate. Only God is self determinate. He does as He pleases and He is His own counsel. What God desires that He does. If man had a "free will", then man would be as god. We would not be subject to God's authority or constraints. Only God is self determinate.
Man's will is constrained in many ways:
1) By his own nature. The "will" cannot act contrary to ones own nature. Please read post #254 for more on this.
2) By providential constraints - such as weather, natural calamity, man-made calamity, and diseases. Ex... Your "will" cannot will you out of these types of constraints. You may choose another path of action because of these constraints but your original choice was altered by them. Only God is above these constraints. He would simply alter them to His will. This is why Scripture says: That God is in control of His Providential Government and we are subject too it.
3) By financial constraints - one cannot choose something that is above their means to purchase or obtain it. I may dream of having a Lear Jet but my "will" will not make it happen. I might determine to have this Jet but my lack of finances is the ultimate determiner. Therefore, my "will" is subject to the financial determiner and it would not make commonsense for me to choose this coarse of action knowing it cannot happen.
I hope you understand what I am getting at here. We as a creation are not self determinate. Ultimately, God is the only one "FREE" to carry out His desires and these desires were in the mind of God from the beginning.
Too believe in self determination - free will - is to make oneself as a god. To be equal with God. This is not only heresy of the worst kind but denies every precept of Holy Scripture. For Scripture says: Man's nature, apart from the "Regenerating" work of the Spirit, is "darkness' and his "will" is towards the things of darkness. Darkness does not choose light. (John 1:5 & 3:19; 2 Cor. 6:14; Col. 3:6,7).
Free-willest argue - that God would not force upon a person something he/she did not choose but yet they miss the point. The "will" of the believer WILL, at the appropriate time, CHOOSE Christ and indeed must do so in order to have Salvation. However, there must be a work of Grace in that ones heart in order to bring about this choice. God often and does alter a persons desires. The heart. The seat of man's desires.
Exo_10:20 But Jehovah hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he did not let the children of Israel go.
Deu_30:6 And Jehovah thy God will circumcise thy heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love Jehovah thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.
Pro 21:1 The king's heart is in the hand of Jehovah as the watercourses: He turns it whithersoever he will.
Isa 45:5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me;
Isa 45:6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else.
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create calamity. I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
Isa 45:8 Distil, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, that it may bring forth salvation, and let it cause righteousness to spring up together; I, Jehovah, have created it.
Isa 45:9 Woe unto him that strives with his Maker! a potsherd among the potsherds of the earth! Shall the clay say to him that fashions it, What are you making? or thy work, He has no hands?
Isa 45:10 Woe unto him that says unto a father, What are you begetting? or to a woman, With what are you travailing?
Here is the verse I believe he was referring too:
Eph_2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.
This verse clearly states that we, believers, are God's workmanship. agreeing with Romans 9:18-23. That the believer's Good Works, were prepared before creation began.
Eph_2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.
This verse clearly states that we, believers, are God's workmanship. agreeing with Romans 9:18-23. That the believer's Good Works, were prepared before creation began.
Thanks for the clarification. To me though, regarding Eph 2:10, I guess it comes down to the Bible's definition of good works.
I see them as being defined by the following:
[Gal 5:22-24 KJV]
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
[Eph 5:9-10 KJV]
9 (For the fruit of the Spirit [is] in all goodness and righteousness and truth
10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
How do you define good works?
Regarding Rom 9:23, my version translates it this way:
[Rom 9:23 KJV]
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Prepared for "glory". That is, the vessels of mercy(the elect) being those which God had "afore" prepared unto glory.
I see them as being defined by the following:
[Gal 5:22-24 KJV]
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
[Eph 5:9-10 KJV]
9 (For the fruit of the Spirit [is] in all goodness and righteousness and truth
10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
How do you define good works?
Regarding Rom 9:23, my version translates it this way:
[Rom 9:23 KJV]
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Prepared for "glory". That is, the vessels of mercy(the elect) being those which God had "afore" prepared unto glory.
There is a difference yes between Free Will and omnipotents I’ve never claimed that one equates the other, of course human free will is contained, by a number of various factors wether this be directly applied by God or part of the mechanics he placed to govern this world, and it’s automation.
After all we are created and so are created to exists within a determined set of parameters, you misconstrued my definition of self determination to include factors outside of my immediate control, to be more accurate even those things within my immediate control are variable based upon my environment and those of effect it,
My point in reference to self determination is indeed subject to the restrictions you’ve stated, with that being said I fail to see how these restrictions alter my thesis on the effects and aspects of free Will as applied by God will, for us to retain individual meaningful choice.
After all we are created and so are created to exists within a determined set of parameters, you misconstrued my definition of self determination to include factors outside of my immediate control, to be more accurate even those things within my immediate control are variable based upon my environment and those of effect it,
My point in reference to self determination is indeed subject to the restrictions you’ve stated, with that being said I fail to see how these restrictions alter my thesis on the effects and aspects of free Will as applied by God will, for us to retain individual meaningful choice.
This is not true! Predestination does not do away with free will.
Scripture states that God foreknew and predestined those whom He chose to give eternal life to. The requirement for those people is to have faith from beginning to end. If they turn away from faith, God is not going to force them into eternal life. They are sealed and have the hope of eternal life, if they continue in faith.
Scripture states that God foreknew and predestined those whom He chose to give eternal life to. The requirement for those people is to have faith from beginning to end. If they turn away from faith, God is not going to force them into eternal life. They are sealed and have the hope of eternal life, if they continue in faith.
Sorry to interrupt but in following your discussion I noticed that you characterize what God has given as being eternal life. I haven't
read all of the posts so sorry if I missed it, but if eternal, how then could be lost since it was eternal ? That is, can someone lose something that was given based upon the promise of it being eternal?
read all of the posts so sorry if I missed it, but if eternal, how then could be lost since it was eternal ? That is, can someone lose something that was given based upon the promise of it being eternal?
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Greetings rogerg,
Eternal life and all of the promises given, are dependent upon the believer continuing from faith to faith. Regarding this, consider the following scriptures:
=============================================================
"But now He has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy, unblemished, and blameless in His presence—if indeed you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope of the gospel you heard"
"But Christ is faithful as the Son over God’s house. And we are His house, if we hold firmly to our confidence and the hope of which we boast.
"We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end."
===============================================================================================
Our salvation and God's promises are dependent upon having faith from beginning to end.
"But My righteous one will live by faith; and if he might shrink back, My soul does not take pleasure in him."
Shrinking back means turning away from faith, complete apostasy.
Eternal life and all of the promises given, are dependent upon the believer continuing from faith to faith. Regarding this, consider the following scriptures:
=============================================================
"But now He has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy, unblemished, and blameless in His presence—if indeed you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope of the gospel you heard"
"But Christ is faithful as the Son over God’s house. And we are His house, if we hold firmly to our confidence and the hope of which we boast.
"We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end."
===============================================================================================
Our salvation and God's promises are dependent upon having faith from beginning to end.
"But My righteous one will live by faith; and if he might shrink back, My soul does not take pleasure in him."
Shrinking back means turning away from faith, complete apostasy.
Precious friend, According To The Scriptures, CHRIST Paid A FULL Sacrifice for The
PENALTY of sin, thus the repentant believer Is Forgiven of ALL sins, upon trust/
faith/belief Of CHRIST And HIS Gospel Of GRACE = ETERNAL Relationship =
Justification!
This is not to be Confused with sanctification, which is the life-long walk,
By GRACE, over the POWER of sin, in Fellowship With CHRIST!
Thus, Salvation is 100 Percent Free, But Eternal Rewards
{incorruptible crown/reigning With HIM!} are 100 percent Earned!
More "studies" here:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
God's FREE Gift of ETERNAL Life!
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
PENALTY of sin, thus the repentant believer Is Forgiven of ALL sins, upon trust/
faith/belief Of CHRIST And HIS Gospel Of GRACE = ETERNAL Relationship =
Justification!
This is not to be Confused with sanctification, which is the life-long walk,
By GRACE, over the POWER of sin, in Fellowship With CHRIST!
Thus, Salvation is 100 Percent Free, But Eternal Rewards
{incorruptible crown/reigning With HIM!} are 100 percent Earned!
More "studies" here:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
God's FREE Gift of ETERNAL Life!
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
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Thanks for the clarification. To me though, regarding Eph 2:10, I guess it comes down to the Bible's definition of good works.
I see them as being defined by the following:
[Gal 5:22-24 KJV]
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
[Eph 5:9-10 KJV]
9 (For the fruit of the Spirit [is] in all goodness and righteousness and truth
10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
How do you define good works?
Regarding Rom 9:23, my version translates it this way:
[Rom 9:23 KJV]
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Prepared for "glory". That is, the vessels of mercy(the elect) being those which God had "afore" prepared unto glory.
I see them as being defined by the following:
[Gal 5:22-24 KJV]
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
[Eph 5:9-10 KJV]
9 (For the fruit of the Spirit [is] in all goodness and righteousness and truth
10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
How do you define good works?
Regarding Rom 9:23, my version translates it this way:
[Rom 9:23 KJV]
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Prepared for "glory". That is, the vessels of mercy(the elect) being those which God had "afore" prepared unto glory.
However, "good works" are not just limited to the things you have written here. They would include all aspects of "running the race" that Paul mentions. This would include: Study of the Scriptures, witnessing, defending the Truth of God, keeping our Lords Commandments, helping those in the faith and so on. Good works is a product of Regeneration and God given faith but it is not a path to Salvation, as we know.
Way too many so-called believers today, deny Romans Chapter 9 and it's principle teaching about the Doctrine of Election. A Pastor once said: "You can tell exactly what a person believes by their interpretation of Romans 9". This statement was made in reference to determining if one is truly in the Faith. Therefore, he suggested, If their interpretation on Romans 9 is wrong, then quit wasting your time in talking with them. Romans 9, not only defines the means of Salvation but it elevates the one behind it to the highest heights. The sovereign God of all creation. No true believer can believe that God is not totally Sovereign. That He purposed all things from Eternity, before the foundation of the world and is carrying out those purposes in time.
Anything that detracts from the Glory of God and Christ's Righteousness and attempts to elevate man's ability above his fallen, wretched and corrupt state, should be avoided at all cost. Even the Elect believers, should not forget that our own righteousness is as "filthy rags" before God. Glory be to God that we have the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ in our account.
My point here is, that you can make meaningful choices but you cannot make choices contrary to your nature or contrary to God's will. Therefore it is not free. The fallen nature by result is "darkness" and thus, will not gravitate towards light. If your will was totally free, it would have the ability to do what you please in every given situation. Only God has the ability to do this. We are subject to Him and our nature. This is why Christ said:
John 6:43, 44 Jesus answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. No man can come to me, (No man has the ability to come because of his fallen, darkened nature) except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day.
John 6:43, 44 Jesus answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. No man can come to me, (No man has the ability to come because of his fallen, darkened nature) except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day.
There are two paths… Life and Death.
We use our free will to choose which path we want. However, each path is predestined to end in either Life or Death.
Those that solidify their decision for Jesus Christ have chosen the Path of Life and are now predestined to inherit eternal life with Christ.
Those that reject salvation in Jesus Christ have chosen the Path of Death which is predestined to end in the second death in the Lake of Fire.
We use our free will to choose which path we want. However, each path is predestined to end in either Life or Death.
Those that solidify their decision for Jesus Christ have chosen the Path of Life and are now predestined to inherit eternal life with Christ.
Those that reject salvation in Jesus Christ have chosen the Path of Death which is predestined to end in the second death in the Lake of Fire.
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This is so wrong in so many ways. Our Salvation is not dependent upon our faith. This is a misunderstanding caused by badly translated verses, such as:
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; (ASV).
This verse should read: even the righteousness from God out of the faithfulness of Jesus Christ to the ones that are believing....
Our Salvation is out of the faithfulness of Christ not our faith. Our faith cannot bring about righteousness, only Christ could bring that about. Our Justification before God was accomplished, as far as God is concerned, before He ever created. He could do this because nothing could stop Jesus Christ from carrying out His work. Therefore, the Father could look upon the work as completed because of His Son's faithful obedience in time was assured, thus, this Righteousness could be imputed to the Old Testament Saints even though Christ had not yet gone to the cross. Just like Salvation for all of God's chosen people is assured. Not by our actions but by God's faithful work in us. This is why Paul wrote:
Rom 8:29 For whom he foreknew, he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren:
Rom 8:30 and whom he foreordained, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Every single one of the words that I have in "red" are past tense in the Greek. How is that possible? The Apostle Paul, here in these verses, is pointing us back to the decrees of God before the foundation of the world. As far as God is concerned, Salvation of His Elect is a done deal. This being the case, then who is going to prevent God's will from being carried out?
Isa_42:16 And I will bring the blind by a way that they know not; in paths that they know not will I lead them; I will make darkness light before them, and crooked places straight. These things will I do, and I will not forsake them.
Too many mistakes in Theology are being made because improper consideration is given to Eternity. Your arguments herein, are Temporal based arguments and do not consider the Eternal God. God, who planned all things in his eternal mind, knows all things because He resides in Eternity and is Eternal. Everything that is and will be are with Him in the "ever present now" -- which is Eternity. Eternity is not just a long time but is a sate of being. What God "purposed" in Eternity before He created anything, will be done exactly as he purposed it in time. Nothing can stop it and nothing can alter it. He is God and we are mere pottery.
Therefore, "faith" cannot be lost in God's Elect because the indwelling Holy Spirit will insure that the Elect believer maintains perseverance. Only those individuals, who are not TRUE believers can fall away because their human faith is only temporary.
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; (ASV).
This verse should read: even the righteousness from God out of the faithfulness of Jesus Christ to the ones that are believing....
Our Salvation is out of the faithfulness of Christ not our faith. Our faith cannot bring about righteousness, only Christ could bring that about. Our Justification before God was accomplished, as far as God is concerned, before He ever created. He could do this because nothing could stop Jesus Christ from carrying out His work. Therefore, the Father could look upon the work as completed because of His Son's faithful obedience in time was assured, thus, this Righteousness could be imputed to the Old Testament Saints even though Christ had not yet gone to the cross. Just like Salvation for all of God's chosen people is assured. Not by our actions but by God's faithful work in us. This is why Paul wrote:
Rom 8:29 For whom he foreknew, he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren:
Rom 8:30 and whom he foreordained, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Every single one of the words that I have in "red" are past tense in the Greek. How is that possible? The Apostle Paul, here in these verses, is pointing us back to the decrees of God before the foundation of the world. As far as God is concerned, Salvation of His Elect is a done deal. This being the case, then who is going to prevent God's will from being carried out?
Isa_42:16 And I will bring the blind by a way that they know not; in paths that they know not will I lead them; I will make darkness light before them, and crooked places straight. These things will I do, and I will not forsake them.
Too many mistakes in Theology are being made because improper consideration is given to Eternity. Your arguments herein, are Temporal based arguments and do not consider the Eternal God. God, who planned all things in his eternal mind, knows all things because He resides in Eternity and is Eternal. Everything that is and will be are with Him in the "ever present now" -- which is Eternity. Eternity is not just a long time but is a sate of being. What God "purposed" in Eternity before He created anything, will be done exactly as he purposed it in time. Nothing can stop it and nothing can alter it. He is God and we are mere pottery.
Therefore, "faith" cannot be lost in God's Elect because the indwelling Holy Spirit will insure that the Elect believer maintains perseverance. Only those individuals, who are not TRUE believers can fall away because their human faith is only temporary.
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All are dead in trespasses and sin, and no one has the ability to come to faith on their own. We are all, by our sin nature, resistant to all things spiritual, including God's grace. While we do have free will, it is limited, the elect can only resist up to a point, because free will is wholly subordinate to God's sovereign will. When God decides that you're done resisting, God can overcome your resistance by HIS sovereign grace.
One must ask themself: "Why did I come to faith and salvation and not my brother or sister, or my son or daughter?" The answer is this: by God's sovereign grace and HIS will, God gifts salvation and faith to whomever HE desires.
One must ask themself: "Why did I come to faith and salvation and not my brother or sister, or my son or daughter?" The answer is this: by God's sovereign grace and HIS will, God gifts salvation and faith to whomever HE desires.
LOL! Wow! Your statement was a real shocker there. Faith is exactly how we are saved and by no other way.
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."
And without faith it is impossible to please God
Everything that you posted above is dependent upon our having faith. Foreknowing and predestining us, means that God chose us for eternal life before the world began. But the promises are still dependent upon having faith.
Who is going to keep God's will from being carried out? Those who turn away from faith. God's not going to force anyone into heaven.
=============================================================================
"But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation—[if] you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel.
"but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house— whose house we are, [if] we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.
"We have come to share in Christ [if] we hold firmly to the end the assurance we had at first."
========================================================================================
Our salvation is sure, if we hold firmly the faith that we had at first until the end.
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."
And without faith it is impossible to please God
Everything that you posted above is dependent upon our having faith. Foreknowing and predestining us, means that God chose us for eternal life before the world began. But the promises are still dependent upon having faith.
Who is going to keep God's will from being carried out? Those who turn away from faith. God's not going to force anyone into heaven.
=============================================================================
"But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation—[if] you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel.
"but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house— whose house we are, [if] we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.
"We have come to share in Christ [if] we hold firmly to the end the assurance we had at first."
========================================================================================
Our salvation is sure, if we hold firmly the faith that we had at first until the end.
Every scripture you quoted is correct of course including your use of tense, Eternity is guaranteed for all the reasons you give, yet there are not isolated unconditional promises, Eternity is conditional on our acceptance of the requirements for it to be attributed to us, we need to repent before God (once) believe in the Lord Jesus Christ (Continually) and receive the Holy Spirt.
John 3:14-18
"And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God."
Every single word in red in the Greek is continuous present tense, that’s a Condition for the promise.
The promises of John 3:14-18 are in no way promises to people who once upon a time believed but eventually moved away without returning. In contrast, they are to people who believe now, in the present, and they go on believing.
John 3:14-18
"And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God."
Every single word in red in the Greek is continuous present tense, that’s a Condition for the promise.
The promises of John 3:14-18 are in no way promises to people who once upon a time believed but eventually moved away without returning. In contrast, they are to people who believe now, in the present, and they go on believing.
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Precious friends,
Conditional blessings/curses WERE under the Law To Israel.
Free GRACE Is UNconditional, UNmerited Favor!:
Today, we unbelievers who repent/believe {once!}, and Are BAPTIZED
By The Holy Spirit Into The Body Of CHRIST, Have ETERNAL Life/Assurance!
We then should walk in good works, and these Are Conditional For
rewards or lack thereof, At The Judgment Seat Of CHRIST!
(Romans - Philemon KJB!), thus:
Salvation is 100 Percent Free, But Eternal Rewards
{incorruptible crown/reigning With HIM!} are 100 percent Earned!
More:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
God's FREE Gift of ETERNAL Life!
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
Conditional blessings/curses WERE under the Law To Israel.
Free GRACE Is UNconditional, UNmerited Favor!:
Today, we unbelievers who repent/believe {once!}, and Are BAPTIZED
By The Holy Spirit Into The Body Of CHRIST, Have ETERNAL Life/Assurance!
We then should walk in good works, and these Are Conditional For
rewards or lack thereof, At The Judgment Seat Of CHRIST!
(Romans - Philemon KJB!), thus:
Salvation is 100 Percent Free, But Eternal Rewards
{incorruptible crown/reigning With HIM!} are 100 percent Earned!
More:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!
God's FREE Gift of ETERNAL Life!
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
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Guess I perceive the fruit of the Spirit to be the all-inclusive source/foundation from which all good works arise for "running the race" . I believe that all of the works that a true believer would undertake, trace back, in one way or the other, to the Spirit's fruit (hope that makes sense) - but I understand your point and can't say that I disagree.
Agreed. It is incongruent to me that those who claim to be Christians, who claim that Christ is their Savior, and yet, deny that He alone, as Savior, bestows salvation (to those whom He had chosen for such). By so doing, they, in effect, deny Him as Savior.
Well said!
Agreed. It is incongruent to me that those who claim to be Christians, who claim that Christ is their Savior, and yet, deny that He alone, as Savior, bestows salvation (to those whom He had chosen for such). By so doing, they, in effect, deny Him as Savior.
Well said!
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