It is you who needs to reread the scripture that you posted above.
Here is the same scripture again except I will highlight the most important part that you missed, which is "the Day of the Lord":
"Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come. Let no one deceive you in any way, for [it] (the day of the Lord) will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness—the son of destruction—is revealed."
The 'coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, is not the same as "The Day of the Lord," which you failed to recognize.
The coming of our Lord and our being gathered to Him = the event of when the church is caught up to meet the Lord in the air.
The Day of the Lord = The time of God's wrath which follows the gathering of the church.
So it is "The Day of the Lord" that will not come until the apostasy occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed. Both of those events are proof that "The Day of the Lord" has come and not our being gathered to Him, which takes place first.
All that you continue to do is misapply scripture. I have had this same discussion regarding this scripture many years prior to this. You're not presenting anything that I haven't already contended against.
The reason that Paul starts off with "Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him" is because there were men in Thessalonica who were teaching that the Day of the Lord, the time of God's wrath, had already come. And since they knew Paul's teaching regarding the Lord appearing and our being gathered to Him to meet him in the air as taking place before God's wrath, they were concerned as to why they had not been caught up according to Paul's teaching.
Pay attention to the change that Paul makes in the scripture from 'our being gathered' vs. 'the Day of the Lord.'
I would suggest that you do a study on 'The Day of the Lord' scriptures. You will find that they all have to do with God's wrath being poured out upon the earth.
==================================================
I will completely sweep away
everything from the face of the earth,”
declares the LORD.
“I will sweep away man and beast;
I will sweep away the birds of the air,
and the fish of the sea,
and the idols with their wicked worshipers.
I will cut off mankind
from the face of the earth,”
==========================================
The great Day of the LORD is near—
near and coming quickly.
Listen, the Day of the LORD!
Then the cry of the mighty will be bitter.
That day will be a day of wrath,
a day of trouble and distress,
a day of destruction and desolation,
a day of darkness and gloom,
a day of clouds and blackness,
a day of horn blast and battle cry
against the fortified cities,
and against the high corner towers.
I will bring such distress on mankind
that they will walk like the blind,
because they have sinned against the LORD.
Their blood will be poured out like dust
and their flesh like dung.
Neither their silver nor their gold
will be able to deliver them
on the Day of the LORD’s wrath.
The whole earth will be consumed
by the fire of His jealousy.”
For indeed, He will make a sudden end
of all who dwell on the earth.
=================================================
The Lord's appearing and our being gathered to Him has nothing to do with the Day of the Lord, the time of God's wrath, except that it takes place prior to said wrath and that because we are not appointed to suffer God's wrath.
In other words, get this thread locked too...So they blocked the other thread only for us to continue discussing it here...
Totally agree. That hypocrite needs to take a good look at that plank in her eye.The biggest hypocrite on these boards runs around calling everyone she disagrees with a hypocrite.
Never bothering to look in the mirror at the monstrous plank in her own eyes.
It is you who needs to reread the scripture that you posted above.
Here is the same scripture again except I will highlight the most important part that you missed, which is "the Day of the Lord":
"Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come. Let no one deceive you in any way, for [it] (the day of the Lord) will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness—the son of destruction—is revealed."
The 'coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, is not the same as "The Day of the Lord," which you failed to recognize.
The coming of our Lord and our being gathered to Him = the event of when the church is caught up to meet the Lord in the air.
The Day of the Lord = The time of God's wrath which follows the gathering of the church.
So it is "The Day of the Lord" that will not come until the apostasy occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed. Both of those events are proof that "The Day of the Lord" has come and not our being gathered to Him, which takes place first.
All that you continue to do is misapply scripture. I have had this same discussion regarding this scripture many years prior to this. You're not presenting anything that I haven't already contended against.
The reason that Paul starts off with "Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him" is because there were men in Thessalonica who were teaching that the Day of the Lord, the time of God's wrath, had already come. And since they knew Paul's teaching regarding the Lord appearing and our being gathered to Him to meet him in the air as taking place before God's wrath, they were concerned as to why they had not been caught up according to Paul's teaching.
Pay attention to the change that Paul makes in the scripture from 'our being gathered' vs. 'the Day of the Lord.'
I would suggest that you do a study on 'The Day of the Lord' scriptures. You will find that they all have to do with God's wrath being poured out upon the earth.
==================================================
I will completely sweep away
everything from the face of the earth,”
declares the LORD.
“I will sweep away man and beast;
I will sweep away the birds of the air,
and the fish of the sea,
and the idols with their wicked worshipers.
I will cut off mankind
from the face of the earth,”
==========================================
The great Day of the LORD is near—
near and coming quickly.
Listen, the Day of the LORD!
Then the cry of the mighty will be bitter.
That day will be a day of wrath,
a day of trouble and distress,
a day of destruction and desolation,
a day of darkness and gloom,
a day of clouds and blackness,
a day of horn blast and battle cry
against the fortified cities,
and against the high corner towers.
I will bring such distress on mankind
that they will walk like the blind,
because they have sinned against the LORD.
Their blood will be poured out like dust
and their flesh like dung.
Neither their silver nor their gold
will be able to deliver them
on the Day of the LORD’s wrath.
The whole earth will be consumed
by the fire of His jealousy.”
For indeed, He will make a sudden end
of all who dwell on the earth.
=================================================
The Lord's appearing and our being gathered to Him has nothing to do with the Day of the Lord, the time of God's wrath, except that it takes place prior to said wrath and that because we are not appointed to suffer God's wrath.
How does it matter when anyone believes they will be raptured? It will happen when it happens. What you or anyone else believes is irrelevant.The Lord's Return and the Day of the Lord are the SAME.
The Day of the Lord is the Second Coming of Christ - They are the SAME DAY.
That is exactly what Isaiah, Jesus, John and Paul have written to us.
You have zero scripture to show a Pre-Trib rapture - there are none.
In every scripture you point to you MUST add meaning that does NOT exist in the passage.
Pre-Trib is a lie and goes against everything taught by the Prophets, Christ and the Apostles.
Christ is coming for us ( You and Me Brother and everyone in Him) . He is coming for His Bride and He is bringing Judgement upon the world.
Daniel and Revelation clearly shows the Saints being persecuted by Satan - this is not new - it started after Christ returned to the Father.
There is only one Gospel Message - not a second one for 'Left Behinders' which is the ENTIRE point Paul makes in 2 Thessalonians.
Just dwell on this - there will be NO ONE (in Christ) LEFT BEHIND
PROOF = and the talk of such men will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, who have deviated from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already occurred, and they undermine the faith of some.
NO ONE (in Christ) will be LEFT BEHIND - there is only One Gospel Message for One Bride = the Elect.
The resurrection occurs at the Lord's Coming BEFORE the rapture - 1 Thess 4:15-17
How does it matter when anyone believes they will be raptured? It will happen when it happens. What you or anyone else believes is irrelevant.
So, your saying God's word , Truth, is irrelevant.
Yeah, read and believe whatever feels good. - I guess you never read Revelation 22:18-19
I testify to everyone who hears the words of prophecy in this book: If anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. And if anyone takes away from the words of this book of prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and the holy city, which are described in this book.…
Revelation 22:18-19
From infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work.…
2 timothy 3:15-17
Every word spoken by God matters.
I didn't say that at all. You just put those words into my mouth. Pre-trip and post-trip can both be interpreted equally in Scripture. Many believe in pre, many believe in post, based on Scripture. In the end, it does not matter when we are raptured. It will happen when it happens. Even if you believe in post.. if it is pre, I'm pretty sure God will take you home anyway, if you are in fact born again.
So, is your intent to try to save people from stumbling?It matters to God as it pertains to His People - The Lord Jesus Christ is the Good Shepherd - He does not lead us into believing a lie.
It matters because Satan has used the lie of pre-trib to dumb down the Church and cause division.
It matters because when the time of testing comes and there is no pre-trib it will cause many to stumble.
AND That matters to the Lord.
Meditate on this: 'no lie is of the truth.' 1 John 2:21
Yeah. That was partially my fault. Sorry, y'all.No-doubt a mod locked it after seeing that the thread had disintegrated into nothing but childish yip-yap with no end in sight...
(That would be my guess.)
So, is your intent to try to save people from stumbling?
Have you tried starting a new thread for that topic? Might get more responses if your question isn't stuck in the middle of a different conversation.Ok -- Somebody please talk to me about this.
Is "The Secret Covenant" a real thing? Nobody will talk to me about it. If it is real, its all part of the New World Order -- which Australia already announced is in play.
Thoughts?!?!?!?!
Look up any medication you like. There will be a laundry list of possible side effects. A good friend of mine was hospitalised earlier this year. She was given an antiviral medication (not a vaccine). It caused her kidneys to fail. It's listed as a potential side effect but the vast majority of people do not get affected. They stopped the treatment and she made a complete recovery. I'm on 3 different meds. They all list various side effects. I've experienced none except tiredness when I first took blood pressure medication.
The choices are simple enough. Vaccinate everyone who is willing. Vaccinate no one. Check out how that works in different countries. Australia has a very low infection and death rate. Our neighbour to the north, Indonesia is running out of room to bury people and new graveyards have to be dug. Their hospitals are being swamped with seriously ill people. It's fine when Indonesian strangers are dying. Who cares, they are probably Muslim anyway. But what if it is a family member or close friend who is suffering? What if you catch it and pass it on to your mother who then dies? You would have to live with that. If you survive the virus yourself, of course.
There is obviously a secret covenant at play here, too many people are doing things that make no sense unless there is.Ok -- Somebody please talk to me about this.
Is "The Secret Covenant" a real thing? Nobody will talk to me about it. If it is real, its all part of the New World Order -- which Australia already announced is in play.
Thoughts?!?!?!?!
Our intent should be yielded to God.
Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, for to this you were called as members of one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God. And whatever you do, in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him.…
My intent is yielded to God. And I believe we will be raptured before the anti-christ is revealed.
I do not believe or have any faith in man. God is not a liar, but men are.Is your belief in man or God?
"Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 1 John 2:18
Do you believe this?
How can your intent be yielded to God if you disagree with His Word?
Is God a liar?