2 Thessalonians 2
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Here - you missed what i said evidently
https://christianchat.com/threads/2-thessalonians-2.199969/post-4607962
https://christianchat.com/threads/2-thessalonians-2.199969/post-4607962
FreeGrace2 said:
But I'd like to see biblical evidence, or even historical evidence for your claim that Jesus came back to earth between AD 67-73.
Why would anyone think I don't know that? Didn't you at least read what i wrote above? Your comment wasn't even close to what I said.
Of course God is the Avenger. He said so.
But at least address what I posted.
But I'd like to see biblical evidence, or even historical evidence for your claim that Jesus came back to earth between AD 67-73.
Why would anyone think I don't know that? Didn't you at least read what i wrote above? Your comment wasn't even close to what I said.
Of course God is the Avenger. He said so.
But at least address what I posted.
It's not that I can't learn from you, it's that I don't want to learn from you. I learn from those who have a clear understanding of Scripture. And the phased resurrections is a fantasy. There are 2 resurrections, both mentioned in the SINGULAR.
So a SINGULAR resurrection doesn't have "phases".
That shouldn't be difficult to grasp.
So a SINGULAR resurrection doesn't have "phases".
That shouldn't be difficult to grasp.
"Yes. Paul is talking in the immediate to the Thessalonian Church. Circa 52AD.
The coming of Our Lord is the Lord taking revenge on his enemies, those of Israel
who rejected him and then persecuted the Church, and the gathering to him is the
assembling of the Church outside of the cauldron of Jerusalem and Judea whilst it burnt to the ground
fifteen years later in AD67-73."
I can hardly believe that any believer actually believes that Jesus came to earth during that time period and gathered the persecuted church while Jerusalem burned.
What a fairy tale.
The coming of Our Lord is the Lord taking revenge on his enemies, those of Israel
who rejected him and then persecuted the Church, and the gathering to him is the
assembling of the Church outside of the cauldron of Jerusalem and Judea whilst it burnt to the ground
fifteen years later in AD67-73."
I can hardly believe that any believer actually believes that Jesus came to earth during that time period and gathered the persecuted church while Jerusalem burned.
What a fairy tale.
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Yes, the Bible is as clear as can be.
Pretribbers believe what isn't stated in the Bible.
The truth is:
1. A singular resurrection for the saved per Acts 24:15 and 1 Cor 15:23. No such thing as phased resurrections.
2. There are two advents of Christ, per Heb 9:28. All believers are resurrected and raptured at the Second Advent, per 2 Thess 2:1 and Rev 20:4,5.
3. There are 2 resurrections, the saved first (Rev 20:4) and 1,000 years later, the GWT judgment (Rev 20:11-15), which is the resurrection of the unsaved.
All supported with Scripture.
What do the pretribbers have? Construct. Assumptions. Presumptions.
Pretribbers believe what isn't stated in the Bible.
The truth is:
1. A singular resurrection for the saved per Acts 24:15 and 1 Cor 15:23. No such thing as phased resurrections.
2. There are two advents of Christ, per Heb 9:28. All believers are resurrected and raptured at the Second Advent, per 2 Thess 2:1 and Rev 20:4,5.
3. There are 2 resurrections, the saved first (Rev 20:4) and 1,000 years later, the GWT judgment (Rev 20:11-15), which is the resurrection of the unsaved.
All supported with Scripture.
What do the pretribbers have? Construct. Assumptions. Presumptions.
You seem to have added something extra-scriptural here.
You say:
Jesus came back to earth
But that is not correct.
Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him
There is no mention of 'back to earth', you've simply added in your own understanding here.
If you understand that God avenges the prophets, then the next question is when did this take place?
You say:
Jesus came back to earth
But that is not correct.
Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him
There is no mention of 'back to earth', you've simply added in your own understanding here.
If you understand that God avenges the prophets, then the next question is when did this take place?
One of the things we know about God is that he is invisible, and that Jesus shares the father's characteristics.
Romans 1: 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
Colossians 1: 15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
So if the Father and Son are invisible, they can go somewhere, be present somewhere, exercise their power somewhere, without being visible.
So when Jesus spoke about coming like a thief in the night, he was referring to just this, exercising his power without being seen.
And conversely, the scripture which confuses everyone, Hebrews 9: 26-28 confuses people because it is talking about the appearing of the Lord, the visible manifestation of the Lord, (to the Church), a quite different thing to God exercising his power invisibly, in this case to the non-Church
Romans 1: 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
Colossians 1: 15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
So if the Father and Son are invisible, they can go somewhere, be present somewhere, exercise their power somewhere, without being visible.
So when Jesus spoke about coming like a thief in the night, he was referring to just this, exercising his power without being seen.
And conversely, the scripture which confuses everyone, Hebrews 9: 26-28 confuses people because it is talking about the appearing of the Lord, the visible manifestation of the Lord, (to the Church), a quite different thing to God exercising his power invisibly, in this case to the non-Church
Acts 1:11
“Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.”
Do you believe almighty a God capable to make Himself visible?
This verse say He will come like when He taking up to heaven, it is visible
“Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.”
Do you believe almighty a God capable to make Himself visible?
This verse say He will come like when He taking up to heaven, it is visible
It's a very good point that you make.
9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.
10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”
I suppose the point here is that
1) Jesus is taken up, that is to say, by the power of the Father
2) He is taken to heaven hidden in cloud
I.E. he is taken to heaven hidden and in the power of the Father
So when he returns he returns hidden, and in the power of the Father.
Matthew 16
27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.28 “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”
9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.
10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”
I suppose the point here is that
1) Jesus is taken up, that is to say, by the power of the Father
2) He is taken to heaven hidden in cloud
I.E. he is taken to heaven hidden and in the power of the Father
So when he returns he returns hidden, and in the power of the Father.
Matthew 16
27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.28 “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”