Love your neighbor vs Governments going to War
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um...Karl Marx was actually German.
I dont hold anything against German people. I think they can be forgiven. Plus, East and West Germany DID unite when the Berlin Wall fell.
The German people I know are all very into gardening. Most organic, permactulturalist people I've met are invariably Germanic. This is very counter to the super industrialists that were typical of an earlier post war generation.
Many Korean people I know are actually Christian.
The Iranian girl I knew wanted to read more of the Bible, and totally distrusted the Koran.
China is a huge country, but most Chinese I know hold family ties as most imortant above all, even when they werent allowed to have more than one child. That sole child is treated like a little king or emperor!, chinese people love their families and it doesnt just mean their own household but going back and across generations. why is china the most populated on the planet its because family is so impotant, there are special words for every type of famalial bond imaginable.
I dont hold anything against German people. I think they can be forgiven. Plus, East and West Germany DID unite when the Berlin Wall fell.
The German people I know are all very into gardening. Most organic, permactulturalist people I've met are invariably Germanic. This is very counter to the super industrialists that were typical of an earlier post war generation.
Many Korean people I know are actually Christian.
The Iranian girl I knew wanted to read more of the Bible, and totally distrusted the Koran.
China is a huge country, but most Chinese I know hold family ties as most imortant above all, even when they werent allowed to have more than one child. That sole child is treated like a little king or emperor!, chinese people love their families and it doesnt just mean their own household but going back and across generations. why is china the most populated on the planet its because family is so impotant, there are special words for every type of famalial bond imaginable.
one has to separate govts, the people in power from the actual people themselves. Not every countries people even agrees with the govt they have, becaus ethey are the selected few powerful elites, just like in Jesus day, he fell out with the Pharisees, the Sanhedrin, and of course the Roman governors.
Most people do not really have a choice over who governs them, even in democratic countries! even if there is a choice its like is it Dick, Tom or Harry and neither really appeals.
However, our spiritual governer is Lord Jesus so we dont choose to identify with any earthly governor, who all have feet of clay.
Most people do not really have a choice over who governs them, even in democratic countries! even if there is a choice its like is it Dick, Tom or Harry and neither really appeals.
However, our spiritual governer is Lord Jesus so we dont choose to identify with any earthly governor, who all have feet of clay.
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Don't knock modern Japanese society. Like the Germans, they discovered the evils of war the hard way. They have changed completely. Until recently, they only permitted a defence force. You won't see them in Iraq or Afghanistan. Should China get from rhetoric to shooting, Japan may be a force to reckon with. They may be able to check China's ambitions in check.
Australia has a great deal of interest in China. We used to be best of friends, but that changed when China decide to annex a huge area of the South China sea. Now they've made enemies of just about everyone in the region. That does not bother them. Japan tried to control the region by force, because it had (and still has) so few natural resources. China has different motives and methods, but still intends to control vast areas of territory that it has no business in.
Don't expect the world to conform to Christian standards, even whey they pay lip service to Christian ideals. The "Christian" nation of America has been at war for over 90% of its existence.
Australia has a great deal of interest in China. We used to be best of friends, but that changed when China decide to annex a huge area of the South China sea. Now they've made enemies of just about everyone in the region. That does not bother them. Japan tried to control the region by force, because it had (and still has) so few natural resources. China has different motives and methods, but still intends to control vast areas of territory that it has no business in.
Don't expect the world to conform to Christian standards, even whey they pay lip service to Christian ideals. The "Christian" nation of America has been at war for over 90% of its existence.
I'm gonna go ahead and break down Romans 13, because it seems like it's being ignored.
"Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which is from God. The authorities that exist have been appointed by God."
He said it twice- government is established by god. All authority comes from him.
"Consequently, whoever resists authority is opposing what God has set in place, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves."
Unless the government is compelling you to do sin... resisting the government is resisting god. That's not going to work out well for you.
"For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Do you want to be unafraid of the one in authority? Then do what is right, and you will have his approval. "
Obviously an evil government can persecute us and try to compel us to sin, but in general the government will not mess with you if you are submissive.
For he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not carry the sword in vain. He is God’s servant, an agent of retribution to the wrongdoer.
Again, he said it twice- HE IS GOD'S SERVANT. Just so there is no confusion. How does he serve god? An agent of retribution. It's the ministry of God's wrath on the earth.
He does not carry the sword in vain. It's not there for decoration- the government is authorized to use force and kill people. Not even Jesus contested this.
This is also why you pay taxes. For the authorities are God’s servants, who devote themselves to their work.
Oh, He said it again. They are God's servants. Knowingly or not- they are his servants. It doesn't mean they are saved, or that everything they do is righteous- but they are his servants.
I don't think it's an easy thing for us to judge what god does with his servants, with respect to governments going to war. We know that...
"From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands."
And we know why he did it...
God intended that they would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us.
How does that even make sense? Because when man is united...
“Behold, they are one people, and they have all one language, and this is only the beginning of what they will do. And nothing that they propose to do will now be impossible for them."
We will no longer think we need god- because together we can accomplish anything inside of creation without God. But without him we would all still die and go to hell. In the end, nearly everyone will be seduced by the power of mankind united.
That's why there are nations; that's why we go to war and kill each other. It cant' be any other way until the end. God uses wars to judge entire nations, the new testament DOES NOT change that, and the reasons we think we are going to war are not always the actual reason.
As Christians, we are to love one another, and do the ministry of reconciliation in the Church. But make no mistake- God is still a god of wrath- and the authorities are one of the ways that God accomplishes his wrath. That doesn't mean that there is no mercy in government... we all know gods mercy when we don't get pulled over for speeding, or there is something you do, or have done that the authorities have not squashed you because of God's mercy alone. But the government doesn't act like the Church simply because it is not the Church- it's power and authority is different, but it comes from the same place.
The Wrath of God, and the Love of God are one and the same: He either gives mercy, or executes wrath because his love requires it. So, when nations go to war his love is present, not absent, and regardless of outcome victory always belongs to the Lord.
"Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which is from God. The authorities that exist have been appointed by God."
He said it twice- government is established by god. All authority comes from him.
"Consequently, whoever resists authority is opposing what God has set in place, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves."
Unless the government is compelling you to do sin... resisting the government is resisting god. That's not going to work out well for you.
"For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Do you want to be unafraid of the one in authority? Then do what is right, and you will have his approval. "
Obviously an evil government can persecute us and try to compel us to sin, but in general the government will not mess with you if you are submissive.
For he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not carry the sword in vain. He is God’s servant, an agent of retribution to the wrongdoer.
Again, he said it twice- HE IS GOD'S SERVANT. Just so there is no confusion. How does he serve god? An agent of retribution. It's the ministry of God's wrath on the earth.
He does not carry the sword in vain. It's not there for decoration- the government is authorized to use force and kill people. Not even Jesus contested this.
This is also why you pay taxes. For the authorities are God’s servants, who devote themselves to their work.
Oh, He said it again. They are God's servants. Knowingly or not- they are his servants. It doesn't mean they are saved, or that everything they do is righteous- but they are his servants.
I don't think it's an easy thing for us to judge what god does with his servants, with respect to governments going to war. We know that...
"From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands."
And we know why he did it...
God intended that they would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us.
How does that even make sense? Because when man is united...
“Behold, they are one people, and they have all one language, and this is only the beginning of what they will do. And nothing that they propose to do will now be impossible for them."
We will no longer think we need god- because together we can accomplish anything inside of creation without God. But without him we would all still die and go to hell. In the end, nearly everyone will be seduced by the power of mankind united.
That's why there are nations; that's why we go to war and kill each other. It cant' be any other way until the end. God uses wars to judge entire nations, the new testament DOES NOT change that, and the reasons we think we are going to war are not always the actual reason.
As Christians, we are to love one another, and do the ministry of reconciliation in the Church. But make no mistake- God is still a god of wrath- and the authorities are one of the ways that God accomplishes his wrath. That doesn't mean that there is no mercy in government... we all know gods mercy when we don't get pulled over for speeding, or there is something you do, or have done that the authorities have not squashed you because of God's mercy alone. But the government doesn't act like the Church simply because it is not the Church- it's power and authority is different, but it comes from the same place.
The Wrath of God, and the Love of God are one and the same: He either gives mercy, or executes wrath because his love requires it. So, when nations go to war his love is present, not absent, and regardless of outcome victory always belongs to the Lord.
The same commandment of love your neighbor existed in the old testerment, and God commanded 50 wars or so in the old testerment as leader and chief of the twelve tribes of isreal. so i dont think you can relate love your neighbor to going to war. but you could still pray for your enemy in war. what actions soilders take against terroist nations is goverment decision soilders just have to go along with it.
nz govt didnt want anything to do with US when they wanted to send nuclear frigates to NZ or France when they wanted to test nuclear weapons in the pacific.
It was like do it in your own country soil dont use the Pacific ocean as a military outpost to fight with everyone else. Pacific means PEACEFUL
The ocean is already tired of being used as a dumping ground for plastic for people that cant be bothered to look after it.
It was like do it in your own country soil dont use the Pacific ocean as a military outpost to fight with everyone else. Pacific means PEACEFUL
The ocean is already tired of being used as a dumping ground for plastic for people that cant be bothered to look after it.
because people were powerless to stop bigger nations from taking over I remember they would decide to boycott goods and trade coming from those countries. Think they are called trade sanctions.
To some extent it works but that just means the larger nation will turn to some other smaller nation and try to bully them. Thing is economies of scale can work but rarely in a smaller nations favour.
To some extent it works but that just means the larger nation will turn to some other smaller nation and try to bully them. Thing is economies of scale can work but rarely in a smaller nations favour.
What does "love your neighbor" mean? Just love those close by (say, within 2 miles), but it is OK to drop bombs on those in North Korea and Iran (thus killing them and sending them to an eternal hell)?
The government is given the sword (Romans 13), but the believer is of a different kingdom and our "weapon" is love to all.
The government is given the sword (Romans 13), but the believer is of a different kingdom and our "weapon" is love to all.
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