divorce, remarrriage and separation- Bibically?

Hungry · Jul 17, 2021

How would that be? in what way possible could a man's wife prevent him from fully serving the Lord? if God has called a man into service He will provide ABUNDANTLY [as you yourself quote ... or half quote] both for the husband and the wife.
Yet that’s what it says.
If He doesn't I would question the calling. Anybody who thinks they can just abandon their wife and kids to serve the Lord is heading for big, big trouble.

Evmur · Jul 17, 2021

Hungry said:

You say you have a calling, that God is preparing you ... I don't know, how could I? but I can see that you are going about it all the wrong way. I doubt if you will listen until you've done yourself and your family unrepairable hurt. ... and you won't have a ministry.

You have to wait until God speaks to your wife, she has to hear from the Lord herself.

TheLearner · Jul 17, 2021

To my knowledge Jesus never addressed the situation of physical abuse. In such a case I see no prohibition of a separation until the family can go through counseling and the abuser is committed to a third party as a councilor.

The Catholic Church has made a biblical case for annulment.
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/davearmstrong/2016/08/biblical-evidence-for-annulments.html

1 Corinthians 7:15 ESV / 73 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
But if the unbelieving partner separates, let it be so. In such cases the brother or sister is not enslaved. God has called you to peace.

Numbers 30:1-16 ESV / 19 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
Moses spoke to the heads of the tribes of the people of Israel, saying, “This is what the Lord has commanded. If a man vows a vow to the Lord, or swears an oath to bind himself by a pledge, he shall not break his word. He shall do according to all that proceeds out of his mouth. “If a woman vows a vow to the Lord and binds herself by a pledge, while within her father's house in her youth, and her father hears of her vow and of her pledge by which she has bound herself and says nothing to her, then all her vows shall stand, and every pledge by which she has bound herself shall stand. But if her father opposes her on the day that he hears of it, no vow of hers, no pledge by which she has bound herself shall stand. And the Lord will forgive her, because her father opposed her. ...

1 Corinthians 7:11 ESV / 7 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
(but if she does, she should remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband), and the husband should not divorce his wife.

Numbers 5:16-28
New Revised Standard Version
16 Then the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the Lord; 17 the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel, and take some of the dust that is on the floor of the tabernacle and put it into the water. 18 The priest shall set the woman before the Lord, dishevel the woman’s hair, and place in her hands the grain offering of remembrance, which is the grain offering of jealousy. In his own hand the priest shall have the water of bitterness that brings the curse. 19 Then the priest shall make her take an oath, saying, “If no man has lain with you, if you have not turned aside to uncleanness while under your husband’s authority, be immune to this water of bitterness that brings the curse. 20 But if you have gone astray while under your husband’s authority, if you have defiled yourself and some man other than your husband has had intercourse with you,” 21 —let the priest make the woman take the oath of the curse and say to the woman—“the Lord make you an execration and an oath among your people, when the Lord makes your uterus drop, your womb discharge; 22 now may this water that brings the curse enter your bowels and make your womb discharge, your uterus drop!” And the woman shall say, “Amen. Amen.”

23 Then the priest shall put these curses in writing, and wash them off into the water of bitterness. 24 He shall make the woman drink the water of bitterness that brings the curse, and the water that brings the curse shall enter her and cause bitter pain. 25 The priest shall take the grain offering of jealousy out of the woman’s hand, and shall elevate the grain offering before the Lord and bring it to the altar; 26 and the priest shall take a handful of the grain offering, as its memorial portion, and turn it into smoke on the altar, and afterward shall make the woman drink the water. 27 When he has made her drink the water, then, if she has defiled herself and has been unfaithful to her husband, the water that brings the curse shall enter into her and cause bitter pain, and her womb shall discharge, her uterus drop, and the woman shall become an execration among her people. 28 But if the woman has not defiled herself and is clean, then she shall be immune and be able to conceive children.

CS1 · Jul 17, 2021

Hungry said:

My wife was just like that too, and God got ahold of her and she has changed and so have I

pray them through

CS1 · Jul 17, 2021

Hungry said:

I think it is important to learn it is not the job of a " wife" to make a man happy

. the One flesh is speaking in the body through sexual relationships and in purpose as they Both serve the Lord in the roles God called them to.

CS1 · Jul 17, 2021

TheLearner said:

To my knowledge Jesus never addressed the situation of physical abuse. In such a case I see no prohibition of a separation until the family can go through counseling and the abuser is committed to a third party as a councilor.

The Catholic Church has made a biblical case for annulment.
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/davearmstrong/2016/08/biblical-evidence-for-annulments.html

1 Corinthians 7:15 ESV / 73 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
But if the unbelieving partner separates, let it be so. In such cases the brother or sister is not enslaved. God has called you to peace.

Numbers 30:1-16 ESV / 19 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
Moses spoke to the heads of the tribes of the people of Israel, saying, “This is what the Lord has commanded. If a man vows a vow to the Lord, or swears an oath to bind himself by a pledge, he shall not break his word. He shall do according to all that proceeds out of his mouth. “If a woman vows a vow to the Lord and binds herself by a pledge, while within her father's house in her youth, and her father hears of her vow and of her pledge by which she has bound herself and says nothing to her, then all her vows shall stand, and every pledge by which she has bound herself shall stand. But if her father opposes her on the day that he hears of it, no vow of hers, no pledge by which she has bound herself shall stand. And the Lord will forgive her, because her father opposed her. ...

1 Corinthians 7:11 ESV / 7 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
(but if she does, she should remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband), and the husband should not divorce his wife.

Numbers 5:16-28
New Revised Standard Version
16 Then the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the Lord; 17 the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel, and take some of the dust that is on the floor of the tabernacle and put it into the water. 18 The priest shall set the woman before the Lord, dishevel the woman’s hair, and place in her hands the grain offering of remembrance, which is the grain offering of jealousy. In his own hand the priest shall have the water of bitterness that brings the curse. 19 Then the priest shall make her take an oath, saying, “If no man has lain with you, if you have not turned aside to uncleanness while under your husband’s authority, be immune to this water of bitterness that brings the curse. 20 But if you have gone astray while under your husband’s authority, if you have defiled yourself and some man other than your husband has had intercourse with you,” 21 —let the priest make the woman take the oath of the curse and say to the woman—“the Lord make you an execration and an oath among your people, when the Lord makes your uterus drop, your womb discharge; 22 now may this water that brings the curse enter your bowels and make your womb discharge, your uterus drop!” And the woman shall say, “Amen. Amen.”

23 Then the priest shall put these curses in writing, and wash them off into the water of bitterness. 24 He shall make the woman drink the water of bitterness that brings the curse, and the water that brings the curse shall enter her and cause bitter pain. 25 The priest shall take the grain offering of jealousy out of the woman’s hand, and shall elevate the grain offering before the Lord and bring it to the altar; 26 and the priest shall take a handful of the grain offering, as its memorial portion, and turn it into smoke on the altar, and afterward shall make the woman drink the water. 27 When he has made her drink the water, then, if she has defiled herself and has been unfaithful to her husband, the water that brings the curse shall enter into her and cause bitter pain, and her womb shall discharge, her uterus drop, and the woman shall become an execration among her people. 28 But if the woman has not defiled herself and is clean, then she shall be immune and be able to conceive children.

Jesus did not have to address physical abuse it is a know-brainer. If you are not to abuse your neighbor surely one's wife is also included.

Paul said we are to love our wife as Christ loved the Church and gave himself for it. If one can't see physical abuse is NOT Loving your wife, they have serious issues

Gideon300 · Jul 17, 2021

unabashedlly said:

A vexed question. Some say that under no circumstances can a divorced person remarry. To me, it makes God a monster, punishing the innocent party for the sins of another. Divorce and remarriage are not the unforgivable sins. Neither is adultery for that matter. God is not a monster.

I'm divorced. When I was young and ignorant, I was hard line on the issue of divorce. It's easier to be that way when you are single. I've not remarried, but I have no qualms about it. I've asked someone to marry me. She's not one to rush things so I've not received an answer.

Hardliners should remember David and Bathsheba. David's sin was way worse than most divorce cases. He was an adulterer and a murderer. God did not force him to break off the relationship. The child of sin died, but Bathsheba's son, Solomon, took the throne.

David paid a huge price for his sins. Divorce should only ever be the very last resort. I can testify to that from experience. However, God can make all things work together for good. I can testify to that also.

God's principles never change. His ways of dealing with men may change. No one gets executed for breaking the sabbath laws, for example. It pays to remember that God has ways of making us wish that we'd followed His principles. Mostly, it is by letting us experience the consequences of our wrong actions.

Gideon300 · Jul 17, 2021

Anna_Marie said:

Is adultery the unforgivable sin? Divorce, will that send you to hell? David did not divorce his first wife, but he threw her out, which is probably worse. David was an adulterer and murderer. Is David in hell now? If you look at other scriptures, you will find that there are times when divorce is acceptable. I am divorced and I know the cost. I also know that an unequally yoked marriage is spiritually suffocating. Divorce should be the last resort, but God knows every heart and His mercy and grace are available to everyone. Even divorcees.

Hungry · Jul 17, 2021

Evmur said:

Clearly you have read very little of what was written. If waiting on instruction from the Lord is going about things the wrong way then one of us needs to get his facts straight. If my wife isn’t talking to God, then chances of her hearing Him are slight.

oyster67 · Jul 17, 2021

Hungry said:

You seem to want to slice and dice her in every post. Do you love her?

Hungry · Jul 18, 2021

oyster67 said:

Love is such an overused term. I agape love her if you understand what that means. I want what’s best for her and for her to know joy that I have for every living thing. The affectionate love you might be speaking of, the kind that makes me miss her when she’s gone, that warms my heart when she smiles, reminisce about the old days and look forward to retirement to watch the sunset under a blanket on the porch swing, hasn’t been there for 20 years. Those feelings are born out of compassion towards you. It is a neurological response to acceptance and kindness. It’s how God made us to be addicted to each other. I have no such addiction. Every day I wake up to a job (husband) I despise because my boss (wife) is never happy. Instead of making things easier, the boss makes them harder. The boss just sits at a desk demanding from everyone and criticizing the speed and quality produced. Sure you might get a thank you for your trouble, but no paycheque. There is no reward when the tasks are completed only five minutes of silence before the next ridiculous request.

I asked God how long I must endure her and He answered me this:

“Does the kite hate the string? The kite only flies higher because of the string. You think she is holding you back but in essence it is because of her that you have soared so high.”

I know God is right, He always is. Because of her incessant needs it has forced me to change careers tripling my wages in five years. Her need to be loved birthed four children whose needs and extracurricular activities caused me to be more patient, organized and selfless. Her lack of sexual appetite led me to the gym to attain a physique any twenty year old would be proud of. Her insatiable desire for comfort and luxury has forced me to become an accomplished carpenter and designer. Twenty-five years ago my level of skills and confidence was weak. I was comfortable and lazy. I worked hard but didn’t care to improve myself. My former self as a man I would rate myself a 5. As a husband a 7 and a father a 7. Today as a man 9, as a husband 9, and a father 9. I owe this truly to my wife pushing me every step of the way, never accepting less. She is the catalyst to my development. I recognize this. It wasn’t her love that inspired me to be greater. It was her narcissistic tendencies that forced me out of my comfort zone, to appease her so she could be seemingly human with the children. If I had left, the full brunt of her need would have squarely landed on them. For them I stay but because I stayed, I got stronger. I could not have stayed in this prison alone. The Lord is with me. He guides me and strengthens me. He knew this is what I needed to grow into the man He will use. I am clay in His hand. I do what He asks, unto death. This prison caused me to have no affinity for life. Does this answer your question, do I love her?

TheLearner · Jul 18, 2021

read to here

SomeDisciple · Jul 18, 2021

Hungry said:

I've grown pretty cold to the word "love" myself. I feel like it's a dumbing down of language that needs to be reversed.

Hungry said:

Ha! (I know it's not funny, but also, it is, isn't it?)

Hungry said:

While I really don't think that this is quite how marriage is theoretically supposed to work; it's kinda like how Jesus learned to obey god and was perfected through suffering. Though, what you call a prison probably wouldn't sound so bad to someone in an actual prison... and Jesus probably would have preferred that to being torture-executed as a criminal... but I get your meaning.

Hungry said:

-It sounds to me like you "love" her. It sounds like you might not be "thankful" for her, though, and I only say this because I have thankfulness issues myself. There's always someone or something standing in the way of my ambitions, and I get frustrated.
-It also sounds like she might not be thankful for you either. Or maybe give you due honor. I wonder if she knows how you feel, and if she would care if she did know.
-Maybe you just need a vacation?

NOV25 · Jul 18, 2021

unabashedlly said:

Are you bound to a wife seek not to be loosed. Are you loosed from a wife seek not a wife but and if you do marry it is not a sin... Paul.

TheLearner · Jul 18, 2021

as I recall there are four greek words for love.
agape = God's Love
brotherly love
eros = sexual love
I forget the fourth word and its meaning.

jb · Jul 19, 2021

unabashedlly said:

You should find This study interesting...

TheLearner · Jul 19, 2021

jb said:

"

1 Peter 2:20-25

Easy-to-Read Version

20 But if you are punished for doing wrong, there is no reason to praise you for bearing that punishment. But if you suffer for doing good and you are patient, this pleases God. 21 This is what you were chosen to do. Christ gave you an example to follow. He suffered for you. So you should do the same as he did:
22 “He never sinned,
and he never told a lie.”
23 People insulted him, but he did not insult them back. He suffered, but he did not threaten anyone. No, he let God take care of him. God is the one who judges rightly. 24 Christ carried our sins in his body on the cross. He did this so that we would stop living for sin and live for what is right. By his wounds you were healed. 25 You were like sheep that went the wrong way. But now you have come back to the Shepherd and Protector of your lives.
"

From the Study,

"f. Submission to an unbelieving husband, partnership with a believing wife. Submission and living with an unbelieving husband. In 1Pet.3v1-6., Peter gives a totally different emphasis, he states how a Christian wife must act if they are married to an unbeliever. a) Many more women than men have been converted in Church history, so the combination of a believing wife with an unbelieving husband has been a common occurrence. A Christian woman must not argue with or preach at their unbelieving husband, but submit, and win their husbands without a word. In 1Pet.2v11 to 3v8., Peter suggests that a Christian wife should be prepared to stand some abuse, he says “Likewise ye wives,” and infers that wives are to stand some buffeting like slaves, and be submissive even to the harsh, and take ill treatment patiently like Jesus. Submission means that we trust God to work things out, like Jesus, who though brutally treated, “kept entrusting himself to Him who judges righteously.” 1Pet.2v23. " https://truthforthelastdays.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/marriage_and_divorce.pdf

1 Peter 3:1
Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;

1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Ephesians 5:28
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

I am assuming you did not read the full article. There is no excuse for misreading and misapply scripture as the author of the article does.

jb · Jul 19, 2021

TheLearner said:

"

1 Peter 2:20-25

Easy-to-Read Version

20 But if you are punished for doing wrong, there is no reason to praise you for bearing that punishment. But if you suffer for doing good and you are patient, this pleases God. 21 This is what you were chosen to do. Christ gave you an example to follow. He suffered for you. So you should do the same as he did:
22 “He never sinned,
and he never told a lie.”
23 People insulted him, but he did not insult them back. He suffered, but he did not threaten anyone. No, he let God take care of him. God is the one who judges rightly. 24 Christ carried our sins in his body on the cross. He did this so that we would stop living for sin and live for what is right. By his wounds you were healed. 25 You were like sheep that went the wrong way. But now you have come back to the Shepherd and Protector of your lives.
"

From the Study,

"f. Submission to an unbelieving husband, partnership with a believing wife. Submission and living with an unbelieving husband. In 1Pet.3v1-6., Peter gives a totally different emphasis, he states how a Christian wife must act if they are married to an unbeliever. a) Many more women than men have been converted in Church history, so the combination of a believing wife with an unbelieving husband has been a common occurrence. A Christian woman must not argue with or preach at their unbelieving husband, but submit, and win their husbands without a word. In 1Pet.2v11 to 3v8., Peter suggests that a Christian wife should be prepared to stand some abuse, he says “Likewise ye wives,” and infers that wives are to stand some buffeting like slaves, and be submissive even to the harsh, and take ill treatment patiently like Jesus. Submission means that we trust God to work things out, like Jesus, who though brutally treated, “kept entrusting himself to Him who judges righteously.” 1Pet.2v23. " https://truthforthelastdays.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/marriage_and_divorce.pdf

1 Peter 3:1
Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;

1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Ephesians 5:28
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

I am assuming you did not read the full article. There is no excuse for misreading and misapply scripture as the author of the article does.

I have studied it fully, that means every Scripture in the study, and there is no misapplication of Scripture by the author.

Your rash comment (for you have certainly not fully read it, never mind studied it) is in line with your ChristianChat name, so I suggest you stop commenting on subjects you know little about or nothing about, and do some "learning."

TheLearner · Jul 19, 2021

jb said:

So, you are ok with
"Christian wife should be prepared to stand some abuse ".
infers that wives are to stand some buffeting like slaves,
Thus a wife is a slave?
You are good with beating one's wife?

TheIndianGirl · Jul 19, 2021

Matthew 5:27-28
Adultery
27 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’[a] 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Probably 99% of all married spouses have committed adultery of the heart, so I think it is "fair" to call it even on this and thus it may not be enough of a reason for divorce. The more distant a couple is with each other, they more likely they are going to commit adultery of the heart. I do think that Jesus is saying adultery of the heart is just as severe as physical adultery, but whether adultery of the heart, being that it is so rampant, is grounds for divorce is questionable given that God hates divorce. Adultery of the heart may be one area where you have to trust God to deal with the adulterous spouse, rather than go through divorce. While God may view both types of adultery equality severe, people generally don't for a variety of reasons (for ex. adultery of the heart is only imaginary, adultery of the heart does not produce children, etc.).

divorce, remarrriage and separation- Bibically?

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