Am I fit to judge other Christians ?

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Jun 9, 2021
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#61
here’s the thing ehomis going to determine which of us “ is that spiritual judge or the others “?

if we as Christians follow
Moses law were not going to ever hear what Jesus is saying . The reason I brought Moses law up is that Moses judgement was “ you all peer at the other peoples sins against the law , then you witness against the person sinning , father one more witness that witnesses thier sin then point it out to the judge , then all of you father and put the sinner to death because you are to be a holy nations you must purge the evil from among you point out and kill the sinners you people are the correcter and judge of everyone else .

that’s Old Testament when man had no judgement to offer it was sinners accusing and stoning other sinners in order to keep thier camp “holy “

then the sinner was hanged on a tree as a curse and warning so all who saw would fear and not do what the sinner did so the process is two of Gods people watching for others sin , pointing it out and then all execute the sinner

the New Testament is contrary it says “ judge your own self by your sins before you start seeing everyone else as sinners “ the contrary is very stark and comes to a collision here Moses commanded us to judge and carry out judgement on sinners but that’s not the gospel it was something inferior until Christ came here’s the proof of what we need to do when seeing a sinner

“And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst, They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last:

( before she could be saved from her sin he drove them all away by telling the. Turn the judgement on your self first and everyone of them the eldest and wisest forst ealked away and left the one judge of thy is woman alone with her )

“and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:3-5, 7,

if we’re Moses followers we’re going to be in the crowd with a stone in our hand the stone of accusation , pointing out in front of the church , the cite we living Christians make on sinners trying to get eighth and already understand they are far from perfect , but us nature Christians are at the door explaining all they need to do to get inside but we won’t go in ourselves because we’re appointed doorkeeper

those sinners are coming to Jesus not because when they get close he starts pointing out thoer sins , they come to Jesus because he’s telling them how to know the true God and his word and have eternal Life even though they have sinned many times before and are most likely aware that’s why they hear his message of forgiveness and respond

but often we’re holding the. Back because we have imagined ourself arbitrator between Jesus and sinners were the ones needing to hear what he said


Before you turn judgement into a Doctrine, where in my post you quoted is incorrect and judging un-righteously?

From My Post:
Discernment is a radar scanner for Demonic Presence/Possession/Activity. Discernment is also a radar for knowing when someone is lying to you, hiding something, not being completely honest. Discernment is a radar to know when you're around other Holy Spirit filled Believers in Christ. Even though, none of what I just mentioned uses the word judgement in it, it is all 100% judgement 24/7/365.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#62
Alright, given that none of us is perfect, and never will be in this life, when do we call out the wrongdoing of others? Never?
right never call then out , of you care about the person do what Jesus said go privately to the person between just you and them not as an accuser but as a lovong brother trying to help them understand the inportsnce of the thing you feel God is telling you to help them understand

it’s not us calling out each other anymore dear brother , we have to forst love the sinner like Jesus did , we have to first be willing to pit thoer soul above our pride . My point has never been what you have to do I’m no one brother I’m imperfect probably more than others I suspect but that’s the point of it all God loves you even though your not perfect but he feels the same way about the person we are judging a sinner even as we acknowledge I’m a sinner too

we just aren’t supposed to call our people we’re supposed to try to help then hear the gospel and that’s enough to show then what their lord and savior said that’s what saves us. Either what Jesus had to say about things his jidgements are the light of the world so instead of me the sinner calling out you the sinner , shouldn’t I talk about the repentance Jesus talked about like repenting from the accusation part and start being a worker in the healing part ? The part that doesn’t drive us away from God but invites sinners close to Jesus so he can touch their heart so the his words of eternal Life

my own personal thoughts and beliefs brother is all I have my faith , so don’t think I’m trying to tell you what you have to think and do that’s not my point at all I’m trying to be. Enter in my own life very flawed but I’m trying to carry my cross md acknowledge my own sins with him and I personally can’t get past the part where I still have a pretty big bunch of mud on my eye and I’m aware perfectly of it so I personally me from my own perspective think it’s the right way but again that’s my own belief from hearing the lord others have to walk by what he’s told them

here’s benefit I’m not judging think of it brother even in a secular setting of you tell Ten people they are the one to keep the others in line , all ten are going to constantly bicker and point at the others when they all need to look in the mirror first tha the my whole point anything that promotes division isn’t worth it unless the person is actually teaching heresy

of the issue is one guy believes he needs to keep an ot ordinance ,like a sabbath day , the other guy knows better neither person is sinning or wrong and neither needs correction

but if one guy is having an affair nt I discover it as a brother I need to go to him because o care and know he’s headed down a bad road

of he keeps the sabbath TV on Saturday and I on Sunday ot I not at all no one needs to jidge the other

we need to make sure sin is sin first and also need to
Make sure we’re qualified to be judging thy says why I started the op to hopefully get someone to hear what Jesus said nt look forst at themself “ am I correcting people the right way ? For the right purpose ? Am I also just as needful of repentance in my own life as they ? Should I mention that as I’m trying to help them ? Or should it be me above and then below ? Me righteous then a sinner ? Is worthy to sit at his table and eat with him and they unworthy sinner?

I’m not making any accusation I’m trying to bring up the thought so people can consider “ I’m a meant to be judging ? What even is it to judge ? Can I be judgemental in how I look at others if o don’t speak ? Just a consideration not a seed for argument and contention even if someone totally disagrees it doesn’t mean we have to argue there’s value in stating the case and considering the other side and just letting it sit awhile

I hope there are no hard feelings , there aren’t towards you or anyone else for my part it’s just Christians who believe a lot in what’s hey know and sometimes we get a little hard hearted all of us me too but we can still work on getting better ourself and sharing the gospel thy ate just alllll what impersonally think
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#63
Before you turn judgement into a Doctrine, where in my post you quoted is incorrect and judging un-righteously?

From My Post:
Discernment is a radar scanner for Demonic Presence/Possession/Activity. Discernment is also a radar for knowing when someone is lying to you, hiding something, not being completely honest. Discernment is a radar to know when you're around other Holy Spirit filled Believers in Christ. Even though, none of what I just mentioned uses the word judgement in it, it is all 100% judgement 24/7/365.
Where have I accused you of doing anything ? Your confusing a discussion from two points of view with me attacking you personally were not enemies we have differing views about the topics of judging others and who’s worthy to do that

are you sinless ? Not an accusation but a question to know what your position is are you the one that has the godly judgement ? Again asking you
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
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#64
Where have I accused you of doing anything ? Your confusing a discussion from two points of view with me attacking you personally were not enemies we have differing views about the topics of judging others and who’s worthy to do that

are you sinless ? Not an accusation but a question to know what your position is are you the one that has the godly judgement ? Again asking you
So, your post to mine is a confirmation but your adding other Scripture to go along with my Views?
Then I apologize.
It's why I asked the question instead of just claiming you did something you did not do!
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#65
So, your post to mine is a confirmation but your adding other Scripture to go along with my Views?
Then I apologize.
It's why I asked the question instead of just claiming you did something you did not do!
yes brother I would challenge you to observe a few threads in the forum and you will realize a lot of the arguing that occurs between us is because we have taken something someone said the wrong way in the wrong spirit .

I often have too much to say too quickly I sincerely apologize for how that works I fight against doing it but I haven’t worked it out yet

so I feel Like sometimes as whit others haopens also , I say things a certain way and if someone knew me they would know when I’m joking a bit or when I’m just trying to make a point to add to or support what they said , not always mind you but “sometimes we say the same things differently and we perceive that it’s saying dofferent thkngs “

I think it’s partly because we have nonreal
Knowledge of each others personalities and were all a bit different we speak differently using different ideas to get to the same place but it’s hard in text where we can’t perceive the emotion involved behind the words sometimes we see anger and attack where it doesn’t exist
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,369
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#66
right never call then out , of you care about the person do what Jesus said go privately to the person between just you and them not as an accuser but as a lovong brother trying to help them understand the inportsnce of the thing you feel God is telling you to help them understand

it’s not us calling out each other anymore dear brother , we have to forst love the sinner like Jesus did , we have to first be willing to pit thoer soul above our pride . My point has never been what you have to do I’m no one brother I’m imperfect probably more than others I suspect but that’s the point of it all God loves you even though your not perfect but he feels the same way about the person we are judging a sinner even as we acknowledge I’m a sinner too

we just aren’t supposed to call our people we’re supposed to try to help then hear the gospel and that’s enough to show then what their lord and savior said that’s what saves us. Either what Jesus had to say about things his jidgements are the light of the world so instead of me the sinner calling out you the sinner , shouldn’t I talk about the repentance Jesus talked about like repenting from the accusation part and start being a worker in the healing part ? The part that doesn’t drive us away from God but invites sinners close to Jesus so he can touch their heart so the his words of eternal Life

my own personal thoughts and beliefs brother is all I have my faith , so don’t think I’m trying to tell you what you have to think and do that’s not my point at all I’m trying to be. Enter in my own life very flawed but I’m trying to carry my cross md acknowledge my own sins with him and I personally can’t get past the part where I still have a pretty big bunch of mud on my eye and I’m aware perfectly of it so I personally me from my own perspective think it’s the right way but again that’s my own belief from hearing the lord others have to walk by what he’s told them

here’s benefit I’m not judging think of it brother even in a secular setting of you tell Ten people they are the one to keep the others in line , all ten are going to constantly bicker and point at the others when they all need to look in the mirror first tha the my whole point anything that promotes division isn’t worth it unless the person is actually teaching heresy

of the issue is one guy believes he needs to keep an ot ordinance ,like a sabbath day , the other guy knows better neither person is sinning or wrong and neither needs correction

but if one guy is having an affair nt I discover it as a brother I need to go to him because o care and know he’s headed down a bad road

of he keeps the sabbath TV on Saturday and I on Sunday ot I not at all no one needs to jidge the other

we need to make sure sin is sin first and also need to
Make sure we’re qualified to be judging thy says why I started the op to hopefully get someone to hear what Jesus said nt look forst at themself “ am I correcting people the right way ? For the right purpose ? Am I also just as needful of repentance in my own life as they ? Should I mention that as I’m trying to help them ? Or should it be me above and then below ? Me righteous then a sinner ? Is worthy to sit at his table and eat with him and they unworthy sinner?

I’m not making any accusation I’m trying to bring up the thought so people can consider “ I’m a meant to be judging ? What even is it to judge ? Can I be judgemental in how I look at others if o don’t speak ? Just a consideration not a seed for argument and contention even if someone totally disagrees it doesn’t mean we have to argue there’s value in stating the case and considering the other side and just letting it sit awhile

I hope there are no hard feelings , there aren’t towards you or anyone else for my part it’s just Christians who believe a lot in what’s hey know and sometimes we get a little hard hearted all of us me too but we can still work on getting better ourself and sharing the gospel thy ate just alllll what impersonally think
You missed the point.

How would you even come to the conclusion that you might have reason to "go to a brother privately?" What would lead you to such a consideration?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#67
You missed the point.

How would you even come to the conclusion that you might have reason to "go to a brother privately?" What would lead you to such a consideration?
Brother are you sure your not totally missing the point of what Jesus is saying and why I saying we need to go hear what the lord said do we know this stuff ? Here’s why

“Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭18:15-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so again you must be sort of missing that I’m saying if we send people to Jesus word about this stuff we can know the truth of it the question is are you willing to go hear what Jesus said about everything and accept that his judgement is correct?

that’s why I came to that forst step of going alone to the person

but now will we argue on because your point will be “ that’s only if someone sins against you “ if we’re going that route it’s not worth it
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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#68
Brother are you sure your not totally missing the point of what Jesus is saying and why I saying we need to go hear what the lord said do we know this stuff ? Here’s why

“Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭18:15-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so again you must be sort of missing that I’m saying if we send people to Jesus word about this stuff we can know the truth of it the question is are you willing to go hear what Jesus said about everything and accept that his judgement is correct?

that’s why I came to that forst step of going alone to the person

but now will we argue on because your point will be “ that’s only if someone sins against you “ if we’re going that route it’s not worth it
With respect, I can read, and I am quite sufficiently familiar with the text you quoted. Again, you have missed MY point. Now please answer my question instead of dodging it.

Here's my question again:

HOW would you know that your brother is at fault? By what thought process would you come to the conclusion that you might consider going to your brother in private?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#69
You missed the point.

How would you even come to the conclusion that you might have reason to "go to a brother privately?" What would lead you to such a consideration?
Carnality and hearing Moses law that taught then to observe the other peoples sins and ignore thier own

if you have some point you think I missed show the scriptures and then explain the point I missed I welcome that .

we should hear the judgement forst and believe so he can write it on our hearts

“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭18:21-

so it’s for less mature Christians that can’t forgive freely like we’re taught if someone insults me I actually shouldn’t go as far as gathering witnesses I should go to the person if I can’t get over it and there’s some bitterness and address it like brothers would

but the better way is to just give grace for peoples flaws and not take every offense people offer , we’re supposed to follow the example Jesus set for us and he didn’t go around pointing out the sinners sins he was rebuking the self righteous who judge the sinners though

But listen here is the point of the post to begin with I think might have gotten past you . read these verses and then ask yourself how obedient you are and if your perception and judgement is in line and if you want to partake of that heavy yoke or Christs that is light

“Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:38-45‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s Gods judgement for repentant sinners brother how does your life stack up to that word of Gods requirement ? Are you one who grasps and lives out the gospel or is there still some mud in your eyes too ?


It’s what Jesus said our everything for us , let’s talk about what Jesus had to say
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#70
With respect, I can read, and I am quite sufficiently familiar with the text you quoted. Again, you have missed MY point. Now please answer my question instead of dodging it.

Here's my question again:

HOW would you know that your brother is at fault? By what thought process would you come to the conclusion that you might consider going to your brother in private?
I wouldn’t I would be telling them about repentance and remission of sins and eternal Life in. Ot looking for your sins or anyone else’s I believe in sharing the gospel and letting Gid work our thier righteousness

I’m not going to discuss with you if you never acknowledge anything I say and demand I swear your question why wouldn’t you just tell
Me what you think your great point is ?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,369
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#71
Carnality and hearing Moses law that taught then to observe the other peoples sins and ignore thier own

if you have some point you think I missed show the scriptures and then explain the point I missed I welcome that .

we should hear the judgement forst and believe so he can write it on our hearts

“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭18:21-

so it’s for less mature Christians that can’t forgive freely like we’re taught if someone insults me I actually shouldn’t go as far as gathering witnesses I should go to the person if I can’t get over it and there’s some bitterness and address it like brothers would

but the better way is to just give grace for peoples flaws and not take every offense people offer , we’re supposed to follow the example Jesus set for us and he didn’t go around pointing out the sinners sins he was rebuking the self righteous who judge the sinners though

But listen here is the point of the post to begin with I think might have gotten past you . read these verses and then ask yourself how obedient you are and if your perception and judgement is in line and if you want to partake of that heavy yoke or Christs that is light

“Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:38-45‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s Gods judgement for repentant sinners brother how does your life stack up to that word of Gods requirement ? Are you one who grasps and lives out the gospel or is there still some mud in your eyes too ?


It’s what Jesus said our everything for us , let’s talk about what Jesus had to say
My point is in my question. Think through my question carefully.

Here's a directly related question: How would you come to the conclusion that you might need to forgive someone?

If your response is more than four lines long, or contains overly-large-font Scripture, YOU DON"T GET IT. Try again.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#72
With respect, I can read, and I am quite sufficiently familiar with the text you quoted. Again, you have missed MY point. Now please answer my question instead of dodging it.

Here's my question again:

HOW would you know that your brother is at fault? By what thought process would you come to the conclusion that you might consider going to your brother in private?
yeah I’m not sure you actually are reading though what is the miraculous point you think you have ?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,369
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#73
I wouldn’t I would be telling them about repentance and remission of sins and eternal Life in. Ot looking for your sins or anyone else’s I believe in sharing the gospel and letting Gid work our thier righteousness

I’m not going to discuss with you if you never acknowledge anything I say and demand I swear your question why wouldn’t you just tell
Me what you think your great point is ?
I see no need to acknowledge what you say, as my question is several posts back and you still haven't answered it.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,887
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#74
My point is in my question. Think through my question carefully.

Here's a directly related question: How would you come to the conclusion that you might need to forgive someone?

If your response is more than four lines long, or contains overly-large-font Scripture, YOU DON"T GET IT. Try again.

so you have no point and are looking to argue well your great point has gone totally missed by me , and I don’t converse folks with folks who try to control how and what I say so I think I’ll drop this one and let your wonderful point that’s hidden in your question go
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#75
I see no need to acknowledge what you say, as my question is several posts back and you still haven't answered it.
Okay so let’s end it here I’m good with that hope to have agreement at a later time on a different subject God bless
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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#76
Okay so let’s end it here I’m good with that hope to have agreement at a later time on a different subject God bless
Complete cop-out. It should take you about thirty seconds of focused attention to answer my question, and you seem incapable. I honestly don't think you have thought this matter through anywhere near adequately... and that's my final judgment.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
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#77
if you are still learning, you cant be a judge
even when you have finished learning and graduated, Jesus would rather you become a teacher rather than a judge lol.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,369
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#78
if you are still learning, you cant be a judge
even when you have finished learning and graduated, Jesus would rather you become a teacher rather than a judge lol.
Is there any among us who is not still learning? How then can anyone be a judge?

Where is Scripture does it say that Jesus would rather us become teachers than judges?
 

TheLearner

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Jan 14, 2019
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Brighton, MI
#79
I am sticking with mercy with people.

read to here because some reason the does not know the last post I read.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#80
I am sticking with mercy with people.

read to here because some reason the does not know the last post I read.
Yes inalso
Meant to tell you yesterday I had replied to one of your responses to
Me . But I ended up sending a reply I had made to another persons post me it seemed very backwards to your post .

sometimes if I start typing a response then decide not to send it , it ends up on my next reply to another person but I will read your posts and reply to the one I talking about