Do catholics worship God or the pope?
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My brother, have you ask to your mind, why Jesus never teach them to pray to Moses or Elisa?
My belief in this literally predates every single unique Post Reformation belief you hold. You’re entitled to your interpretation, but you’re 21st century opinion on the matter holds no weight with me. Brother there are no dead Christians. You’re either alive on earth or alive in heaven.
That’s like asking why God didn’t introduce himself to Adam and Eve as the God of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit. Only God knows why he says what he says or makes examples of some things and not of others.
Your belief is not supported biblically Ok, and I am not a reformer, I am a BIBLE-believing man of God, and IF what you hold to is not seen in the BIBLE, it is not Biblical. There is not "your opinion" and "my opinion", it is either the word of God or it is not. it is not your right and I'm wrong
If it does not say it in the Bible it is not true. Truth is all that matters not your feeling or your belief, Truth.
I wonder how these early Christians came to believe it if the Bible didn’t tell them? Could it be the Oral Tradition of the Church handed down through the apostles?
they had the word of Jesus they had the word of the Eyewitnesses and other eyewitnesses. They had and in its entirety the Old Testament which is the authoritative word of God. Your RCC's idea of praying to dead saints was not seen as right with God.
If you have any doubt of that I refer you to King Saul who taught the witch of Endor to summon's Samuel the Prophet who had died,
Which the law of God called an abomination. The God of the Bible is jealous and HE will deal with the pope's pastors and prophets who teach such things.
You can slice it dice it and even throw it out the window. You can bring up an old historical context, to dispute the word of God.
Here is why your argument is foolish right now If what you say about the Bible is true then you are asking us to trust men we don't even know who stole from the very Books of the Bible and now telling us what to believe.
In another word IF I can't trust the Bible Why in the world would I trust you and what you are saying if I can't use anything to substantiate the claim? That would make me a fool. Sorry, you are deceived.
No, some things cannot be shown to be "biblical," for whatever reason. But accepting the Bible is not a matter of Catholic authority, but rather, a matter of apostolic witness. Once the Bible is accepted for its apostolic authority, it becomes our Bible against which Catholic tradition must be weighed, and found either true or false.
A good part of the Church fell off the wagon during the Arian controversy, and at times when the Church, as a majority, was weak and compromised. We must hold onto apostolic truth, and not "Church truth." If we hold onto "Church truth," we will also hold onto errors accumulated over time. And that isn't good.
I don’t have access to all my stuff to quote them properly but...The Shepherd of Hermas is the first recorded Christian work that spoke about intercessory prayer. The first Church Fathers that wrote about intercession of the saints was St Clement of Alexandria in 207 and Cyprian of Carthage in 252.
We’re not the ones bound to Sola scriptura, you did that to yourself. God left us an authoritative church, the oral tradition of the apostles (also the word of god), and the scriptures. You choose to diminish the authority god gave his church and not believe the oral Tradition passed down through that church which Paul said we are to hold fast to.
If it the teaching of Jesus, why not in the gospel?
Early Christian?
Paul warn Christian church in Corinthian
1 for 6
8 Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers and sisters.
9. Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[a] 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Even when Paul alive cheating happen
Verse 8
There were without doubt heresies that the Church would be forced to put down but Jesus told us in Matthew that the gates of hell would not prevail against his Church. So his church would exist and prevail against heresies. There wasn’t even a recognized Canon to be Sola about for hundreds of years after Christ’s death.
this comment is a removal of the word of God and untrue The first recorded Christian work on prayer was the Lord Jesus Christ
WHEN the disciples and First pope as you like to say asked Jesus to teach them to Pray Found in the Gospel of Matthew chapter 6:8-13 and Luke 11:1-4
Jesus Christ is the final authority, not the Sheperd of Hermas but the Great Shepard, not st. Clement but the one who saved him the Lord Jesus Christ.
If you hold to the writing of those two people more than the writings scriptures of St Matthew and St. Luke who were eyewitnesses of the Lord Jesus Christ or were sitting under Peter and Paul who quoted the Lord Jesus you are in error and unbiblical.
Wrong !!!!!!! you ripped out the Old Testament right here in this thread and replaced the Shepard of Hermas and st. Clement over the Writings of the four Gospels. Which both those two said was the authoritative word of God. You are ridiculous. FYI the RCC is no the Church I will say it for you. they did not save you, your pope is not equal to Christ his words are not as powerful as the word of God from Genesis to Revelation. it's that simple. the RCC is apostate and leading millions to hell. Your pope is arrogant and foolish. And if anyone holds to the writings of the Shepard of Hermas over the Words of Christ on HOW to Pray has been deceived.